Wait, Saap, you like Satch? I had no idea!
Who are your Top 5 guitarists of all time
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Saapanael
Ancient Mariner
Old and new Satch both have their good times and bad times. There is a larger amount of below-average songs on the newer albums but also a larger amount of top-tier songs. I think he has evolved over his career, sometimes for the better, sometimes for the worse. Favourite album is still Crystal Planet, which lies somewhere in the middle of his career.
Thing is, Satch is much more than 'shred rock'. I understand that for many people, instrumentals with no singing get boring after some time, but in my opinion, he transmits all the important aspects of a voice through his guitar. He has emotional and melodical riffs, and true, often times shredding during the solo part, but that too is so smooth and on-point.
My 3 favourite Satch songs are currently Love Thing, Surfing with the Alien and The Crush of Love. The first is a slow, passionate, relaxed and utterly smooth song, produced so well that it leaves nothing else for me to desire in a song. Surfing is the opposite: a fast, screaming guitar piece that displays his more aggressive style: dive bombs, tapping etc. The third, Crush of Love, is the best example one can give to a person who hasn't heard Satch a lot (or at all). You have an incredibly emotional verse, a catchy chorus and, in the live version below, a perfect shred solo at the end. That legato is god-like, that technique irreplaceable. Give it a listen (the main song sounds a bit better on the studio version but this live version has the soul-piercing solo at the end (4:02). Also, this one is of not very good quality, because the original video has been taken down during the past week
.) :Another video that displays his true talent and variety in 10 minutes is the 2006 live version of Made of Tears that features almost every technique in the man's catalogue.
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CriedWhenBrucieLeft
Meme Only Account
Yip, totally agree. Instrumental guitarists really need a band, or at least tour with a band. Btw, stop calling it "shred" Mosh; you're driving me nuts!
--Satch is no shredder. Dave Murray can shred more than Satch can.
And: the guy just has no right hand.
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Saapanael
Ancient Mariner
Yes, this is played only with the left hand, takes immense precision and skill.
CriedWhenBrucieLeft
Meme Only Account
Saap, most guitarists of any quality have a good left hand; that's a given. I'm just saying, Satch is quite traditional in respect to his right-hand technique; he just doesn't use it much. The man's all legato. And that's lovely, but it's not all I want to hear in a guitarist personally. He is awesome though.
Saapanael
Ancient Mariner
It's true he isn't that much more noticeable with his right hand than most guitarists but I have to disagree about him being all legato. Most of his melodies are simple and picked. When it gets to soloing, he also has fast picked licks in addition to legato and tapping. Obviously, every guitarist can use their right hand but at that level, it comes down to perfecting that technique and through that, achieving a spectacular tone.
Satch is definitely not a guitarist known for his picking technique. Of course he's good at it, but when I think of players who are all about picking, I think Steve Morse, John Petrucci, and Al Di Meola. Those guys have insanely precise picking and it's very smooth. Satch belongs in the legato camp with players like Shawn Lane, Michael Romeo, or Tony MacAlpine. Satch has a strong right hand but it's a weak spot in comparison to his left IMO.
I love instrumental music. Whether or not a song has singing isn't very relevant to me. My problem is that Satch's music is more of a vehicle to showcase his playing abilities. I have this problem with a lot of guitarists I like who do that sort of thing, many of whom I mentioned in my first paragraph. It's fun stuff to learn and it can be impressive but musically it doesn't do a whole lot for me. I will grant you that he has a great voice and is able to emote well; most of what he does is very musical. But I don't find many of his melodies/riffs to be all that interesting. The grand exception I'll make is for Surfing With the Alien, which has some killer melodies.
I also like to hear musical chemistry within a band. I like to hear the musicians play off of each other and bring their personality in the mix. Obviously this is severely lacking in Satch's music.
Yea I guess Satch isn't technically a "shredder", though that term doesn't have much meaning for me. Even my Jazz friends will use that term but in that context it means something totally different than if a Rock/Metal fan used it. At this point "shred" is something I take to mean "impressive musical skills".
But yea I guess something like instrumental guitar driven rock would be better.
I love instrumental music. Whether or not a song has singing isn't very relevant to me. My problem is that Satch's music is more of a vehicle to showcase his playing abilities. I have this problem with a lot of guitarists I like who do that sort of thing, many of whom I mentioned in my first paragraph. It's fun stuff to learn and it can be impressive but musically it doesn't do a whole lot for me. I will grant you that he has a great voice and is able to emote well; most of what he does is very musical. But I don't find many of his melodies/riffs to be all that interesting. The grand exception I'll make is for Surfing With the Alien, which has some killer melodies.
I also like to hear musical chemistry within a band. I like to hear the musicians play off of each other and bring their personality in the mix. Obviously this is severely lacking in Satch's music.
Yip, totally agree. Instrumental guitarists really need a band, or at least tour with a band. Btw, stop calling it "shred" Mosh; you're driving me nuts!
--Satch is no shredder. Dave Murray can shred more than Satch can..
Yea I guess Satch isn't technically a "shredder", though that term doesn't have much meaning for me. Even my Jazz friends will use that term but in that context it means something totally different than if a Rock/Metal fan used it. At this point "shred" is something I take to mean "impressive musical skills".
But yea I guess something like instrumental guitar driven rock would be better.
CriedWhenBrucieLeft
Meme Only Account
The guys doesn't pick at all compared to other guitarists Saap; seriously look at Petrucci etc.
As Mosh says:
Totally agree with this. Although, as with all guitarist who choose not to play in a certain way (or not to showcase a particular technique), it doesn't necessarily equate to not possessing that skill. Maybe Satch can pick like a bastard. Don't see any evidence of it though.
This is what I miss most in Buckethead's music too.
Okay, I'll let you off with dropping the S-word inappropriately in this one case...Yea I guess Satch isn't technically a "shredder", though that term doesn't have much meaning for me. Even my Jazz friends will use that term but in that context it means something totally different than if a Rock/Metal fan used it. At this point "shred" is something I take to mean "impressive musical skills".
But yea I guess something like instrumental guitar driven rock would be better.
Oh yea definitely. Legato/alternate picking are just means of musical expression. I'd like to think that these are all well rounded musicians who spend time developing all kinds of different aspects of guitar playing, rather than focusing on a particular technique. To the contrary though, I've heard Tony MacAlpine play Petrucci stuff and when he gets to the alternate picked stuff it tends to be pretty sloppy. Petrucci on the other hand has had many moments of legato brilliance (see the instrumental stuff on In the Name of God).
Yep this is the biggest reason why I don't listen to Buckethead that often.
Saapanael
Ancient Mariner
I have never actually thought about it that way before, but it's probably true. However, that does not annoy me. If it doesn't suit you, fair enough, we have different tastes.
I can't agree with this though. It's quite the opposite for me, actually. I find Satch to be reserved when he needs to: calm and simple main melodies, as I said earlier. I realise that I may be blind to his faults because of the overwhelming good points I see in him but without a doubt, I have never thought that he tries to show off his abilities instead of composing a good song. It's fun to learn his stuff and it's at least as good to listen to him, imo. I don't admire him because of his raw talent as much as I admire him for what he can do with it.
This post is kind of incomplete, I am very tired. We can continue this tomorrow.
I'm not saying songwriting isn't his main focus, for all I know it could be. However, Satch's music is primarily a showcase for guitar. The other instruments aren't important and serve merely as a background to his guitar playing. That's fine if you like that sort of thing, but it isn't for me.
Saapanael
Ancient Mariner
That's true. The drums, bass etc are often kept simple for the purpose of backing the guitar in Satch's songs. One exception, though, I think was when he toured and made albums with Stu Hamm. His bass lines were interesting and "up there" with the guitar. Also, from time to time, the whole band seems to join in on those epic jam sessions, like the live version of Made of Tears I posted above.
Stardust
Rainmaker
Stardust's Top 5 Favourite Guitarists!
5: Dave Murray (Dave Murray will eat Adrian Smith)
4: Buckethead (But he ain't stupid, though)
3: Brian May (Brighton Rock is enough for me)
2: Ritchie Blackmore (Child In Time, Highway Star and Burn, the list goes on!)
1: Steve Hackett (Every Day and Spectral Mornings. Enough said)
5: Dave Murray (Dave Murray will eat Adrian Smith)
4: Buckethead (But he ain't stupid, though)
3: Brian May (Brighton Rock is enough for me)
2: Ritchie Blackmore (Child In Time, Highway Star and Burn, the list goes on!)
1: Steve Hackett (Every Day and Spectral Mornings. Enough said)
You're not really CriedWhenBrucieLeft are you, Stardust?
CriedWhenBrucieLeft
Meme Only Account
Why on earth would you say something like that, Brigs?
The love for Dave Murray and Buckethead.
CriedWhenBrucieLeft
Meme Only Account
And Brian May. I love Brian May.
CriedWhenBrucieLeft
Meme Only Account
And Genesis are pretty decent too...