USA Politics

I'm sorry about your mother, bearfan.

Thanks for the input, it's great to hear both sides. Most things I know about US health system come from Michael Moore's documentary Sicko, 2007. Pretty much demolishing.
About Canada, well my inputs are the above documentary which praises Canada and Canadians themselves that do the same thing.

I must check more thoroughly about some things you posted to can reply properly. You seem to have a reason though. My general approach regarding Health & Education is that everybody should have a decent access there. Everybody. But we should't eliminate the Private section & freedom of choice* by any means.

*The more I get older, the more I admire some American values. Healthy competition, innovation & meritocracy are some of them. Steve Jobs, Bill Gates, Larry Ellison. Could old Europe ever produce these people?
 
In general, I would not consider anything Michael Moore does as a documentary ... he clearly has an outcome/agenda in mind before he films anything and skews the film to get those results. I am not saying do not watch them, but I would take anything he (and those of his ilk) do with a serious grain of salt.
 
Sorry about your mom, Bearfan. I too, lost my mom to cancer. She was quickly diagnosed with terminal cancer seven or eight years ago here in Canada and treated immediately. As various treatments lost their effectiveness, they switched her to others and she lived most of the remainder of her life relatively pain-free until the end a little more than a year ago. Her treatment during her final two months, most of it in hospital, was also excellent in terms of access to care and meeting her needs, and the needs of our family. This cost us nothing beyond our regular health taxes.

Of course this is merely anecdotal.

In general terms, the Canadian system offers good, timely care to almost everyone at a reasonable cost.
However, I doubt it is as good as the American system at dealing with immediate care, or bad diagnoses.
If other people are sicker than you here, you will wait to see a doctor. If you aren't satisfied with your treatment, you can't walk down the street and immediately get a second opinion.

The major difference is in the States you can get the best treatment you can afford, as quickly as you can afford it. In Canada you get the best treatment the average citizen can afford, as quickly as we can get it to you. It's been my observation that the people who don't get treatment in time up here are the exception, not the rule.

EDIT: just to be clear, when I say the best treatment the average citizen can afford, I'm referring to the big chunk of the taxes paid by the healthy used to subsidized the sick. What I actually should have said is the best treatment your fellow taxpayers are willing to subsidize - which is generally pretty damn good.
 
I can't agree more with the Michael Moore comment. I dislike him, even if I often agree with him, because he's dishonest.

I also second mckindog's comment. A friend of mine who recently died was diagnosed extremely rapidly with medical care. He was originally from the USA and he, and his wife, both constantly commented that even though he was employed in the aerospace industry back in the USA, their health care would have been consumed by the needs of pancreatic cancer.

Anecdotes aren't evidence, though.
 
You better not send your kid to school wearing an army or marines shirt. Total F'ing BS!
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/201...-his-us-marines-t-shirt-it-was-too-offensive/


ObamaCare's 7 Tax Hikes On Under $250,000-A-Year Earners
http://onforb.es/XY323r

A List of Barack Obama's First Term Tax Increases
(Middle Class Americans Hit Hardest)
http://bit.ly/13kctBT
uGn2fiV.jpg
 
Who pointed you to this video Travis?

I have the idea that the organization (LaRouche movement) that produced this video is quite a controversial movement.
Even if Medvedev has said that, look how the people on your screen do their utmost best to make you afraid.

It's very one sided. The pauses, the repetitions, the statement of the everything but neutral LaRouche member (that person says it, thus it must be true!), the serious looks, the ticking clock at the end. It's all directed. With one aim: to make Obama as bad as possible. ("Dump Obama").

This kind of propaganda reminds me of Russian state media. No room for other another sound.
 
bearfan said:
Their coverage was in Canada, they paid out of pocket to see specialists in the US ... and had the follow up treatment in Canada (when needed). For example, my mother cut her hand and needed stitches, which would have been no problem here. There was some deal with the severity of the wound that made it a pain to get in Canada, so she went to the US and paid for it. She then got cancer and was having issues getting diagnosed properly (how much of this is the system versus just a bad doctor/hospital, I do not know), but she ended up coming to the US to get diagnosed. The bad part was the during the delay, it got worse and she ended up not making it Recently my Aunt got cancer and learning that lesson, came straight to the US for initial surgery and treatment and is did some follow up treatment in Canada and is fine now. So, my perception of Canadian health care is not very high as I think it is at least possibly to blame for the death of my mother.

A new trend in the US is going more towards an HSA health approach in private insurance, which I like a great deal and think will end up big savings and I like as a patient quite a bit. I wish this had started much early (I am in my 40s), for someone starting off, it makes a great deal of sense. Health Care reform should have been based more along those lines versus Obamacare, though Obamacare will end up pushing insurance in that direction as it is cheaper for employers, which is the main Obamacare benefit I see.
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We have a saying in my country, "Cada quien cuenta de la feria como le fue en ella." or "Everybody tells their own story of the county fair depending on their experience." roughly translated lol. I get the same thing here in the southwest of U.S v. Mexican doctors. A lot of people swear by their Mexican dentist; cheap, efficient just as good if not better care and bedside manners than in the U.S. Others, like an old friend from a previous job, HATES mexican doctors and insists they almost "killed" her father by misdiagnosing a "basic" illness. Having lived in both countries for a considerable amount of time (17 in Mexico and 12 in the U.S) I have seen all ends of the medical spectrum in both countries. All of my neurological care was free through the army hospital. Amazing doctors and free thanks to my dad being in the army, but HORRIBLE bedside manners. You're just a number. When my family was doing well we went to private hospitals equal to those here in the States. Private care is private care no matter what country. When we weren't doing so well I had to use our SS safety net and go to public healthcare and guess what? just like in the army: Free with the bedside manners of a miner. BUT I got taken care of. Walgreens and CVS here in the States have urgent cares called Take Care Clinics and Minute Clinics respectively, they take insurance or out of pocket cost. Farmacias del Ahorro in Mexico also have said clinics... for FREE. And the meds are INSANELY cheaper in Mexico. I've been to the public health system here in the states, at least in Tucson, AZ it is certain hours on certain days... three cheers to accessibility!

Here in the states you shell out thousands to insurances, because meds are costly and do to being a lawsuit happy country so is medical care since doctors have to have malpractice insurance.

Insurances are a mafia here in the U.S, they are more than happy to take your money, but have countless restrictions and conditions on both the actual contract and the famous "hidden fees" and "fine print."

I prefer the Mexican system by far.
 
Forostar said:
Who pointed you to this video Travis?

I have the idea that the organization (LaRouche movement) that produced this video is quite a controversial movement.
Even if Medvedev has said that, look how the people on your screen do their utmost best to make you afraid.

It's very one sided. The pauses, the repetitions, the statement of the everything but neutral LaRouche member (that person says it, thus it must be true!), the serious looks, the ticking clock at the end. It's all directed. With one aim: to make Obama as bad as possible. ("Dump Obama").

This kind of propaganda reminds me of Russian state media. No room for other another sound.
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A friend of mine of Facebook posted it.

I'm glad they're making me afraid. We should be afraid for the future of this country because it doesn't look like it's headed in a very good direction.

I'm all for impeaching Obama. Again, I don't like the direction he's taking this country in and I feel it's only going to get worse as long as he's president.

While it may be propaganda, it's also a good warning and wake up call about the future and the possibility of a nuclear attack which really scares me.
 
Yeah...I really don't know what to say there. Obama increased taxes on tobacco. Whoop-de-fucking-do!
 
Forostar said:
Who pointed you to this video Travis?

I have the idea that the organization (LaRouche movement) that produced this video is quite a controversial movement.
Even if Medvedev has said that, look how the people on your screen do their utmost best to make you afraid.

It's very one sided. The pauses, the repetitions, the statement of the everything but neutral LaRouche member (that person says it, thus it must be true!), the serious looks, the ticking clock at the end. It's all directed. With one aim: to make Obama as bad as possible. ("Dump Obama").

This kind of propaganda reminds me of Russian state media. No room for other another sound.
Click to expand...
When I googled this story I got a lot of Christian propaganda websites with things like "end times" in the title. I think it's safe to say that this isn't anything to take seriously. Plus the video made little sense in the first place.
 
Mosh said:
When I googled this story I got a lot of Christian propaganda websites with things like "end times" in the title. I think it's safe to say that this isn't anything to take seriously. Plus the video made little sense in the first place.
Click to expand...
It's probably not too much to worry about then.
 
Travis, perhaps try looking at reason.com ... it is a political site with a libertarian focus/bent, However they present news in a pretty fair manner and generally avoid sensationalism/straw men. I generally stay away from blatent partisan sites, but this one is well done.
 
Glad you like it, it is an interesting site .. however I would suggest if you find an article that you feel strongly about, I would still double/triple check it against other sources and/or find counter arguments.

It's always worth hearing the other side (if not spending more time reading that than what you agree with), it may bring some nuance to an issue, perhaps modify your position, prepare yourself for counter arguments, or possibly strenghten your conviction for your original position.
 
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