Official Football Thread

As a guy who didn't know who Edin Dzeko was until I mentioned his name, that remark sounds quite funny to me.

Tell me, which elite team plays with one central midfielder? Noone. Because it doesn't make any sense.

Edit: You argued with my statement saying Strootman isn't a defensive midfielder with that Wiki article, yet it even it says that he's used as a box-to-box midfielder or a deep-lying midfielder. Both box-to-box midfielders and deep-lying midfielders play with a defensive midfielder on their side. (e.g. Lampard with Ramires, Gerrard with Lucas, Ramsey-Wilshere with Flamini, Yaya Toure with Fernandinho) Yaya Toure is possibly one of the best defensive midfielders in the game, yet, even he starts with a defensive midfielder on his side. I assume all these managers have "no clue about their players" either.
 
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The Flash said:
Do you think Kevin Strootman is superman, Foro?
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In a way yes.

By the way:
...
While he is capable defensively, the main benefit of signing Strootman to United would come in terms of his attacking output. None of United’s current central midfield players created more than 28 chances last season, with Carrick topping the tally. Fellaini provided just five, with Fletcher also in single figures (seven) and Cleverley on ten.

Strootman, on the other hand, provided 47 chances for Roma last season, including six assists. United’s midfield currently looks good defensively, but is lacking going forward.

An average of 2.11 chances per game created, over five times Fellaini’s, means that Strootman would provide that. He also scored five goals last season, more than double the combined efforts of a United midfield that saw Carrick and Cleverley net one each and the rest end the season goalless. ...
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I've seen Strootman play countless times, Foro. And not only in Roma, either. I'd appreciate it if you care about my latest post.

Your latest quote further strengthens my point. You can't win titles only concentrating on offense. It doesn't work like that.
 
http://www.squawka.com/news/manchester-united-eye-up-mats-hummels-as-replacement-for-ri/110100

Manchester United are eying up a move for Borussia Dortmund defender Mats Hummels as they look to replace the departing Rio Ferdinand, according to the Metro.

Ferdinand announced this week he will be leaving Manchester United and with centre-back partner Nemanja Vidic also leaving the club, United will have to act quickly to bring in appropriate reinforcements.

First on their list is Mats Hummels who has been highly-sought after by a number of clubs in recent seasons. The colossal defender has been one of the stand-out performers in Europe in recent years and the German international could be set for the exit door in the summer.

A number of individuals at Dortmund have their future up in the air and Hummels is one of those who seems set to leave the club in the summer transfer window.

The 25-year-old helped his side reach the Champions League final last season, but Jurgen Klopp’s men have failed to build on that success this season, ending the campaign trophy-less and with various poor performances across the year.

Hummels is valued in the region of £25 million, but Ed Woodward, chief executive of Manchester United, is ready to provide a substantial amount of money for the next manager.

- - - - -

Only concentrating on offense? No way.
 
I'm done with this argument. You honestly have no clue what you're talking about. I'm glad you're not handling any football club, that's all. Leaning on one or two players on defense will crush your team defense. Bayern leaned on Boateng and Dante by not playing Javi Martinez (defensive midfielder) along with their box-to-box midfielder (Schweinsteiger) and deep-lying midfielder (Kroos) against Real, they got torched 4-0.

You argued with my statement saying Strootman isn't a defensive midfielder with that Wiki article, yet it even it says that he's used as a box-to-box midfielder or a deep-lying midfielder. Both box-to-box midfielders and deep-lying midfielders play with a defensive midfielder on their side. (e.g. Lampard with Ramires, Gerrard with Lucas, Ramsey-Wilshere with Flamini, Yaya Toure with Fernandinho) Yaya Toure is possibly one of the best defensive midfielders in the game, yet, even he starts with a defensive midfielder on his side. I assume all these managers have "no clue about their players" either.
Click to expand...

You didn't even pay attention to this.
 
As Flash said, box-to-box midfielders are almost always paired with pure defensive midfielders, "destroyers". Van Gaal isn't crazy to field a 4-1-3-2 formation with only one of the 5 attackers contributing defensively (Rooney). It could only work if he had wingers who have high defensive work rate, like Bale or El Shaarawy, and maybe Kroos as CAM. Either way, he prefers 4-3-3, so I don't know why we're discussing this at all. Strootman would be perfect as LCM or RCM in the midfield trio but not as DM or anchor.

Also, I definitely wouldn't replace a proven right back Rafael with Janmaat.
 
Wait a minute, isn't Janmaat the right back of Oranje? I think that very much defines "proven right back"...
 
Sure.

If you're addressing the issue with Foro, though, even Hulk (not the player, the green one) can't save that team's defense.
 
Looking at this picture again:

Is this 4-3-3?
If yes, then why is that a system to be torched? Because Mata plays before Strootman? In defending position, there could be still 5 defenders if you count Strootman. As we know he also defends. How is that idea so fruitless? It also depends on how it is done. How the people move etc.
649982.jpg
 
I'll admit I haven't seen Janmaat play; however, Rafael has the experience and there are far important spots to fix in the team than the right back one.
 
Still the same team, Foro. 5 defenders isn't enough to deal with elite teams. You have to play team defense to survive in today's game. Hell, Real Madrid has the purest offense players there is, but they play amazing team defense because of the work rate of their attackers and midfielders. That possible Manu team lacks the work rate.
 
Let's say Manu did acquire all those players.

999243_Manchester_United.jpg


I'd field the team like this. Signing a defensive midfielder is a must for United. If it becomes too expensive, they can leave Müller and put the money on the defensive midfielder instead.
 
And what if these Jones and Hummel dots were placed more concentrated (Jones moves to right and Hummel moves to left)?
Two men in the Strootman's back. Is there really no team that plays like this anymore?
 
Wouldn't make any difference, really. Let me break it down (like a football nerd):

A box-to-box player constantly moves up and down the pitch. When he heads to the opponent's box, he leaves the midfield vulnerable to counter attacks. Even if the centre backs collapse on the attacker, an elite team can always find a way to beat them on the counter. (see: the third goal in Bayern vs. Real game. Kroos played like an attacking midfielder all game long. Whenever Schweinsteiger moved up the pitch, it all came down to Dante and Boateng. And they couldn't stop the counter.)

If a defensive midfielder plays on the side of the box-to-box player, whenever the box-to-box player heads upfield, he can stay there and disturb the offensive players on the counter. But even an elite defensive midfielder can't stop the counter with two centre backs. Now, here's the key to this strategy. No manager expects his defensive midfielder to stop the counter, but he expects him to slow down the counter. That leads to not only the centre backs, but right and left backs to collapse on the counter attacking players, creating havoc on the defense, which leads to the counter breaking down and a start of a set play.
 
I'd field this:
999251_Manchester_United.jpg

Carvalho is a hard tackling defensive midfielder. Strootman box-to-box. Cerci and Rooney are fast players, both track back and can play as wingers, CAM's or strikers. Mata stays up front to create attacks, Van Persie converts the chances.
 
In which teams did Strootman have a defensive midfielder behind/with him? How does it go in Roma?

Flash, the Bayern system worked in the German competition. Madrid is the best team of the world, they don't play in the PL either. ;)
The Man U system could work in the PL, especially if you have better defenders than Bayern.
 
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