Why did Steve Harris fire Clive Burr ?

It is far more likely that Harris pointed him at what to do. If you want to compare, stylistically. All I was ever saying is that Clive might've been stubborn and hang on to what he feels fits the song, while Nicko listened to Harris downright to actually working on the development of the technique to play the songs.
 
Zare said:
It is far more likely that Harris pointed him at what to do. If you want to compare, stylistically. All I was ever saying is that Clive might've been stubborn and hang on to what he feels fits the song, while Nicko listened to Harris downright to actually working on the development of the technique to play the songs.
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I think you have a point there, I just didn't think your example was well picked to illustrate.
 
Nicko's playing is one of the main things that makes Maiden unique.

Most metal drummers play very straightforward. They can be fast and technical, but they still pretty much stick to a straight beat with very little variation.

Nicko is not like that. I'm not saying he is the absolute best drummer there is (though he is very good), but he very rarely plays a straight beat, instead doing a lot of little variations and accents, thus making the beat a lot more interesting and unique. I just love his ghost notes and long fills, and you can really hear his jazz/fusion background. The only drummer that, in my opinion, comes close in style is Gar Samuelson of Megadeth. RIP.
 
Zare said:
No it is just a stylistic choice mostly used by Metallica, so it was for example.



No it has not much to do with the quality of what Clive does, it could have something to do with Harris wanting something other and Clive not going by it. From this perspective McBrain is far more professional and used to keeping on with the demands of the bassist because he was a session drummer. A session drummer does not have choice in what he plays, bottom line.



Of course not :) But you also know that I know 99% of Maiden's material ever recorded in any way, by heart. So I strongly presume my statement is correct. Also, I have never seen anyone back up the claim that Burr was technically on McBrain level either. I mean if someone here says Smith is technically on Malmsteen level I'd expect to see some continuous fast sweep arpeggios, not the talk how his music fits the genre better.



Bruce is an Ian Paice kind of a guy. Clive is an Ian Paice kind of a guy ;)
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In The Apparition, during the verses, Steve is going so fast that Nicko does not follow him. Nicko rather follows the guitar (it can be argued that the guitars follow parts of the bass as well, but I mean that the drums are more in unison with what the guitars do than with the bass.

It can be interesting to see what drums do when guitars and bass follow different (in rhythm) paths. I'll see if there are more examples.
 
I don't know who is better between Clive and Nicko, but firing Clive turned out to be a better decision for Maiden because he didn't live for too long (unfortunately) while Nicko is still playing decently even in 2018.
 
Regarding the intro to Where Eagles Dare, didn't Steve want a drum intro and Nicko hit every drum he had in his kit and Steve went "No, I want it more like this (I think he played it on his knees or something) and then Nicko came up with the intro we now have? I seem to recall I read that somewhere.
 
Poto said:
Regarding the intro to Where Eagles Dare, didn't Steve want a drum intro and Nicko hit every drum he had in his kit and Steve went "No, I want it more like this (I think he played it on his knees or something) and then Nicko came up with the intro we now have? I seem to recall I read that somewhere.
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Same story for me. That's Steve telling that, in the Early Days DVD I think. This Bruce story came as a surprise.
 
Poto said:
Regarding the intro to Where Eagles Dare, didn't Steve want a drum intro and Nicko hit every drum he had in his kit and Steve went "No, I want it more like this (I think he played it on his knees or something) and then Nicko came up with the intro we now have? I seem to recall I read that somewhere.
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From the Commentary:
Steve mentioned to Nicko that they needed some kind of drum intro. Nicko was still kind of nervous, being the new kid on the block and all, but he stayed in working almost all day on a drum intro for the song. At the end of the day, he had a little 6-7-second thing that entailed hitting basically every piece of his kit, going from small tom to big tom, like a kind of ending to a song - and then jumped into the chorus. The next day, Nicko played it for Steve and Steve went "no ... no ... no ... nothing like that ... just something simple like rat-tat-tat-tat ... rat-tat-tat-tat (you get the idea)". Steve tried to play something on Nicko's kit, but he's about as good at that as his grandmother would be ... Nicko said "oh ... you mean like this?" and played it. "That's it!" replied Steve. And "it" became this brilliant technical piece we all know.
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http://www.ironmaidencommentary.com/?url=album04_pom/commentary04_pom&lang=eng&link=albums#track1
 
There's no way Steve played something on Nicko's kit to show him what he meant....If you watch the spoof Wasted Years video in which the entire band swaps instruments, Steve can barely hold the sticks, let alone play a beat.
 
SixesAlltheway said:
There's no way Steve played something on Nicko's kit to show him what he meant....If you watch the spoof Wasted Years video in which the entire band swaps instruments, Steve can barely hold the sticks, let alone play a beat.
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Yes but they were deliberately mucking about that time. We know for example that Bruce is considerably more competent with a guitar than he demonstrates on that particular occasion. I'm sure Steve could hit tubs with sticks well enough to give Nicko a general idea of what he meant, even if he's not competent enough to make a living from it ...
 
Honestly, Steve looks so uncomfortable sitting behind that kit that I seriously doubt that he was just mucking about. If you have any knowledge about drumming you'll see that he really looks like he has no idea whatsoever about what he's doing and I don't think he's faking that just for the sake of the video. If Steve managed to show Nicko how to play Where Eagles Dare intro, I'm sure we can give all the credit to Nicko for being an awesome listener. Perpaps Steve was whistling while trying to hit the tubs to the best of his abilities ;)
 
harrisdevot said:
Well, Nicko actually said that Steve tried to play the thing for him, so...
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Nicko also said it was completely incomprehensible to him and he had to teach him the basics before Steve could really even attempt to do it, IIRC. He talked about it recently when he showed up at his drum shop when it opened last year to play the song on his SoT kit.
 
harrisdevot said:
Same story for me. That's Steve telling that, in the Early Days DVD I think. This Bruce story came as a surprise.
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If I remember correctly, Nicko did mention Bruce's input at the opening of his Drum One shop. I will see if I can find the clip I posted about this.

Edit: Found it!

Nicko's explanation of how the Where Eagles Dare drum fill came to be, talking briefly about Bruce's involvement (the explanation begins at 6:28):

 
You guys underestimate how easy is to play a basic beat on the drums - as easy as playing two chords on the guitar. Harris for surely knows that, and actually the gist of the intro is playable with two hands and accents only, on a single drum, marching style.
 
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