People are posting guitar and keyboard of covers Sagan (the bonus track)) already. I prefer it to Elan, truth be told. Still lots of those pipes, though.
Nightwish
- Thread starter MrKnickerbocker
- Start date
Forostar
Ancient Mariner
Tuomas Holopainen commented: “The long awaited NIGHTWISH music video 'Élan' is finally here. Inspired by the untold stories of abandoned places around Finland, the video was nearly a year in the making and features some of the most loved Finnish actors and actresses. And also the legendary NIGHTWISH symbol, a snowy owl (Bubo Scandiaca in Latin) called "Urho" ("Braveheart").“
Both songs are very cool and super catchy. I understand some people who expected more power metal and operatic vocals, but this is just the first single... Just look at their other singles and see how they aren't representative of whole albums.
The vocals are fine, but I'd like to see what they do with the album as a whole. I'm not 100% on those pipes dominating the music, it could quickly become gimmicky if they overdo it. I'd like to see them use a range of traditional instruments instead.
Someone I know has just tried to buy seated tickets for the Wembley Arena gig, and there are hardly any left from original source. They're going up on the secondary sales market for £75, when the face value is £29.
Maybe mass ticket touting in music events is much more serious than I thought, particularly for London shows. Standing is £40.
Someone I know has just tried to buy seated tickets for the Wembley Arena gig, and there are hardly any left from original source. They're going up on the secondary sales market for £75, when the face value is £29.
Maybe mass ticket touting in music events is much more serious than I thought, particularly for London shows. Standing is £40.
Ladies and gents, I'm going to see Nightwish. 
MrKnickerbocker
clap hands
I still really love Élan. It's catchy as hell, especially after a few listens. I already know how powerful Floor's voice can be, so it's actually nice to hear something with more restraint come out of her.
Not sure on Sagan yet. The music is cool, but kinda stock. It sounds a little jumbled, creatively. Makes sense that it's a b-side.
Not sure on Sagan yet. The music is cool, but kinda stock. It sounds a little jumbled, creatively. Makes sense that it's a b-side.
What do the words in bold mean?
Travis The Dragon
AFTERGLOW!!!
Instrumentally, the new song is great. But Floor's vocals sound like every dime a dozen female metal singer out there. It's too bad there was bad chemistry with Tarja and the band because it was her opera style vocals that really made this band stick out.
Dude, how can this sound like "every dime a dozen female metal singer out there" to you?
Meh. Her vocals were always average, it's just that she was the first (popular) opera vocal in metal that made her well-known. For me, Nightwish is all about keyboards/Tuomas.
MrKnickerbocker
clap hands
Everything NP said. Dark Passion Play is my favorite album by Nightwish, even though Anette is not very good. The reason is Tuomas.
Forostar
Ancient Mariner
Hold on. Travis said her vocals sound average on there, so I assume he meant on these songs. And yes, I don't find them that special either on these songs.
It's all about the melodies. And I do not think that Floors voice adds that much to them. This single is of the type of short mid tempo singles, like Ever Dream and Nemo, which I both find better than Élan.
Tarja's voice is quite unique in metal. Just that she was one of the first popular opera vocal singers doesn't mean that her vocals are not special.
In fact, I think that these new songs would have been perfect for Tarja's voice as well. I am curious for the other songs and then we really might see Floors own strengths.
Well her vocals are pretty bad when you compare them to the voices of real opera singers. That's what I meant.
Okay, omdat takes a few twists in my brain paths to associate with the German.
Thanks.
Forostar
Ancient Mariner
Aha, didn't get it, Night Prowler. But she is a real opera singer (she has done "normal" opera as well). 
I looked it up in an Etymological dictionary (in Dutch language) which mentions some 13th century constructions:
omdat vgw. ‘aangezien, om reden dat’
Mnl. ombe dat dat en ombe dat (ook om(me)) ‘opdat, omdat’ in Ombe dat [hi] moge weten huo ...; so stat hier achter ... gescreuen ‘opdat hij zal weten hoe ..., staat hierachter geschreven ...’ [1236; VMNW], ombe dat dat si ... sin sculdech tehoude der stade uerde ‘omdat ze de vrede in de stad moeten handhaven’ [1237; VMNW], ombe dat arnout de smet hadde en wif ‘omdat Arnoud de Smid een vrouw had’ [1257; VMNW], omdat dat dese dinch vast soude blieuen ... so seghelden wi dese littren ‘opdat deze zaak vast zou staan, verzegelden wij deze brief’ [1264; VMNW].
Verkorting van mnl. omme dat dat ‘om die reden, dat’, uit het voorzetsel → om (mnl. ombe, omme, om) en het aanwijzend voornaamwoord resp. voegwoord → dat.
Mhd. umbe daz ‘opdat’.
Mnl. omme dat betekent in eerste instantie ‘om dat’, dus ‘om die reden’, zoals in ende omme dat Die felle uiant ... heft geuenset eenen raet ‘en daarom heeft de boosaardige duivel een list bedacht’ [1265-70; VMNW]. In combinatie met dat en een bijzin kreeg het de betekenis ‘omdat’ (bijzin in de indicatief) of ‘opdat’ (bijzin in de conjunctief). Ook explicietere combinaties kwamen voor, zoals omme dat sake dat. Door verkorting ontstond hieruit de voegwoordelijke combinatie om(me) dat ‘opdat, omdat’. Alle genoemde constructies komen in beide betekenissen al in de 13e eeuw voor. De eerstgenoemde, bijwoordelijke betekenis raakte in het Middelnederlands verouderd. Met het verdwijnen van de conjunctief uit het algemene taalgebruik raakte ook de betekenis ‘opdat’ verouderd. De aaneengeschreven vorm omdat komt ook al sinds de 13e eeuw voor, maar werd pas in de Nieuwnederlandse periode de gewone vorm.
Het onderscheid tussen een oorzaakaanduidend doordat en een redengevend omdat is pas rond 1860 kunstmatig opgelegd, zie → doordat.
Also:
Middel High German:
umbe daz ‘opdat’. which means "so" or "so that"
Hehe, yeah. The word seems as if it has a German ring to it, but its use might be awkward indeed.Okay, omdat takes a few twists in my brain paths to associate with the German.
I looked it up in an Etymological dictionary (in Dutch language) which mentions some 13th century constructions:
omdat vgw. ‘aangezien, om reden dat’
Mnl. ombe dat dat en ombe dat (ook om(me)) ‘opdat, omdat’ in Ombe dat [hi] moge weten huo ...; so stat hier achter ... gescreuen ‘opdat hij zal weten hoe ..., staat hierachter geschreven ...’ [1236; VMNW], ombe dat dat si ... sin sculdech tehoude der stade uerde ‘omdat ze de vrede in de stad moeten handhaven’ [1237; VMNW], ombe dat arnout de smet hadde en wif ‘omdat Arnoud de Smid een vrouw had’ [1257; VMNW], omdat dat dese dinch vast soude blieuen ... so seghelden wi dese littren ‘opdat deze zaak vast zou staan, verzegelden wij deze brief’ [1264; VMNW].
Verkorting van mnl. omme dat dat ‘om die reden, dat’, uit het voorzetsel → om (mnl. ombe, omme, om) en het aanwijzend voornaamwoord resp. voegwoord → dat.
Mhd. umbe daz ‘opdat’.
Mnl. omme dat betekent in eerste instantie ‘om dat’, dus ‘om die reden’, zoals in ende omme dat Die felle uiant ... heft geuenset eenen raet ‘en daarom heeft de boosaardige duivel een list bedacht’ [1265-70; VMNW]. In combinatie met dat en een bijzin kreeg het de betekenis ‘omdat’ (bijzin in de indicatief) of ‘opdat’ (bijzin in de conjunctief). Ook explicietere combinaties kwamen voor, zoals omme dat sake dat. Door verkorting ontstond hieruit de voegwoordelijke combinatie om(me) dat ‘opdat, omdat’. Alle genoemde constructies komen in beide betekenissen al in de 13e eeuw voor. De eerstgenoemde, bijwoordelijke betekenis raakte in het Middelnederlands verouderd. Met het verdwijnen van de conjunctief uit het algemene taalgebruik raakte ook de betekenis ‘opdat’ verouderd. De aaneengeschreven vorm omdat komt ook al sinds de 13e eeuw voor, maar werd pas in de Nieuwnederlandse periode de gewone vorm.
Het onderscheid tussen een oorzaakaanduidend doordat en een redengevend omdat is pas rond 1860 kunstmatig opgelegd, zie → doordat.
Also:
Middel High German:
umbe daz ‘opdat’. which means "so" or "so that"
MrKnickerbocker
clap hands
For those questioning Élan as the first single...so did Tuomas! We have Marco and Troy to thank for it.
Forostar
Ancient Mariner
On February 12, FaceCulture conducted an interview with Nightwish singer Floor Jansen. (see below)
Asked if she missed being involved in the songwriting process during the making of Nightwish's new album, "Endless Forms Most Beautiful", Floor said: "No. This was [my] first time to really work on an album from scratch, written by mainly Tuomas, and Marco as well. 'This is the vocal line. This is the lyric. Go ahead.' But I feel so fortunate to work people who can write songs like they can, and have that typical Nightwish sound. One thing that connects all the eras of Nightwish is that particular sound. Then my little ego is just fine with saying, 'I don't have to write for this. This is gonna be awesome anyway.' And it is. That doesn't mean that there is no creative input from me whatsoever. 'Cause there you have the piano playing the vocal line and those lyrics, there is a certain phrasing you can do that Tuomas had in mind — like how the words have to be divided on the melodies — but then it becomes a vocal puzzle, where my creative input comes in: 'I can sing it like this, I can sing it like that.'"
She continued: "I've been trying a couple of things out at home. But then we went into the rehearsal studios and we actually took quite some time to rehearse the songs and really go through and through and through everything, which gave me the time to really get things into my system and to work together at getting those songs right, playing with the vocal possibilities. 'Should we give it the rock vibe, or should it be a little more poppy? At least not too edgy? Or could we throw in some opera here?' It was a nice puzzle to make, where everybody, as an equal, came in with ideas and went through the whole song, finishing, arranging the songs. We all really had our input there, which is, I think, part of the reason why this album also gives a bit more of a band vibe into the sound. It's not as orchestral, even though it's very much there still. But it's a band effort there that shines through, and that, for me, felt very natural coming out of a position where I'm usually more involved in the songwriting."
Asked if she felt an itch to come up with her own ideas during the making of the new Nightwish album, Floor said: "Not really, because the creative input I had to offer was still there. So I didn't feel like, 'Now I need to go home and write something just because I couldn't do it in this.' Even though every once in a while ideas pop up and I record some ideas. But I really didn't feel like I was missing out on anything being involved in this album."
And here a recent FaceCulture interview with Tuomas about thinking through evidence, being a science freak, the magic of reality, the album title, the origin of species changing in life, the American poet Walt Whitman, living life to the fullest and leaving the planet a better place, dealing with delicate and big themes, this being the least personal Nightwish album, Richard Dawkins, the replacing of Jukka and working with Floor in the recording process for the first time.
Asked if she missed being involved in the songwriting process during the making of Nightwish's new album, "Endless Forms Most Beautiful", Floor said: "No. This was [my] first time to really work on an album from scratch, written by mainly Tuomas, and Marco as well. 'This is the vocal line. This is the lyric. Go ahead.' But I feel so fortunate to work people who can write songs like they can, and have that typical Nightwish sound. One thing that connects all the eras of Nightwish is that particular sound. Then my little ego is just fine with saying, 'I don't have to write for this. This is gonna be awesome anyway.' And it is. That doesn't mean that there is no creative input from me whatsoever. 'Cause there you have the piano playing the vocal line and those lyrics, there is a certain phrasing you can do that Tuomas had in mind — like how the words have to be divided on the melodies — but then it becomes a vocal puzzle, where my creative input comes in: 'I can sing it like this, I can sing it like that.'"
She continued: "I've been trying a couple of things out at home. But then we went into the rehearsal studios and we actually took quite some time to rehearse the songs and really go through and through and through everything, which gave me the time to really get things into my system and to work together at getting those songs right, playing with the vocal possibilities. 'Should we give it the rock vibe, or should it be a little more poppy? At least not too edgy? Or could we throw in some opera here?' It was a nice puzzle to make, where everybody, as an equal, came in with ideas and went through the whole song, finishing, arranging the songs. We all really had our input there, which is, I think, part of the reason why this album also gives a bit more of a band vibe into the sound. It's not as orchestral, even though it's very much there still. But it's a band effort there that shines through, and that, for me, felt very natural coming out of a position where I'm usually more involved in the songwriting."
Asked if she felt an itch to come up with her own ideas during the making of the new Nightwish album, Floor said: "Not really, because the creative input I had to offer was still there. So I didn't feel like, 'Now I need to go home and write something just because I couldn't do it in this.' Even though every once in a while ideas pop up and I record some ideas. But I really didn't feel like I was missing out on anything being involved in this album."
And here a recent FaceCulture interview with Tuomas about thinking through evidence, being a science freak, the magic of reality, the album title, the origin of species changing in life, the American poet Walt Whitman, living life to the fullest and leaving the planet a better place, dealing with delicate and big themes, this being the least personal Nightwish album, Richard Dawkins, the replacing of Jukka and working with Floor in the recording process for the first time.
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