Nicko McBrain

Zare said:
God no.

"I had the lyrics and melodies all worked out"

Dickinson would never write such a piece of crap.
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Is it the subject matter of the lyrics that you think are crap or the lyrics as a whole?

Obviously, I don't agree with the religious clap trap in the lyrics but I think the ideas he has are expressed succinctly and are pretty good for a guy's first attempt at lyric writing. This probably is due to Bruce editing them.
 
Ruflux said:
I've heard it also has contributions from Steve but he didn't want his name on there since I assume he thought it would've diluted from Nicko's first Maiden songwriting attempt. Or something like that, anyway. For all I know he was too busy to contribute to it and so Bruce and Adrian helped Nicko hammer out the final song.

Anyway, the lyrics are very obviously not by Bruce. Just consider what the song is even about, for one thing.
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Yeah, I think Steve or someone else had said that although Gangland is credited to Smith/Burr, the name of Clive was added because of the drum intro.

On the other hand, Total Eclipse is credited to Harris/Murry/Burr - I think Dave never had written lyrics for a song, the music is Steve and probably the lyrics too, but what is the role of Clive on that song....
 
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srfc said:
Is it the subject matter of the lyrics that you think are crap or the lyrics as a whole?

Obviously, I don't agree with the religious clap trap in the lyrics but I think the ideas he has are expressed succinctly and are pretty good for a guy's first attempt at lyric writing. This probably is due to Bruce editing them.
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No, actually the subject is pretty interesting, and as much criticism came from Commentary it went from medical progress angle, I think that's a bit misplaced because artificial life has never been achieved, so this is a valid science fiction question, and not a thing of medicine (yet). The song itself is very basic - saved from being bad by good delivery from Dickinson and that bridge and solo from Smith. Stylistically I think the lyrics are crap. In the first verse, McBrain tries to describe some sort of a freak of nature and technology, fails to depict anything particular in my head. After that single verse he goes on to rumble how that thing is essentially bad, via the means of general philosophical metaphors. But I don't have anything imagined.

Overall I don't rate this song bad by Maiden standards, just average.
 
GhostofCain said:
If I remember correctly, Adrian wrote the instrumental break and Bruce changed a couple of things in the lyrics so they flew better.
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When a song is credited, for example, Smith/Dickinson - the first wrote the music and the second wrote the lyrics, right ?

But when a song is credited to more than two members, for example, Harris/Smith/Dickinson - the first wrote the music and the second and third the lyrics, or the third just arranged the song ? Is that right ?
 
Kalata said:
When a song is credited, for example, Smith/Dickinson - the first wrote the music and the second wrote the lyrics, right ?

But when a song is credited to more than two members, for example, Harris/Smith/Dickinson - the first wrote the music and the second and third the lyrics, or the third just arranged the song ? Is that right ?
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It depends. Take for instance 'Can I Play with Madness', credited to Smith/Dickinson/Harris. Adrian and Bruce wrote most of the song and Steve added the break in the middle. However, for 'Brighter than a Thousand Suns' (Smith/Harris/Dickinson), the third person credited wrote the lyrics.

Sometimes you have pairs of writers working in a different way: 'Flight of Icarus' (Smith/Dickinson) has music from Adrian and lyrics from Bruce, whilst 'Sun and Steel' (Dickinson/Smith) originated from a simple guitar riff that Bruce had written that was developed by Adrian; the lyrics are Bruce's.
 
GhostofCain said:
It depends. Take for instance 'Can I Play with Madness', credited to Smith/Dickinson/Harris. Adrian and Bruce wrote most of the song and Steve added the break in the middle. However, for 'Brighter than a Thousand Suns' (Smith/Harris/Dickinson), the third person credited wrote the lyrics.

Sometimes you have pairs of writers working in a different way: 'Flight of Icarus' (Smith/Dickinson) has music from Adrian and lyrics from Bruce, whilst 'Sun and Steel' (Dickinson/Smith) originated from a simple guitar riff that Bruce had written that was developed by Adrian; the lyrics are Bruce's.
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I've always wondered about that and for Sun and Steel I have thought that Adrian wrote the lyrics - I also assume that the whole song Hooks In You is written by Bruce, or the music is by Adrian, not the lyrics, like is pointed out.
 
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Yeah I don't think there's any logic in the ordering of the credits. Generally it is fair to assume that if Bruce is involved in a Harris/Smith composition, then he wrote the lyrics but as pointed above with CIPWM, even that doesn't always hold true - he also contributed to the actual composition in that case.
 
Ruflux said:
Yeah I don't think there's any logic in the ordering of the credits. Generally it is fair to assume that if Bruce is involved in a Harris/Smith composition, then he wrote the lyrics but as pointed above with CIPWM, even that doesn't always hold true - he also contributed to the actual composition in that case.
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That probably suggests that the order of the authors being credited means something. ;)
 
GhostofCain said:
That probably suggests that the order of the authors being credited means something. ;)
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I don't think we have enough data points to make an assessment one way or another. I think that the credits ordering on DWYBO and TETMD is mostly down to Harris being a late contributor to an already mostly finished song, for example. But obviously I can't say for sure since CIPWM has musical contributions from Dickinson and the credits order is the same as the other two. Similarly, Sun and Steel is apparently based off of Bruce's original riff and he's the first person credited.

Does anyone have any info on Out of the Silent Planet and Ghost of the Navigator? They are credited as Gers/Dickinson/Harris, but I'd be more than a bit surprised if Bruce's involvement in either was more than just writing the lyrics. It would basically tell us the answer.
 
Ruflux said:
I don't think we have enough data points to make an assessment one way or another.
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The fact that we have a Dickinson/Smith composition ('Sun and Steel') and a Smith/Dickinson one ('Flight of Icarus') on the same album clearly suggests, in my humble opinion, that the order must mean something as I cannot see them randomly changing the order of the songwriters.

Ruflux said:
I think that the credits ordering on DWYBO and TETMD is mostly down to Harris being a late contributor to an already mostly finished song, for example. But obviously I can't say for sure since CIPWM has musical contributions from Dickinson and the credits order is the same as the other two.
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Steve added the instrumental break in the middle of CIPWM to a song that had been written by Adrian and Bruce (i.e. again a late contributor to an already mostly finished song). Adrian was not a fan of the change to begin with.

Ruflux said:
Does anyone have any info on Out of the Silent Planet and Ghost of the Navigator? They are credited as Gers/Dickinson/Harris, but I'd be more than a bit surprised if Bruce's involvement in either was more than just writing the lyrics. It would basically tell us the answer.
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Both are mostly Gers/Dickinson songs to which Steve added bits later on if I remember correctly.
 
GhostofCain said:
The fact that we have a Dickinson/Smith composition ('Sun and Steel') and a Smith/Dickinson one ('Flight of Icarus') on the same album clearly suggests, in my humble opinion, that the order must mean something as I cannot see them randomly changing the order of the songwriters.
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There is also an arrangement credit. If we take an educated guess that Dickinson wrote lyrics, and Smith music, for both, then in Sun and Steel case Dickinson had input into arrangement, and in FOI Smith.
 
Zare said:
There is also an arrangement credit. If we take an educated guess that Dickinson wrote lyrics, and Smith music, for both, then in Sun and Steel case Dickinson had input into arrangement, and in FOI Smith.
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Could be, but Bruce mentioned in What Does This Button Do? having written the riff for 'Sun and Steel' so part of the music is his.
 
Didn't know that. Maybe the first name did more. Who knows...
 
I’ve always read it as the first name came up with the basic idea for the song and the others added and/or changed things of significance. Significance, being a word that varies much from band to band.
 
mckindog said:
I’ve always read it as the first name came up with the basic idea for the song and the others added and/or changed things of significance. Significance, being a word that varies much from band to band.
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Agreed, and I think if it was two people working on it together initially they put whoever wrote the music first then who wrote the lyrics
 
srfc said:
Agreed, and I think if it was two people working on it together initially they put whoever wrote the music first then who wrote the lyrics
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Ir could also be that the first one came up with music and lyrics and the second one added something like guitar harmony or intro.

I think Nicko should have gotten a credit for WED. The drum intro is the most important part of the song
 
He keeps telling that story. Nicko, would you also tell about other drum parts in songs, or just songs in general. More versatility please.
 
Nicko is on, doing a little spoken drum tour.... ummm, I smell Bruce influence on this. :lol:
 
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