ISIS Thread

Forostar said:
Al-Nusra is not seen as moderate. At least, not anymore.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-34422202
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-34422202

Eliminating groups
Sandwiched between the two big fighting forces of Assad's army and IS are a whole host of minor rebel groups with obscure names, like Tajammu al-Izza, who say they were hit by Russian air strikes on Wednesday.

Some of these groups are perceived by the West as being "moderate" but most have been steadily weakened and plagued by defections, defeats and capture.

With the reported arrival in Syria of hundreds of Iranian troops, the build-up there of Russian forces and a newly active Russian stance, the indications are that Assad and his allies are going after crushing the minor rebel groups, leaving only the extremists of IS and al-Nusra.

They will then be able to say: "Look, you may not like him but Assad is the only alternative to the medieval head-choppers of IS".
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I'm googling that name "Tajammu al-Izza" and no search result earlier than this month comes up.
I'm not saying that it's made up for the sake of the article. But do you really think that 'host of minor rebel groups' is able to temporarily run the country until fair elections? What use is to arm them then, if west is so worried about these 'moderates' extract them from down there.

There are alternatives and there are viable alternatives.
 
Taking down ISIS wouldn't solve things by itself, you'd be taking down the strongest extremist group out there but who's to say remaining forces of ISIS don't join (or create) a different group? Do consider that most people in administrative positions in ISIS are old Ba'ath Party members. Taking down Saddam Hussein obviously didn't mean taking down everything that came with him. In fact, the operation that did take him down gave extremist groups the chance to acquire weaponry, feed off the chaos and rise above legitimate government. Same story with Syria, only difference being that Assad is still here.

Extremist groups have never been a viable alternative and they never will be. Thinking they were is exactly what made ISIS happen.
 
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Meanwhile, the EU demands halt to Russia strikes on Syrian opposition:
http://www.worldbulletin.net/news/165185/eu-demands-halt-to-russia-strikes-on-syrian-opposition

And still some people are fighting Assad:


Syrian Kurds, Arab Rebels and Assyrians Form New Alliance
syria-hasakah-isis-islamic-state-kurds.jpg

Kurdish People's Protection Units fighters take up positions inside a damaged building in al-Vilat al-Homor neighborhood in Hasaka city, as they monitor the movements of Islamic State fighters who are stationed in Ghwayran neighborhood in Hasaka city, Syria July 22.Reuters/Rodi Said

A U.S.-backed Syrian-Kurdish militia, a number of Arab rebel groups and an Assyrian Christian group in Syria have formed a coalition to build a democratic representation for a number of moderate parties within Syria, according to a statement seen by Reuters on Monday.

The new alliance, which is calling itself the Democratic Forces of Syria, includes the Kurdish People's Protection Units (YPG) that beat back the Islamic State (ISIS) with the support of U.S. airstrikes in the Syrian-Kurdish border town of Kobani earlier this year. The YPG continues to battle the radical Islamist group in areas of northeastern Syria and the formation of this coalition may act as a step towards an offensive against the group.

The group also includes Syrian rebel groups such as Jaysh al-Thuwwar (Army of Rebels)—a coalition of seven groups of the U.S.-backed Free Syrian Army that is fighting both ISIS and the forces of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad—as well as three other rebel factions. These Arab groups fall under the umbrella of the Syrian Arab Coalition. Christian Assyrian group named the Syriac Military Council (MFS) that is fighting ISIS in northern Syria has also joined the new alliance.

"The sensitive stage our country Syria is going through and rapid developments on the military and political front...require that there be a united national military force for all Syrians, joining Kurds, Arabs, Syriacs and other groups," the statement read.

The move may bolster the strength of these moderate parties in their fight to prevent radical groups such as ISIS and the Al-Qaeda-linked Nusra Front gaining territory in northern Syria and uniting their voices has already resulted in additional U.S. support. A U.S. official, speaking on condition of anonymity to CNN, revealed that the U.S. provided an airdrop of 50 tonnes of ammunition to the coalition early Monday.

Nuri Kino, the founder and president of A Demand For Action, a group that advocates for the protection of ethno-religious minorities in the Middle East, confirmed the existence of the alliance in an email to Newsweek Monday, but added that it was unclear what impact the group would have in the country's ongoing civil war, which has seen 240,000 people killed, 7.6 million displaced within Syria and four million refugees flee the country.

"Syria is a mess, it's impossible to predict anything about the future of the country," Kino says. The country's "Assyrians, Syriacs and Chaldeans are desperate," Kino says, referring to the ethnic minority groups that form the MFS and face persecution at the hands of ISIS. "Our people are searching different solutions to save themselves."

"We can confirm that MFS has done an agreement," he adds.

The new alliance is likely to unsettle the Turkish government, which has been wary of Kurdish advances in northern Syria near the Turkish border. In July, Turkish tanks allegedly shelled Kurdish-held villages in the Syrian province of Aleppo, the YPG and the U.K.-based monitoring group The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said, as well as ISIS-held positions. Ankara denied the claims that it had targeted Kurdish territory.

Ankara accuses the Kurdish YPG of being linked to the Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK) that is outlawed in Turkey and which has conducted a number of deadly attacks against Turkish authorities in recent months.

Earlier this year, Kurdish militiamen captured a number of key towns near ISIS's de-facto capital of Raqqa in Syria. In a notable victory for the Kurdish fighters, they seized the town of Tal Abyad in June and regained full control in July after an ISIS assault.
 
Lots of people are fighting Assad. Lots of people are fighting ISIS. Some are fighting both.
 
Yet, I wish we should not throw them on the same hope. This is about something. And Russia and Assad and IS are trying to destroy it, just to have power in the region.
 
The moment is lost. If we wanted for something good to come of this, we needed to act when the insurrections started, not now. It's too late now.
 
I'm not saying al-Assad is a good person, I really don't think he is. He is a bad man. But is he as bad as ISIS? Does the average Syrian cry for a modern western-style democracy? I truly have my doubts. I just don't think that our method of fighting ISIS will work in the long run. It will degrade ISIS, and eventually they will be toppled and replaced. But the next guy...he is the same. And then the next guy. And the next guy.

Our methods don't work.
 
What you're saying is irrelevant. Don't forget that everything started alleged chemical weapons in 2003. That was a lie, Libya was a lie and Syria is a lie. Lies from American establishment in order to pursue their imperialistic fetishes.
I don't need explain myself - General Wesley Clark did better than I ever could.

Assad is obviously an asshole but he didn't gas his own people (this seems to be taken as a fact but there's no proof of it!)
 
I don't necessarily think that Syria is a lie. Sectional fighting is definitely happening there, and people are definitely dying. ISIS, among about 2 dozen other groups, controls parts of Syria not controlled by the government, and this is certainly due to a reaction to Assad's method of rule, as well as a reaction to Assad losing control over certain areas of Syria where resistance festered. But it would be folly to assume that every group that fights Assad wants the democracy I want for my own country.

That's all I'm saying.
 
Here we have a trick with controlled parts. Those desert fields contain little population and a lot of resources. By saying an physical area shouldn't be under gov't control because 2000 villagers say they've been repressed or killed requires a full blown investigation of those events, because Western companies widely bribed those kind of population in Iraq and Libya for their own goal. Under actual circumstances you don't just believe somebody.

Of course sectional fighting is going on, what I'm saying is that chaos was brought, it wasn't imminent. Gov't had a violent crackdown of protesters, but Islamic forces started armed fighting. They were well prepared. Only when those forces crippled gov't control of the events, FSA formed out of SAA men who defected over and volunteers.

And I wasn't trying to state your opinion as irrelevant. It was directed to both you and me, eg. general population, because I'm completely certain there's big lobby of some kind that plans, triggers and steers these 'revolutions'.
 
LooseCannon said:
Other than all the problems that raises.......sometimes it is tempting.

Glass from the Suez to the Euphrates. Problem solved.
Click to expand...

Apart from the quazillions of tonnes of sand in the atmosphere, I see no issue...
 
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