GREATEST METAL ALBUM CUP - Winner: Iron Maiden - Seventh Son of a Seventh Son!

[JudasMyGuide]

Hey, I'm gonna be in big trouble, but let's get dangerous:

1. ) They definitely would be getting smaller a beating everywhere, including this round, if Schaffer did what he did in support of BLM, not Trump

2. ) Actually - I realize - were I to vote "politically" I would definitely vote for IE - petty blasphemy and pedestrian anti-religious raving is a much more distasteful and more dangerous thing than silly random acts of sedition that were doomed to fail from the very beginning.

Spoiler

 

[Diesel 11]

2. ) Actually - I realize - were I to vote "politically" I would definitely vote for IE - petty blasphemy and pedestrian anti-religious raving is much more distasteful and more dangerous a thing than silly random acts of sedition that were doomed to fail from the very beginning.

But Stormrider is an anti-religious record (literally about a guy trying to kill the idea of God) so doesn’t that mean that they fall into both categories?

 

[MrKnickerbocker]

1. ) They definitely would be getting lesser a beating everywhere, including this round, if Schaffer did what he did in support of BLM, not Trump

Sorry for the diversion from simply discussing Iced Earth and Schaffer here, BUT...

No, they would not. Anyone storming the capitol of the United States en masse in a coordinated effort with weapons would receive the same treatment, whether they were wearing MAGA hats or BLM shirts.

If Obama told his "followers" (a ludicrous term to have to call anyone simply supporting the POTUS, but such was the lunacy of Trumpism) to "fight like hell" and spread rampant lies for two months that fueled the fire, only to have a bunch of people in BLM shirts storm the capitol, he would be raked over the coals far worse than Trump.

Also, it would never happen, because if any large group showed up in BLM attire instead of MAGA attire, they would have been tear gassed and beaten down before they even reached the steps. Such is America.

 

[karljant]

Well if it isn't Running Wild's Royal. Cool Power Metal album, back when it wasn't poppy with some good cuts like Into The Arena, Warchild or the title track. Nevertheless I think AMOLAD is on another level (namely the only post reunion album that rivals with the band's best era) so I'll go with Iron Maiden.

Nightfall is the only post TFTTW Blind Guardian album that captured my attention, mostly due to the fact it starts with one of the band's best songs ever. Into The Storm is everything most modern Power Metal bands try to achieve while failing miserably: pompous without sounding cheesy, clean without sounding poppy, epic without sounding ridiculous or pretentious... in sum one of the best songs in the genre I've ever listened to. As for the remainder of the album it overall bores me and I think it's due to the band overuse of symphonic and choral shenanigans. There are a couple of exceptions where this recipe works fine for me, namely Time Stands Still and When Sorrow Sang. But the rest is simply not the kind of Blind Guardian I prefer. Not that's a bad record by any means (there are some gorgeous moments and Hansi's voice continues to be jaw dropping) but there's that metal opera flavor all around I kinda dislike. I think Empire although featuring three or four of fillers is a more well balanced record so my vote goes to Queensryche.

For a band that's been almost 40 years into metal, I must concur The Book Of Souls is a great album. Composing songs such as If Eternity Should Fail, The Great Unknown, the ambitious rock opera that is Empire Of The Clouds or the superb title track deserves all metal and rock fans' words of reverence to say the least. But on the other side there's Hammerheart. And if Blood Fire Death is simply my favorite album by Quorthon and the first where he started to show signs of what was to be known as Viking Metal, its successor turned out to be the genre's absolute tutorial (and my close second favorite by the band). Putting much more attention on the epic and Nordic folk side of his sound Shores In Flames is as powerful as beautiful with clean vocals and choral arrangements forging a classic for all times. And although all the songs are much slower is not like Quorthon has dropped completely his raspy tone: Baptize In Fire And Ice is still wicked as hell. But overall this great album either mixes these two sides (Valhalla, Father To Son) or follows the absolutely gorgeous template of the opening opus (Home Of The Once Brave, One Rode To Asa Bay) while maintaining the quality and style innovation levels extremely high. Yes, one year after leaving extreme metal fans with their jaws on the floor Bathory did it once more and I have no choice but giving them my vote.

Apart from Gettysburg 1863 (if we consider it to be a stand alone release - at least it is as a DVD) I must confess the only two Iced Earth albums that at least caught my attention were their first two records. And yes, Gene Adam may be the least skilled singer the band ever had but his voice fitted 100% the mix of thrash/speed/power metal the band delivered back then. Night Of The Stormrider is not devoid of its cons: I know it's a concept album but the overuse of acoustic parts kinda dilutes the punch effect. Nevertheless there are some really decent stuff here (The Path I Chose, Pure Evil, Stormrider). Overall I wished Iced Earth followed this heavier side but nevertheless this is a pretty decent record. But what it isn't for sure is an absolute thrash classic that ripps everything that dares to cross its way like Agent Orange. So yeah: Sodom.

 

[karljant]

Zlatan and José Mourinho... two sweet and politically correct citizens.

 

[JudasMyGuide]

Sorry for the diversion from simply discussing Iced Earth and Schaffer here, BUT...

No, they would not. Anyone storming the capitol of the United States en masse in a coordinated effort with weapons would receive the same treatment, whether they were wearing MAGA hats or BLM shirts.

If Obama told his "followers" (a ludicrous term to have to call anyone simply supporting the POTUS, but such was the lunacy of Trumpism) to "fight like hell" and spread rampant lies for two months that fueled the fire, only to have a bunch of people in BLM shirts storm the capitol, he would be raked over the coals far worse than Trump.

Also, it would never happen, because if any large group showed up in BLM attire instead of MAGA attire, they would have been tear gassed and beaten down before they even reached the steps. Such is America.

Okay, I hope you're right.

And I hope two things are known - that I was mostly just taking the piss there and I'm not a Trumpet, nor even an American-style "Conservative".

 

[MrKnickerbocker]

Okay, I hope you're right.

And I hope two things are known - that I was mostly just taking the piss there and I'm not a Trumpet, nor even an American-style "Conservative".

Totally got it, not trying to indicate either.

I do think it’d be pretty funny to see Schaffer’s core audience get super confused to see him leading a BLM coup

 

[LooseCannon]

I do think it’d be pretty funny to see Schaffer’s core audience get super confused to see him leading a BLM coup

That is what QAnon tried to say, is that the 1/6 insurgence was actually Antifa & BLM...

 

[JudasMyGuide]

But Stormrider is an anti-religious record (literally about a guy trying to kill the idea of God) so doesn’t that mean that they fall into both categories?

Oh, wow, I sure never stopped to listen to the lyrics to this particular album. I guess you're right.

Although... it isn't necessarily so - Epica has a lot of anti-religious stuff and I listen to them all the same, even though sometimes they also aren't the sharpest pencil in the box, but they are this type of a "noble enemy" of sorts...

...and, now that I think of it, one of my favourite books ever is actually sorta about a guy trying to kill the idea of God (Flannery O'Connor's Wise Blood, if anyone wondered)...

...so I wanted to ask if Stormrider's at-best-adolescently pedestrian and "edgy" (because if not, I might vote for it anyway), but then I realized that this is the band that gave us Watching Over Me and I'm shutting up right now.


P. S. (Sorry, I deleted the previous post because I wanted my responses to be in order, apologize for any confusion)

 

[Diesel 11]

And yes, Gene Adam may be the least skilled singer the band ever had but his voice fitted 100% the mix of thrash/speed/power metal the band delivered back then.

I dunno if you were implying that he was on both records, but in case you did, John Greely was the singer on Stormrider. Allegedly fired due to antisemitism, although people have questioned if that was just Schaffer’s explanation due to him quitting during the tour... it’s kind of a metal mystery, lol.

 

[Diesel 11]

...so I wanted to ask if Stormrider's at-best-adolescently pedestrian and "edgy" (because if not, I might vote for it anyway), but then I realized that this is the band that gave us Watching Over Me and I'm shutting up right now.

From what I can infer, Stormrider’s plot line is of a man who sees how religion can cause evil in the world (“Angels Holocaust”) and after a reawakening (“Stormrider”) decides his mission is to rid the world of religion (“The Path I Choose”). He sets out to assemble an army (“Desert Rain”) and declares war on Heaven (“Pure Evil”), but is mortally wounded during the battle (“Reaching the End”). He finds himself in Hell / Hades and is eternally punished for his blasphemous acts (“Travel in Stygian”). “Before the Vision” and “Mystical End” I assume show him some of the evils in the world, but I could be wrong on that.

The finale with “Stygian” is kind of a change of message though. I’m curious as to why Schaffer’s character ended up being ‘wrong’ in the end. To showcase that good people get punished or something?

 

[Magnus]

it seems like Primordial just lifted their schtick from here lock, stock, and barrel.

The influence of Bathory on an entire subgenre is immense.
One of the things I like so much about Primordial is developing their own unique and Irish voice.

And of course Alan used to - and I think still does - front a Bathory tribute band.

 

[LooseCannon]

I will say I have been enjoying my time with Bathory far more than I expected to, really just an interesting group that I don't think has been much improved upon by other contenders within their subgenre.

 

[Magnus]

I will say I have been enjoying my time with Bathory far more than I expected to

really just an interesting group that I don't think has been much improved upon by other contenders within their subgenre.

 

[LooseCannon]

Well I guess we'll find out when we get to more people in the subgenre. There's a few titans of extreme yet to come.

 

[Magnus]

Some of the best black metal albums were already purged. But let's see indeed.

 

[The Flash]

The finale with “Stygian” is kind of a change of message though. I’m curious as to why Schaffer’s character ended up being ‘wrong’ in the end. To showcase that good people get punished or something?

I haven't read the lyrics, but judging from what you said I suppose it's commentary that suggests blaming an entire religion and its faithful for the immoral actions of people who also follow that religion and punishing them for things they have not done or condoned is itself morally reprehensible.

 

[karljant]

I dunno if you were implying that he was on both records, but in case you did, John Greely was the singer on Stormrider. Allegedly fired due to antisemitism, although people have questioned if that was just Schaffer’s explanation due to him quitting during the tour... it’s kind of a metal mystery, lol.

Wasn't aware of it. In all honesty the voice is a bit different here (more melodic and less raspy) but I thought it was also Gene since it still has that thrashy edge.

 

[Mosh]

I haven't read the lyrics, but judging from what you said I suppose it's commentary that suggests blaming an entire religion and its faithful for the immoral actions of people who also follow that religion and punishing them for things they have not done or condoned is itself morally reprehensible.

Having your main character sentenced to eternal damnation is also just a really metal ending. There’s more anti-organized religion stuff on burnt offerings.

 

[karljant]

Some of the best black metal albums were already purged. But let's see indeed.

Well some of them are still out there or may wind up:

Bathory - Blood Fire Death, Twhilight Of The Gods, Under The Sign
Enslaved - Axioma Ethica Odini, RIITIIR, Isa and Ruun
Samael - Ceremony Of Opposites
Emperor - In The Nightside Eclipse, Anthems, IX Equilibrium and Prometheus (unlike the majority I prefer much more the more recent ones)
Blut Aus Nord - the whole 777 trilogy (especially Cosmosophy)
Negura Bunget - Vîrstele Pămîntului, Tau and Zi

... and if you want to include it here the majority of Ihsahn's work (especially The Adversary, After, Eremita, Arktis and Amr) and Ulver's Kveldssanger, Blood Inside and War Of The Roses.

The majority of them are a bit far fetched but one never knows