Iron Maiden's management: What went wrong?

dickinson1978 said:
I cant remember the words bruce said about what MTV think about them in the 90s. Something about old ugly and with grassy hairs are not what they want. But like bruce says that kind of things
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I will quote me. Maybe some of the old members remember this. I used google translator. He said something like

"some old men in thongs and with greasy hair is the opposite of what they understand by music"
 
Omg, the PUZZLES are finally starting to fall into place! Remember what the upcoming Maiden tour is called? Run for Your Lives? Yeah, you wish. The band’s clearly throwing some shade at their own failed management.

Because in reality, the tour’s true name is this:
ROD FUMBLED YOUR LEGACY TOUR.

I guess all those wild speculations about mismanagement... might’ve been spot on after all.
 
:scared: And we all remember how early on Bruce was dropping hints about the possibility of them playing Rime of the Ancient Mariner. ROTAM, BRUCE — he was trying to tell us something:
ROD ONLY THINKS ABOUT MONEY!

Man, at this point I’m fully convinced that the upcoming documentary is gonna be just as ugly as Metallica’s Some Kind of Monster.

Our high-road band is starting to crash into the ground.
 
Commercial success has a lot to do with management, but is not solely based on it. The best manager in the world can not make a band bigger than their musical / image appeal. So the fact that Metallica is bigger than Maiden can not be used to determine the quality of management. At least not in a measurable way. In other words: yes, Metallica sell more than Maiden, but NO, this does not necessarily mean that their management is better. Or that Maiden would be same size or even bigger with a different management. It simply means that several factors align, which in conclusion makes MEtallica bigger than Maiden.

Smallwood has done a very good job, making Maiden one of the five biggest Metal bands of all time.
The fact that he is pretty ruthless / unethical at times is something else, and can be critisized. What he did to Helloween and Noise Records is very questionable.
 
Eddie's Uncle said:
Commercial success has a lot to do with management, but is not solely based on it. The best manager in the world can not make a band bigger than their musical / image appeal. So the fact that Metallica is bigger than Maiden can not be used to determine the quality of management. At least not in a measurable way. In other words: yes, Metallica sell more than Maiden, but NO, this does not necessarily mean that their management is better. Or that Maiden would be same size or even bigger with a different management. It simply means that several factors align, which in conclusion makes MEtallica bigger than Maiden.

Smallwood has done a very good job, making Maiden one of the five biggest Metal bands of all time.
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In the end, it's a little late in the day for this conversation anyway. Maiden aren't going to overtake Metallica anytime soon. Maiden are at the precipice of retirement, Metallica seemingly is not. The fact of the matter is, Rod and the management team has had Steve to contend with in all their decisions. As we know, Steve is notoriously stubborn, and what direction Steve wants, that's what Steve gets. In all the decades of their existence, it seems the only major concession he's ever made is taking Bruce back, and he's admitted he was skeptical at best as to how that would turn out.

I don't think Rod ever had the stroke to force Steve to go commercial with Maiden's sound in the way Metallica did in the nineties. After Bruce left, Steve doubled down on his "sticking to his guns" philosophy, took over producing the band and wrote a morose album that strayed from the classic sound only by leaning into his proggier musical inclinations--pretty much the exact opposite of what Metallica did in the nineties and the opposite of "commercial." A manager with as much control as people think Rod has on here wouldn't have let that happen.

Personally, I'd reframe this whole conversation as "Iron Maiden with Steve in Control--What Went Wrong?" If the band had been more democratic in direction, Adrian might not have left during the making of No Prayer, we might've gotten a more commercial sound via his stronger input, and Bruce might not have even felt the need to leave if Maiden were incorporating current trends into their overall sound. And yeah, that might have made them more competitive in the overall fight with Metallica.

Or it might have gone the other way, with their core fanbase abandoning them for going mainstream. Who knows.
 
I personally don't give a fuck anyway. Maiden is the ONLY band of that size / level I still enjoy. I would prefer them to be smaller, because they reached that level where they attract too huge crowds for me, mostly consisting of people who are way out of Metal, but so what.
Metallica have not released a good album since 1988, have a rather annoying fan base and do features with Lady Gaga. Actually, surpassing such a garbage band would probably mean that you became totally edgeless. Maiden would probably be totally embarrassing if they managed to outsell Metallica.
 
Eddie's Uncle said:
I personally don't give a fuck anyway. Maiden is the ONLY band of that size / level I still enjoy. I would prefer them to be smaller, because they reached that level where they attract too huge crowds for me, mostly consisting of people who are way out of Metal, but so what.
Metallica have not released a good album since 1988, have a rather annoying fan base and do features with Lady Gaga. Actually, surpassing such a garbage band would probably mean that you became totally edgeless. Maiden would probably be totally embarrassing if they managed to outsell Metallica.
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Death magnetic is a good album. Not like the first ones but good. But im with you,maiden is the band that i keep suporting
 
Mosh said:
Maiden lost their spark, and Smallwood didn’t do enough to smooth the transition. Blaze was never going to fill those shoes, and it showed.
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Could've got Halford himself and he still wouldn't fill those shoes. Not a knock on Halford obviously, but that's a tough and unenviable position to be in.
 
I don’t agree with calling Metallica garbage. The Black Album isn’t a favorite of mine, but I still place it alongside their first four records. Yeah, it’s more simplified, but they still kicked ass on it. After that, they went into experimental mode, but with Death Magnetic they tried to go back to their roots. That album has several good tracks, same with Hardwired. Hell, even 72 Seasons has a couple of songs I find likeable.

My take on Metallica is this: Hetfield is the soul of the band. He had (or maybe still has) his inner problems and demons, which in the early days helped fuel some great music. But now he’s a grown man—maybe even past his midlife crisis—and it feels like he’s outgrown thrash, but hasn’t found a new version of himself musically. Or maybe he has and just doesn’t embrace it. Like, maybe deep down he wants to play southern rock or something, but holds back because he’s afraid of alienating fans. Yeah, that’s just my speculation, but it sort of fits.

The last few albums, you can really feel they’re just going through the motions. The lyrics are super introspective, and a lot of the songs end up just being... boring. Metallica is dealing with some kind of crisis. They’ve made peace with their thrash past, but it’s not blooming into great records anymore, because their hearts are in a different place now. That’s how I see it.

That said, they still do charity, they care about their fans. Yeah, they’re mainstream now, and sometimes do stuff like singing with Lady Gaga, but they’re not garbage. If you ask me, that word fits Motley Crue better.
 
Azas said:
I don’t agree with calling Metallica garbage. The Black Album isn’t a favorite of mine, but I still place it alongside their first four records. Yeah, it’s more simplified, but they still kicked ass on it. After that, they went into experimental mode, but with Death Magnetic they tried to go back to their roots. That album has several good tracks, same with Hardwired. Hell, even 72 Seasons has a couple of songs I find likeable.

My take on Metallica is this: Hetfield is the soul of the band. He had (or maybe still has) his inner problems and demons, which in the early days helped fuel some great music. But now he’s a grown man—maybe even past his midlife crisis—and it feels like he’s outgrown thrash, but hasn’t found a new version of himself musically. Or maybe he has and just doesn’t embrace it. Like, maybe deep down he wants to play southern rock or something, but holds back because he’s afraid of alienating fans. Yeah, that’s just my speculation, but it sort of fits.

The last few albums, you can really feel they’re just going through the motions. The lyrics are super introspective, and a lot of the songs end up just being... boring. Metallica is dealing with some kind of crisis. They’ve made peace with their thrash past, but it’s not blooming into great records anymore, because their hearts are in a different place now. That’s how I see it.

That said, they still do charity, they care about their fans. Yeah, they’re mainstream now, and sometimes do stuff like singing with Lady Gaga, but they’re not garbage. If you ask me, that word fits Motley Crue better.
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I think its more that they dont spend the sane time recording like in the past like maiden. They do a few weeks. Same problem with metallica. Some parts repeating over and over
 
dickinson1978 said:
I think its more that they dont spend the sane time recording like in the past like maiden. They do a few weeks. Same problem with metallica. Some parts repeating over and over
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I think what they really need is a proper producer, not a yes-man like they and Maiden’s got. Someone who’ll actually say, “This part sucks,” or “This whole song is just meaningless meandering.” If you look back, their early songs were packed with riffs, sure—but they still worked. Some of them even feel like classics now. They had real melody in them. Where the hell did all that go?
 
Azas said:
:scared: And we all remember how early on Bruce was dropping hints about the possibility of them playing Rime of the Ancient Mariner. ROTAM, BRUCE — he was trying to tell us something:
ROD ONLY THINKS ABOUT MONEY!

Man, at this point I’m fully convinced that the upcoming documentary is gonna be just as ugly as Metallica’s Some Kind of Monster.

Our high-road band is starting to crash into the ground.
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[Steve picking another E-C-D progression]
"Well, that sounds stock to me."
 
Mosh said:
Iron Maiden’s success is undeniable, but when you compare their popularity to bands like Metallica and Judas Priest, it's clear they've never quite reached the same mainstream level. A big part of that comes down to the band's management, particularly Rod Smallwood, who has been behind Iron Maiden's operations for decades. While Smallwood has certainly helped keep the band’s core identity intact, his decisions have often held them back from achieving the kind of mass appeal that Metallica or Priest managed to capture.

One of the biggest issues is Iron Maiden’s branding. While they’ve got a killer image with Eddie and iconic album covers, they’ve never really pushed themselves into the mainstream in the way Metallica did with their more commercial sound and strategic media presence. Smallwood’s refusal to change the band’s image or embrace more modern trends in the '90s and beyond meant they stayed within a niche, never breaking out beyond metal circles. Metallica, for example, made key changes like working with producer Bob Rock for the Black Album and getting major radio airplay, which broadened their appeal. Judas Priest also made smarter moves by experimenting with their sound and staying relevant to hard rock audiences, while Maiden stuck to their formula.

Smallwood's management also failed to push Iron Maiden into the media spotlight as effectively as Metallica did. While Metallica was all over MTV and late-night talk shows, Iron Maiden stayed more reserved, often keeping their media appearances limited to the hardcore metal scene. This lack of mainstream exposure kept them from reaching new audiences. Even when their songs were radio-friendly, their management didn't make the necessary push for radio play or mass media coverage.

On the touring front, Iron Maiden’s approach was also more conservative. While Metallica and Judas Priest were constantly expanding into new global markets, Maiden stuck to the same formula, reaching their loyal fanbase but missing opportunities to grow in emerging regions. Metallica’s world tours, which included stops in markets like South America and Asia, helped solidify them as a global force. Meanwhile, Smallwood often kept Maiden's touring strategy limited, not always capitalizing on the right moments or new opportunities. It’s a shame, really, because Maiden had all the potential to be the Metallica of the ‘80s and ‘90s, if only their management had taken a more dynamic approach.

I'm curious what everybody else thinks though. Discuss!
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Ralph hacked your account?
 
Maiden is one of the biggest Metal band ever.

Metallica is still bigger due to the Black Album (which many still see as a sold out move), but Maiden is catching up very quickly in the last few years. Rammstein might sell more tickets in some European markets but they've been less consistent with the touring (and a lot of people just show up to see the stage anyway).

Maiden is constantly touring. They don't make a big deal out of things like RHOF nominee, they don't appear in TV programs, they're still snobbed when it comes to radio (compared to other bands). Yet, they're still breaking their records everytime.

Just for comparison: AC/DC's 2nd PWRP leg isn't selling that good (for their standards), with Maiden giving them dust to eat in a lot of markets. This is the 2nd year AC/DC is touring since 2016. Maiden, on the other hand, has been touring every year since 2016. This shows that theoretically Maiden would sell a lot more tickets than AC/DC, if the latter were to tour more frequently.

Where Maiden is doing nothing to increase their popularity is in the US. The last leg was such a letdown when you compare them with previous tours (playing just one show in LA is proof to that). My idea is that they need to shake things a bit there, with stadiums and better bills (as everyone is doing this day). That being said, if Rod didn't go that way yet it probably means he knows there is nothing that can be done and he doesn't want to take that kind of risk. Luckily, they can get the big money out of SA instead.
 
Oh, btw: Priest could be the opening band for Maiden, even now that are probably more popular than ever. They might be experimenting new things but they are nowhere near to the success Maiden has.
 
ShadowOfTheGods said:
Maiden is one of the biggest Metal band ever.

Metallica is still bigger due to the Black Album (which many still see as a sold out move), but Maiden is catching up very quickly in the last few years. Rammstein might sell more tickets in some European markets but they've been less consistent with the touring (and a lot of people just show up to see the stage anyway).

Maiden is constantly touring. They don't make a big deal out of things like RHOF nominee, they don't appear in TV programs, they're still snobbed when it comes to radio (compared to other bands). Yet, they're still breaking their records everytime.

Just for comparison: AC/DC's 2nd PWRP leg isn't selling that good (for their standards), with Maiden giving them dust to eat in a lot of markets. This is the 2nd year AC/DC is touring since 2016. Maiden, on the other hand, has been touring every year since 2016. This shows that theoretically Maiden would sell a lot more tickets than AC/DC, if the latter were to tour more frequently.

Where Maiden is doing nothing to increase their popularity is in the US. The last leg was such a letdown when you compare them with previous tours (playing just one show in LA is proof to that). My idea is that they need to shake things a bit there, with stadiums and better bills (as everyone is doing this day). That being said, if Rod didn't go that way yet it probably means he knows there is nothing that can be done and he doesn't want to take that kind of risk. Luckily, they can get the big money out of SA instead.
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Words of wisdom, I can agree. And about the NA tour last year, they were touring with Senjutsu and SiT, which aren't so popular among the audiences. I think 2026 will be similar to 2019, with bigger venues and more cities, because they'll be playing songs from the first nine studio albums. Metallica became a sold-out band when they decided to compromise and bend for casual listeners and radio-friendly audiences. And you must know they were one of those trash metal warriors who wanna "beat the glam metal posers" in the '80s. Metallica's members are generally psyched about popularity, media attention, and being trendy artists at any cost. I'm not their hater or fan, too - just the observer. Iron Maiden is absolutely different, so we can't compare Metallica and Maiden as artists and phenomena. IM is about independence, DIY approach, and making things in their way and style.
 
Nomadd said:
Metallica's members are generally psyched about popularity, media attention, and being trendy artists at any cost. I'm not their hater or fan, too - just the observer.
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The bolded I'm scratching my head about. I don't think they've made a 'trendy' or 'commercial' album in over 20 years?
 
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