USA Politics
- Thread starter Genghis Khan
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Yax
Ancient Mariner
No, he delivered a solid speech which is why the right is going ballistic, and you while you label that as ”getting through the speech”, this was a really good speech on its own merits. The SOTU in early 2023 was nothing short of epic, with Biden tricking the GOP to withdrawing their Social Security slashes from the table, and they fell for a similar trick again. Biden did very well, and is doing what he should from now on, which is to call out the extremist transformation of the GoP and do it forcefully, which is the only way that works nowadays. And we are once again back to the double standards, with 8 years of raging Trump speeches and disregard of decorum (and let’s not pretend Trump’s SOTU speeches were any less partisan), nor were the GoP anything but partisan. They didn’t even clap for fighting cancer for crying out loud, the least partisan issue ever. Enough of the double standards. Biden shows a bit of teeth and he is suddenly oh so angry. Double standards. In fact, he was far more tempered than Trump was even in his installation adress. No, more of this, because this is what makes a difference instead of letting the GOP paint their stark, dystopian view of the US, in contrast with reality. Biden has a lot of domestic accomplishments to run on, far more than Trump did, who had very few legislatory wins and nowhere near the magnitude of Biden, who delivered the infrastructure and manufacturing Trump promised but never tried to or could muster. Investments in manufacturing are up 250% under Biden while a measly 20% under Trump and he touted that and others in his speech.
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chaosapiant
Ancient Marinade
I think it was in October, my wife and I watched Biden's SOTU just after the Israeli attack on Gaza began, and we were both impressed by Biden's speech. That was like 4-5 months ago. She'd heard all the shit everyone talks about how old and senile and whatever and she was like "I don't get it, he seemed very articulate and fine?"
That's basically how I feel about Biden across the board. He's fine.
That's basically how I feel about Biden across the board. He's fine.
Ignores previous arguments, changes topics. Not worth responding to imo.
I’ve seen (imo slightly unjustified) complaints from within the biden campaign about how Biden is engaging in things he’s accused of not doing but the media won’t cover it. There’s maybe some truth there, but it’s ultimately Biden’s responsibility to find a way to fix this because this sentiment is all too common. People don’t pay attention but have heard enough accusations of Biden being senile to believe it and then they actually hear Biden speak and think he’s fine. He needs to find a way to overcome the narrative by getting in front of voters more.
chaosapiant
Ancient Marinade
There's a part of me that kinda feels that, right or wrong, Biden just doesn't give a shit about what people say about him. And while he kinda should, as the president and person running for office again, I admire that in him.
Biden has accomplished a lot for a first term president and has been successful on many fronts. He has a platform to run on and can easily articulate what he’s accomplished for people and what he can do with a second term, the message is very clear. So I think there’s a level of frustration when those accomplishments are both unrecognized and the guy who’s going to be on trial for multiple felonies and was by all measures a really weak president is beating him in the polls. I think there is a level of “I don’t give a shit what you say about me, we have tangible accomplishments we can point to as reason for re-electing me.” But that’s just not landing with people and imo Biden needs to figure that out.
I would say that the GOP probably did Biden a favour by lowering the expectations. If he had shown up at the SOTU and managed to say "Hi I'm Joe Biden" he surpassed the expectations they set. The SOTU is still a fairly inside baseball thing, although this year had better ratings than the last few, so that's good for Joe. On the other end, Katie Britt absolutely fucked up the response, so badly that the news cycle has been about how she desperately misrepresented something that happened in Mexico during the time of George W. Bush as happening at the US border under Biden.
Vaenyr
Ancient Mariner
I think it won't suprise anyone here that I'm pretty left wing in my positions. When he won the primaries back in 2020 I was quite disappointed because I'd rather have other candidates. There are things worth criticising Biden for, like his handling of the Gaza crisis or that he is quite old. I'm not necessarily against older folks working in the government, but hopefully he'll make it through the entirety of his term (considering that being POTUS is probably one of the most stressful jobs in the world) and it is true, that he's not as sharp as he was a decade or two ago.
That said, he is a much better president than I originally anticipated and managed to accomplish quite a bit. Despite the constant attacks by the right wing about him being "incoherent and rambling", which describes Trump much more, he has aides and people that give him advice; people he listens to and whose opinions he actually considers. Can we say the same about Trump? Does anyone really believe that Trump would listen to aides instead of doing his own idiotic thing? Well, except military decisions I suppose, where his dangerous ideas could get shot down. There aren't many situations where the POTUS has to decide right this very moment. They get time to hear out opinions from other people and reports from intelligence agencies, before deciding on a course of action. That's why Biden's age doesn't bother me too much: He might not be as sharp as he was, but he's still competent enough to do the job.
That said, he is a much better president than I originally anticipated and managed to accomplish quite a bit. Despite the constant attacks by the right wing about him being "incoherent and rambling", which describes Trump much more, he has aides and people that give him advice; people he listens to and whose opinions he actually considers. Can we say the same about Trump? Does anyone really believe that Trump would listen to aides instead of doing his own idiotic thing? Well, except military decisions I suppose, where his dangerous ideas could get shot down. There aren't many situations where the POTUS has to decide right this very moment. They get time to hear out opinions from other people and reports from intelligence agencies, before deciding on a course of action. That's why Biden's age doesn't bother me too much: He might not be as sharp as he was, but he's still competent enough to do the job.
Onhell
Infinite Dreamer
I didn't watch the SOTU, but now I wish I did, because in the news this morning they said Biden referred to a person of questionable legal status (apparently accused of murder?) an "illegal" and was now apologizing profusely "on the verge of tears" for his faux pas and "accidently" insulting a "group of people." Ummm.... ok.
Vaenyr
Ancient Mariner
That was in response to MTG's heckling. She used that word so when he responded he used the same term, but has said in an interview afterwards that he regrets using it and should've been more careful with his words. I've not seen the "on the verge of tears" part, which sounds heavily editorialized and also kinda out of character for someone like Biden.
Since the GOP response was such a mess they are desperately trying to find other avenues of attack and this is one of them.
Jer
'Til Tomorrow
Yeah, this language policing and political correctness around illegal immigrants is ridiculous. "Illegal immigrant" is in fact the most accurate term for people who emigrate to the United States through illegal means without any intention of closing the loop with an asylum petition. "Undocumented" is goodthink bullshit that tries to destigmatize the illegality of their entry and continued presence in the U.S., and it's a slap in the face to the people who jumped through the appropriate hoops, waited in line, and entered the U.S. legally.
Biden shouldn't apologize at all for using the term "illegal", and the far left really needs a reality check on this. When you find yourself using 1984 as a playbook instead of a cautionary tale, you're in the wrong. Period.
Biden shouldn't apologize at all for using the term "illegal", and the far left really needs a reality check on this. When you find yourself using 1984 as a playbook instead of a cautionary tale, you're in the wrong. Period.
Onhell
Infinite Dreamer
I agree. I've gotten in a few arguments with my mom and GF over this. If you break the law, you've done something illegal and therefore ACCORDING TO THE LAW you are a criminal. The law doesn't care if you stole the loaf of bread to feed your starving kid. You stole, period. It may sound insensitive and callous, but it is the best way to talk about it as it is devoid of emotion and keeps the facts clear.
Low end, it's the sort of terminology I don't really care that much about. I get why people want to use the term "undocumented migrant" and I think "migrant" is a better word than "immigrant" because you aren't really immigrating somewhere if you don't go through the legal process, and if you get caught you get tossed. But I agree, I don't think this is so much of a much. Just like I think MTG's law is just show.
chaosapiant
Ancient Marinade
Surely i'm not the only one who keeps thinking her name is "Magic The Gathering," thanks to her initials?
As someone who does also tend to lean left, I do get sick of all the backlash folks get because a word gets used. It's one thing to intentionally attack or "punch down" on a group of people, and another thing entirely to use simple and effective language.
it is mildly annoying.
Vaenyr
Ancient Mariner
Marjorie The Gathering