USA Politics

I know a lot of people from Indiana and I am there quite often playing gigs. All I can say as an outside observer is: it looks more and more economically depressed every day.
 
Well, the reaction to the "grab them by the pussy" tape has been quite amazing. Finally got Paul Ryan to back off Trump. I don't want to say stick a fork in him, he's done - but you have to admit that the Clinton campaign won that one, not only smothering the Wikileaks news of the campaign emails where Hillary said some interesting things, but really just...murdering Trump's image amongst what mainstream Republicans still supported him.
 
It basically comes down to this I think: Hillary is an evil politician. Trump is an evil person. That "politician" part makes some (those who are sick of the establishment) want to vote Trump, and some (who want at least someone who's capable of actually running things) want to vote Hillary.

Fucking sad is what it is.
 
The interesting thing is that at least Hillary is a politician, and I can count on her to react in certain predictable ways. She will try to do most of what she says she will try to do. I trust her on that - what I don't trust her on is to do it cleanly. There'll be some way that things are done that benefits the Clintons. Set against the monstrosity that is Donald Trump, who would surely govern horribly, who would surely set new records for gross, misogynistic things done by a president in the modern era, who would surely use the Oval Office solely to enrich himself, who would destabilize the world by his lack of knowledge of international security requirements, that's a small price to pay. It shouldn't be necessary, but it is.
 
LooseCannon said:
The interesting thing is that at least Hillary is a politician, and I can count on her to react in certain predictable ways.
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Yes, but that is a problem in itself for many. This isn't to say Trump would be better in his reactions, we don't even really know what his policies are because he flip-flops so often, but reactionary track record of Hillary, or the establishment she comes from isn't terribly great.

A point I'd raise, though, is that the bad track record of United States in terms of reacting to certain developments in world politics is removed from who the president is. Fucking things up in order to serve for the country's best -mostly financial- interest has been the story for both sides.
 
The Flash said:
This isn't to say Trump would be better in his reactions, we don't even really know what his policies are because he flip-flops so often, but reactionary track record of Hillary, or the establishment she comes from isn't terribly great.
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Oh, absolutely. I think Hillary will make a below-average president of the USA, something akin to a GHWB or a LBJ with no signature accomplishments. She'll be the last of her generation of leaders, and the newer generation that latched onto Obama and became politically aware due to him will control the next 3-4 presidential elections. They came damn close to controlling this one and electing Bernie.

For reference, I think Trump would be tied with Bernie right now, because the GOP would be far more likely to hold their nose and vote for Trump against a communist. This reveal would cause Trump to lose, mind you.

And damn, the rats are abandoning the sinking ship.
 
I was glad to see Trump apolgize for his comments, given some one running for president shouldn't have made them in the first place..

I'm just waiting for Bill to apologize to those women he raped and Hillary to apologize to the families of those killed in Benghazi...

I'll be waiting a while. Perhaps Tool will make a new album first.
 
I'm not concerned by it. It's far from the first stupid thing Trump has said. I'm more charmed by the cute attempts of people to downplay it because they think they have to.
 
I don't really think it's stupid to be honest. This is little different from typical lad banter, with the exception being he was slagging off the women she was about to meet. The media is grossly over-stating this.
 
Collin said:
I'm just waiting for Bill to apologize to those women he raped
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I'm sorry, what? Nothing was ever proven about Bill raping or sexually assaulting a woman. Ken Starr considered many of the claims given to be unreliable. So, while I admit it's possible that Bill Clinton raped someone, it's also possible that RTC is secretly a unicorn. Tossing around unproven allegations (allegations a GOP special prosecutor considered untenable during the largest political witch hunt of the current generation) to try to make them stick is irresponsible.

Whereas with Trump, the allegations stick, and his apology is not really an apology: “I’ve said some foolish things but there is a big difference between the words and actions of other people. Bill Clinton has actually abused women and Hillary has bullied, attacked, shamed and intimidated his victims. We will discuss this more in the coming days. See you at the debate on Sunday.”

Hillary has publicly stated that what happened in Benghazi was the biggest regret of her career as Secretary of State. But it is not her job to contact the family. Those people serve at the pleasure of the president, not the secretary of state - and it's the president's duty to inform and apologize (if needed) to the families of dead members of the US government.

“My biggest, you know, regret is what happened in Benghazi. It was a terrible tragedy, losing four Americans, two diplomats and now it's public, so I can say two CIA operatives, losing an ambassador like Chris Stevens, who was one of our very best and had served in Libya and across the Middle East and spoke Arabic.”

I'm not sure that Hillary is capable of external emotion, so I think that's a huge thing from her. But it's my opinion that what happened in Benghazi is really nobody's fault but the terrorists who decided to attack a US outpost. There may have been some institutional failures in the State Department, but that's standard for these sorts of attacks. Osama bin Laden was an expert at finding those holes in western security schemes, and the ISIS attackers in France and Belgium have also been quite good at it. It's not like Hillary twirled her moustache and exposed the Benghazi consulate to a terrorist attack.

So in other words, Hillary should apologize for Benghazi when George W. Bush apologizes for 9/11. No Republican has ever demanded that Bush apologize for 9/11, even though the Bush administration's institutional failures were arguably significantly deeper and preventable than the State Department's in 2012. It's completely political. I guarantee that if Mitt Romney had been president during the Benghazi attacks, no Republicans would have demanded his Secretary of State resign or be punished or whatever.

Remember this from Kevin McCarthy: “Everybody thought Hillary Clinton was unbeatable, right? But we put together a Benghazi special committee, a select committee. What are her numbers today? Her numbers are dropping. Why? Because she’s untrustable. But no one would have known any of that had happened, had we not fought.” Pretty much admitted the whole point in manufacturing a longstanding Benghazi committee was to lower Hillary's chances of success in what was then an undeclared presidential run.

So let's not equate manufactured political bullshit or untenable allegations with a presidential candidate caught on a hot mike admitting he believes he doesn't need consent to sexually touch women of his choice.
 
RTC said:
I don't really think it's stupid to be honest. This is little different from typical lad banter, with the exception being he was slagging off the women she was about to meet. The media is grossly over-stating this.
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There are different types and levels of lad banter, though. I don't recall ever telling anyone I would want to grope a woman in a certain spot.
 
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