Recycled Songs?

Mosh said:
Not sure if I agree. A similar rhythm with different chords is going to be more noticeable than the same chords over a new rhythm IMO.
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I agree with what you say here, but it's actually not addressing my point. I meant to say that if one of the two is clearly different, it makes the song clearly different. Maybe "outweighs" was the crux here.

I meant to say: The chord progression is not similar, so the songs are not really very similar either.
 
Saapanael said:
I've noticed that. So the tempo isn't exactly the same throughout the song?
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In both songs.

The choruses, the melodies, harmonies and solos are so different that I never noticed anything in common. The Duellists is a melodic masterpiece and its colourful instrumental piece brings imo more drama. Where Eagles Dare puts more accents on brutal riffs, supported by Nicko's syncopatic drumming. It's a more in your face song.

Where Eagles Dare's has moving rhythms and The Duellists moves me in a bit deeper way. ;)

I find that The Duellists is richer, and more subtle. More layers, more details in the playing (apart from the drums!), more to be discovered. On The Duellists you can hear different rhythm guitar playing (e.g. in the chorus H does long open chords, Dave follows Steve) and it has backing vocals. I am pretty sure I am hearing Adrian singing whooo hoooo.
 
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Infinite Dreams intro...The Clansman intro.

TETMD intro...Man on the Edge intro.

Man of Sorrows.=Coming Home.

No Lies...BYDTTS.

Similar chord structure from Children of the Damned.. OOTS.
 
I was under the impression that the WED - TD similarity referred to was WED (3:02 ish) and TD (2:30ish). Same pattern of 4 notes going up and down.

I have never found the Duelists to be anything special, decent sure but outstanding and worthy of such high praise certainly not. I don't think it's a masterpiece or the best few minutes of Maiden's work at all... but that's just me, personal taste and whatnot. TBH it starts to feel like it drags on for me.

I don't hear that much similarity in TETMD and MOTE personally, there's some of the same notes but that's about it.
 
Dr. Eddies Wingman said:
I agree with what you say here, but it's actually not addressing my point. I meant to say that if one of the two is clearly different, it makes the song clearly different. Maybe "outweighs" was the crux here.

I meant to say: The chord progression is not similar, so the songs are not really very similar either.
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Oh then yea, I agree with that.
 
I've always thought that, with some creative consolidating,
the band should have combined "Losfer Words" with "The Duellists"
since both tunes have that similar ("Where Eagles Dare"-like) overall feel on the same album
(or at least they should've placed them further apart in the track order).
 
Im not going to deny certain Maiden songs dont sound like other Maiden songs, theyve released 15 albums its pretty hard not to copy yourself. Same goes for Rush, i mean Headlong flight off the Clockwork Angels album has virtually the same riff as Bastille day from Carress of Steel. Same goes for Avenged Sevenfold, Coming Home from their new albums sounds exactly like 80s Maiden. Its impossible to release 15 albums and not sound similar. I always thought the singalong bit BYDTTS after the solo sound very similar to earlier Maiden I just keep forgetting the song.
 
I've noticed a certain similarity between Losfer and Duellists. Still, it's my favourite album so it's not a problem for me.
Besides, some people dislike Back in the Village because it's too different (sounds a bit like Van Halen, with that opening riff, I guess is their point), so it seems they can't win.o_O

@Perun Oh yeah, nearly forgot. Now, if we compare this with the creativity or activity of Rush...:cheers:
 
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I've always thought that Age of Innocence was basically a remake of Justice of the Peace. Not musically, but the theme is more or less recycled--kind of the old guy at the bar, bitching about the broken court system, that sort of thing. And, since Justice got scrapped, Harry probably figured nobody would notice or care.
 
Has anyone ever noticed how similar "Seventh Son" and "Mother Russia" are? In terms of melodies, tempo, and song structure they're nearly identical...
 
Lego said:
Has anyone ever noticed how similar "Seventh Son" and "Mother Russia" are? In terms of melodies, tempo, and song structure they're nearly identical...
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That's an exaggeration. The similarity I see is the transition into the instrumental part with solos. Maybe a slight resemblance in the melody of the verses. Song structure? No. Mother Russia returns to the verse after the instrumental part, and it has no long, calm build-up at the beginning of the instrumental part. The solos are also way different in style (and not just because Janick has a different style from H. Davey's solos on Mother Russia have a completely different feel than his solos in SSOASS).

So no. Not nearly identical. Mother Russia inspired by SSOASS? Definitely.
 
Dr. Eddies Wingman said:
That's an exaggeration. The similarity I see is the transition into the instrumental part with solos. Maybe a slight resemblance in the melody of the verses. Song structure? No. Mother Russia returns to the verse after the instrumental part, and it has no long, calm build-up at the beginning of the instrumental part. The solos are also way different in style (and not just because Janick has a different style from H. Davey's solos on Mother Russia have a completely different feel than his solos in SSOASS).

So no. Not nearly identical. Mother Russia inspired by SSOASS? Definitely.
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Ok, I just took another listen to both. I guess that is a bit exaggerated ;) I think it's mainly the transition to the solos, and the faster section under the solos right before the song returns to the verse. The intro of MR is also quite similar to the quiet middle section of SSOASS.
 
I can never stop hearing the "the time will come..." part of TTAL whenever I hear the "the curse it lives on..." part of ROTAM. The preceding basslines before both of those sections and just the overall feel strikes similarities to me
 
It's not that interesting to list songs that "kind of" sounds the same to someone. They may share a tempo and a chord sequence, but that doesn't make the song itself recycled. It's the melodies and lyrics that are copyrighted. If sounding similar or using the same chords was a crime there would be no original songs left to write. For an example, pretty much all of A Matter of Life and Death is in E minor and have a i-VI-III-VII-chord sequence somewhere - chorus of "These Colours Don't Run" and verse of "For the Greater Good of God" for example. I don't know if you've seen the popular Youtube-video where they sing boatloads of hit-songs over the same four chords? That's the same chords.

What's more interesting to me at least are the old dusted off songs from previous bands the members' been in or flat out stolen songs. Here are some examples:

"The Mercenary" is a song demoed by White Spirit in 1981 with different lyrics. It's known by the title "Til the Kill" on the internet, but has no official release. I read on a forum that it was a rehearsal tape made in 1981 that someone ripped and put on bootleg-sites with made-up titles.

"When Two Worlds Collide" contains a guitar melody found in another song on the same demo. Interestingly enough, Janick has no writing credit on "Collide".

"Montsegur" recycled the guitar-harmony of "Born in '58" from Bruce Dickinsons Tattooed Millionaire.

"Hallowed be Thy Name" and "The Nomad" are stolen from the song "Life's Shadow" by Beckett, released in 1974. Lyrics of "Hallowed" are a straight plagiarism.

Blaze Bayley claim uncredited involvement on "Blood Brothers".

(Just speculation, but I would guess Adrian Smith's new version of "The Wicker Man" intro riff on the 2013 tour comes from the striking similarities to "Running Wild" by Judas Priest.)
 
Maturin said:
(Just speculation, but I would guess Adrian Smith's new version of "The Wicker Man" intro riff on the 2013 tour comes from the striking similarities to "Running Wild" by Judas Priest.)
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There's actually a big bunch of songs which have that riff. There's even a Youtube video on that. Of course, Smith might have still changed it up because of the similarities.
 
Saapanael said:
There's actually a big bunch of songs which have that riff. There's even a Youtube video on that. Of course, Smith might have still changed it up because of the similarities.
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I know, and I put it in paranthesis because of it. It's really not important, and I only mentioned it because Adrian changed it. The main riff of "2 Minutes to Midnight" is perhaps even more common, also being recorded by White Spirit as "Midnight Chaser" on their debut album in 1980. And before and and after by a bunch of other bands... Not the same riff, but slightly varied each time.

Lego said:
Plus they didn't record to a click track... Nicko tends to, um, interpret tempos in a very free-flowing manner...
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It's Steve who's pushing the tempo. Nicko lets it happen, yes, but Steve's bass is always slightly ahead of the kick. Had they recorded to a click-track, they would have lost this entirely. Take "The Wicker Man" or "Lord of Light" as examples. It's so wrong... But it makes the songs feel so eager that I can't help but love it.

Kevin Shirley commented on this, and named it as his main reason for letting the band record "live" in the studio.
 
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