PhantomOfTheOpera
Ancient Mariner
Definitely! I hoped it to be played on "Somewhere Back In Time World Tour", but no and I was so disappointed, there must be some other reason from them keeping the few fan favorites out of setlists..
Legacy of the Beast 2018 Tour
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Definitely! I hoped it to be played on "Somewhere Back In Time World Tour", but no and I was so disappointed, there must be some other reason from them keeping the few fan favorites out of setlists..
Operations666
Educated Fool
Bruce can still sing anything well
enough. He’s proven that over and over again. And if they could play the guitar parts well enough in 1986, they can do so now (especially with a 3rd guitarist).
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Deleted member 7164
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This song isn't vocally too challenging (on Maiden scale), and the Gallien Krueger infused sound doesn't play a part here.
I find the argument for SiT sound stack and live replication a bit moot. This sound, e.g. GK's built in stereo chorus and a plethora of room reverb are essential for things like chord picks on chanting part of HCW, middle part of Sea Of Madness, and all those soaring chords on Wasted Years chorus, etc... And solos. When you start with usual downpicking or gallop that sound doesn't play a part. Consider that most of these are already adapted to regular Marshall stacks and you'll soon figure out why they don't play Caught Somewhere in Time. That gallop doesn't work slower than album tempo, which is obviously a McBrain problem nowadays and his refusal to use double bass.
Lego
Ancient Mariner
Nicko doesn't need a double pedal to play that bass drum part.
I don't even think Bruce's original studio rendition of CSIT was all that solid, let alone how he would handle it today. He's still a powerful singer, but the vocal techniques he's the strongest with don't feature heavily in that song. The whole album sounds like musicians having some real experimental fun but not putting as much thought into vocals or lyrics.
Ruflux
Ancient Mariner
Well he's not pulling it off at his age without one either. Not consistently on tour and in a full set, at least. Note how The Trooper's gallop has become less and less heavy on the bass drum over the years, for example. Now consider CSiT is about similar speed but far longer and there's no real room for breaks there. And he actually mentioned that he considered it a pretty intense track to play in the 80s too.
If we were talking about this in say 2001, then sure, he'd totally pull it off no problem. But not anymore, being realistic.
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Deleted member 7164
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Yes he does, it lasts 5 minutes. This isn't 1987.
The verse lines feature less syllables per beat than usual Harris stuff, there's a lot of air in between words and I don't see much difference between it and veses of Book of Thel. Time is always on my side and caught somewhere in time lines can be cheated, transposed, stopped for mid air breaths and everything else he does all the time. The chant part of Book of Thel is highly complicated to do, but he cheated it live, it had breath stops but done in a very rhythmic way.
However Dickinson was not fond of SiT, SiT era, he would sometimes botch the lyrics of this song back in the day live and it's quite possible that he's just not keen on doing it.
Manofsorrows
I know what i want
I know, but it seems that they really know everything about the band, better albums I know but by far... Everyone has different tastesNo ones acting like an expert at all just sharing opinions. I mean how scandalous that some people don’t revere somewhere in time, what an utter crime!
I don’t think it’s one of maidens best. I enjoy it a lot but there are far better Maiden albums than somewhere in time. Just my opinion of course, I’m no expert
Somewhere In Time is Bruce's weakest vocal performance in the 80s by a huge long shot.
Manofsorrows
I know what i want
Ir you're talking about the tour, yes. There Is a horrible version of hallowed be thy name on youtube
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Deleted member 7164
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? That's due to him being ill at the time of that gig. And people are looking at all sorts of gigs because we don't have "proper" SoT footage. At least read the comments below.
Live after death is one of the worst Bruce performances in history but nobody is speaking about that. Try to listen to some Powerslave tour boots and you'll see that Bruce was already in bad shape on that tour.
Here's a good performance
Live after death is one of the worst Bruce performances in history but nobody is speaking about that. Try to listen to some Powerslave tour boots and you'll see that Bruce was already in bad shape on that tour.
Here's a good performance
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Deleted member 7164
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Sure if you count in all the Martin Birch magic that went into previous releases, such as multi tracked Aces High chorus done in 666 takes that was never ever rendered live (Bruce can neither provide the non-strained texture or hit the note on the last one), or the Duellists chorus harmony, again never performed live, and so on. There are some awesome vocal parts on SiT, there are some run of the mill ones, but it's pretty much ok by 1980s standards. Again, out of the 4 songs chiefly played from Powerslave, he sucked badly live on two (AH and ROTAM).
As far as I'm concerned, Dickinson's best 80s performance is Piece of Mind and the subsequent tour. He was too green before that (check out 2nd chorus of Prisoner at Hammersmith, that high note was missed so bad it hurts), and he fried his voice on WST.
Again, I'm more leaning to the side that Bruce didn't want to put in 110% to SiT and tour and that's why some stuff sounds vocally lame.
I'm not thinking about actual ability to get the words out and (more or less) hit the notes, I mean it would be devoid of style and polish, at least for Bruce's own preferences. There are certain things he does, like relying on longer notes, especially at the end of a line if nowhere else, to properly engage his voice to its full potential. If all else fails, he can drop back to a highly stylised theatrical vocal style, as with Powerslave live. I don't think those tricks would get a look in with CSIT.
So while Bruce might not like SIT stuff partly because it wasn't his baby, SIT material also doesn't help him out much with his job, because it was written without too much attention to his vocals. Plus, if SIT was a bit of fun for Steve and Adrian in particular, they might have simply got that out of their system and left it behind.
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Deleted member 7164
Guest
I agree. Still TRATB for instance has horrendous vocals, I mean those verse lines are pain itself. But it's a product placement and vocalist break song, so it's good for him. Smith was still big on SiT about a decade ago, i think it was Early Days or AMOLAD phase when somebody interviewed them and asked to pick up favourite album from the bunch. Smith picked up SiT, so I don't think it was a fad for him.
I mean, I love SiT and can't believe that someone would rate an album full of compressed guitars, sampled drums, Virtual XI leftovers, and general musical theft higher than it, but alas 100 people 100 tastes. Realistically speaking I'd like them to do more songs from that album (BNW) nowadays than SiT. Stranger would be awesome live today, maybe Sea Of Madness too but that's about it. The ferocity needed for CSiT and Loneliness is long gone.
I mean, I love SiT and can't believe that someone would rate an album full of compressed guitars, sampled drums, Virtual XI leftovers, and general musical theft higher than it, but alas 100 people 100 tastes. Realistically speaking I'd like them to do more songs from that album (BNW) nowadays than SiT. Stranger would be awesome live today, maybe Sea Of Madness too but that's about it. The ferocity needed for CSiT and Loneliness is long gone.
Forostar
Ancient Mariner
But never performed that well. SIT is probably Maiden's most difficult music to play. The boys were at their top.
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Deleted member 7164
Guest
What's your take on the sub par performances? I can put it down to 4 things. Live sound, not sticking to original tempos, lack of third guitar and lackluster performance. I think 2 and 3 are chiefly to blame. If they played original tempos and had rhythm guitar that was layered on the record but wasn't available live, it would automatically sound twice as better.
CSiT after the intro, like Aces High, blasts directly into a guitar harmony. But it doesn't work live without the guitar galloping behind it. Sure I never saw it live and I can't tell that Harris bass sound didn't fill up the venue with decibels but it's not something you can experience without the mega loud setting.
Dickinson did praise Stranger a few times. Remember those SiT release interviews where he breaks down the songs. He would spend just a line or two for songs like CSiT, SoM, Alex, but he would talk more detail about WY and Stranger. Also remarked that SIASL is Purplesque. Unless he was explicitly advertising the album singles I'd say he likes those songs and doesn't like the rest of the album much.
CSiT after the intro, like Aces High, blasts directly into a guitar harmony. But it doesn't work live without the guitar galloping behind it. Sure I never saw it live and I can't tell that Harris bass sound didn't fill up the venue with decibels but it's not something you can experience without the mega loud setting.
Dickinson did praise Stranger a few times. Remember those SiT release interviews where he breaks down the songs. He would spend just a line or two for songs like CSiT, SoM, Alex, but he would talk more detail about WY and Stranger. Also remarked that SIASL is Purplesque. Unless he was explicitly advertising the album singles I'd say he likes those songs and doesn't like the rest of the album much.
soundwave
Educated Fool
Good point on the galloping guitar on CSIT live. The bootlegs sound kinda tame as it's just Steve. Most of the time, his galloping bass is perfectly fine, but this is one of those songs that needs those extra layers.
Also agree on the live sound as being a big issue. Maiden's overall live sound is pretty good...but SIT was such a polished/produced record and the reverb-y Gallien Krueger tone was an integral part of it. I don't think they ever captured that for that tour. I definitely can't see them doing it justice now given their current, dry Marshall tone.
Ruflux
Ancient Mariner
I disagree with pretty much all of this. The issue with tempos in Maiden has definitely been overblown in particular. No, a song doesn't suddenly sound like crap because they play it sped up live, and it's not a Maiden thing so much as it is a music thing. Every band does it, unless they play to a click or something. CSiT sounds far better when they ramp up the speed, like in that Chicago take above. The original sounds outright lifeless in comparison, and the difference in tempo is hardly massive. The Trooper is another example of a song that really only comes to life live, because they're not afraid to speed it up some.
And rhythm guitar has nothing to do with it either. Sure, having the harmony only makes it sound a bit emptier, but really, it's just a short gallop section riff that's missing. It isn't really life-altering.
No. The reason SiT songs don't really sound that great live is because of Bruce. That video you posted? He sounds terrible throughout the show. He can't come even close to reaching the notes in even the opening track, let alone the rest of the performance. He's basically like this in every bootleg from Somewhere on Tour, apart from the earliest ones. Considering the dramatic shift by the second Sheffield show, I imagine the given explanation of a very, very persistent cold or throat infection is the reason, but it probably does also have to do with a lack of technique and a relentless schedule.
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