Kevin Shirley - What do you dislike about his work with Maiden? (if you do)

Dick Brucinson

Dick Brucinson

The TRUE Dick Brucinson
Many people dislike the Kevin Shirley produced Maiden albums, so do I. So I thought it might be interesting to have a discussion and hear opinions. Here we go.
What do you have to criticize the most about his productions?
 
Generally, he's a good producer, but not for a metal band and metal music. He isn't into it. Kevin's works sound muddy, too muffled, and too bluesy imho. Metal is about sounding crisp, heavy, and punching. Shirley's productions just don't fit into that. Producing metal music isn't easy; you must feel and understand the idea of "wall of sound" without destroying the clarity and detailed aspects of sound (particularly the sibilants). That's all on behalf of myself.
 
I think Brave New World is actually their best sounding album. Huge and epic. Unfortunately Steve's "make everything sound raw" influence has crept in more and more as time goes on, so it's been a downward slope since then.
 
I don’t like that he seems like a Yes man. (If he really is—because we don’t know for sure how he interacts with Steve.) I’d want him to speak up and say, 'This part needs heavy trimming' or 'This just sounds bad.' Or simply: 'Steve, get out of my laboratory!'
In my opinion, none of the reunion albums come close to the sound quality of the '82–'88 records.
 
Trevoire said:
I think Brave New World is actually their best sounding album. Huge and epic. Unfortunately Steve's "make everything sound raw" influence has crept in more and more as time goes on, so it's been a downward slope since then.
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You mean best of Shirley's Maiden productions, or best of all Maiden albums?
 
I don't dislike Kevin's work with Maiden, but I definitely prefer Martin Birch's work. But Martin Birch did have the advantage of working with a younger Maiden, who were more open to suggestions and he also did not have to mix 3 full time guitars. My main issue with some of Kevin's work is the guitar sound, which can be muddy and I think the different guitar sounds don't always work well together.
 
For Shirley's faults, and I do recognise them, he has done a great job of balancing the competing demands of an incredibly demanding, set in their ways band, with a famously distinctive sound, alongside the need to make Maiden fit in with modern music.

Whether you like the sound or not it's stubbornly Iron Maiden - for better or worse.

But above all, given how bad the production is (IMO) on everything from No Prayer to VXi, I'll take Kev's muddy mixes every day of the week and be thankful
 
Dick Brucinson said:
You mean best of Shirley's Maiden productions, or best of all Maiden albums?
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Definitely the best of Shirleys, and maybe the best of all (I'd need to go back a re-listen back to back with the rest) It's the kick up the arse that they needed for the modern era and suits the songs really well.

Killers sounds really good, definitely one of the best sounding 80's albums. Though the songs aren't very strong.
 
The lack of power in the mix (since 2006) and the raw sound of the guitars/riffs. Even the drums, but they have their charm. Maybe with 3 guitars is different and tricky.
 
Trevoire said:
I think Brave New World is actually their best sounding album. Huge and epic. Unfortunately Steve's "make everything sound raw" influence has crept in more and more as time goes on, so it's been a downward slope since then.
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This. Bruce wanted a top producer for the reunion album, and they got a great sounding album in BNW. After that, Bruce got cozy again, didn't put his foot down anymore, and Steve got his fingers back in the proverbial cooking pot. Shirley's a fine producer, but he very quickly just started giving Steve the sound he wanted whether it sounded good or not. That, and as mentioned above, it doesn't seem like he gives any input (or is ignored) when it comes to trimming down some overlong arrangements. For example, what is it...a few minutes trimmed from Senjutsu could've resulted it fitting on one disc? C'mon, man.
 
I think Kev's first three albums with Maiden were great, BNW, DOD and AMOLAD. They sound like a like a live band, but sonically the sound is still tight and punchy. Flight 666 was mixed by Kevin too and it is a great sounding live album.. But TFF, BOS and Senjutsu are all just a bit dry and lifeless to me - they just sound a bit 'flat' sounding (not in pitch..). Some tracks are nice but I think that's more down to the instrumentation..

If there's to be a new Maiden album - sonically speaking I would just like to hear it a bit punchier and produced. Not much, but just to 'clean it up' a little bit. I think they should let Adrian have a bit more influence on the mix - it's been noted many times before that he wants it to sound a little bit more polished while Steve would rather release a 'good enough' mix without even mastering ha!

While it's a bit different in genre - if anyone here is a fan of Karnivool - I would be so thrilled to hear a Maiden album recorded mixed and produced like Karnivool (specifically Sound Awake album...)
 
Kalata said:
The lack of power in the mix (since 2006) and the raw sound of the guitars/riffs. Even the drums, but they have their charm. Maybe with 3 guitars is different and tricky.
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Nah, there’s three guitars or more on most of the 80s albums. Other producers don’t have a problem with it.
 
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Some of you guys complaining about the weak guitar mix should listen to TXF. It could be WAY worse. Sounds like blaze is singing over an isolated bass and drum track and Janick and Dave are playing through an answering phone message in the next room.
 
Azas said:
I don’t like that he seems like a Yes man. (If he really is—because we don’t know for sure how he interacts with Steve.) I’d want him to speak up and say, 'This part needs heavy trimming' or 'This just sounds bad.' Or simply: 'Steve, get out of my laboratory!'
In my opinion, none of the reunion albums come close to the sound quality of the '82–'88 records.
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Exactly this. A good producer should rein the band in, which he is absolutely reluctant to do. Which means the albums sound and end up quite randomly, according to how well has 'Arry slept or how deaf he was that particular morning. I really like how BNW and AMOLAD sound, but it's most likely by chance, as TBOS and Senjutsu sound literally un-produced, as if he clocked out completely and Dance of Death is one of the worst sounding albums I've ever heard by a band I like.
 
JudasMyGuide said:
Exactly this. A good producer should rein the band in, which he is absolutely reluctant to do. Which means the albums sound and end up quite randomly, according to how well has 'Arry slept or how deaf he was that particular morning. I really like how BNW and AMOLAD sound, but it's most likely by chance, as TBOS and Senjutsu sound literally un-produced, as if he clocked out completely and Dance of Death is one of the worst sounding albums I've ever heard by a band I like.
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If only the whole Senjutsu album had the audio quality of The Writing On The Wall.
 
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