Iron Maiden's management: What went wrong?

But on the subject of Maiden being poorly managed. First, I think it's little bit trolling.

Like others I agree that Maiden is second or third (depending on how to view Black Sabbath) after Metallica in metal. AC/DC, G'n'R aren't metal, Rammstein is also different kind of music entity (although I admit they are bigger than Maiden). Maiden is definitely bigger than Judas Priest. Only one that is debatable is Black Sabbath, I think thanks to Ozzy's image in early years and also (and maybe mostly) the tv show Ozzy and Black Sabbath might be more well known than Maiden.

But if we discuss Rod's role and management, then the question should be - what is the importance of Maiden being bigger and also by that if Maiden has been poorly managed?

Why would you want Maiden to be bigger? I can't speak for others, but I certainly would not want them to be bigger. Why, you may ask? Firstly, and foremost it would mean they would be doing more stadium/outdoor shows and that is not something I am fan of. On this RFYL tour as I looked the venues, I already knew that Helsinki show is something I am not interested in, although it was the closest destination, the summer outdoor venue just isn't the same. Basically whole show in broad daylight - it just takes away some of the magic. Metallica and Rammstein (who are attracting more people to their shows than Maiden) have played shows in Estonia, have done in outdoor venues and well it's just bad. Summer, late sunset and outdoor show don't go together, they just don't. And now imagine all of Maiden shows every summer are outdoors, no thank you.

Secondly, the tickets would be much harder to get if Maiden would be more popular. Some shows on this upcoming tour sold out quite fast, but Maiden being more mainstream would mean tickets would have sold out even faster.

So, the answer to the question - has Maiden reached it's full potential under Rod - would be what is there to gain if they would have gone more mainstream. What would be better if Rod managed them better or even if someone else managed them. I am quite happy where they are and how are they doing. If they would be bigger, I'm not sure I would enjoy them and their shows as much as I do now. Would your life be better if you know your band is bigger, more mainstream, more famous, more richer, inducted to Rock'n'roll hall of fame, performing at Grammys and so on and so on. For me, it doesn't matter, I am enjoying the music our boys are creating (hopefully another album) and the shows they are performing (the more in the indoor venues the better).

And so for you (and all the others) aswell, don't worry about their mainstream status, just enjoy them while we still can and let's celebrate their 50 years of existence.
 
Ben Beast said:
But on the subject of Maiden being poorly managed. First, I think it's little bit trolling.

Like others I agree that Maiden is second or third (depending on how to view Black Sabbath) after Metallica in metal. AC/DC, G'n'R aren't metal, Rammstein is also different kind of music entity (although I admit they are bigger than Maiden). Maiden is definitely bigger than Judas Priest. Only one that is debatable is Black Sabbath, I think thanks to Ozzy's image in early years and also (and maybe mostly) the tv show Ozzy and Black Sabbath might be more well known than Maiden.

But if we discuss Rod's role and management, then the question should be - what is the importance of Maiden being bigger and also by that if Maiden has been poorly managed?

Why would you want Maiden to be bigger? I can't speak for others, but I certainly would not want them to be bigger. Why, you may ask? Firstly, and foremost it would mean they would be doing more stadium/outdoor shows and that is not something I am fan of. On this RFYL tour as I looked the venues, I already knew that Helsinki show is something I am not interested in, although it was the closest destination, the summer outdoor venue just isn't the same. Basically whole show in broad daylight - it just takes away some of the magic. Metallica and Rammstein (who are attracting more people to their shows than Maiden) have played shows in Estonia, have done in outdoor venues and well it's just bad. Summer, late sunset and outdoor show don't go together, they just don't. And now imagine all of Maiden shows every summer are outdoors, no thank you.

Secondly, the tickets would be much harder to get if Maiden would be more popular. Some shows on this upcoming tour sold out quite fast, but Maiden being more mainstream would mean tickets would have sold out even faster.

So, the answer to the question - has Maiden reached it's full potential under Rod - would be what is there to gain if they would have gone more mainstream. What would be better if Rod managed them better or even if someone else managed them. I am quite happy where they are and how are they doing. If they would be bigger, I'm not sure I would enjoy them and their shows as much as I do now. Would your life be better if you know your band is bigger, more mainstream, more famous, more richer, inducted to Rock'n'roll hall of fame, performing at Grammys and so on and so on. For me, it doesn't matter, I am enjoying the music our boys are creating (hopefully another album) and the shows they are performing (the more in the indoor venues the better).

And so for you (and all the others) aswell, don't worry about their mainstream status, just enjoy them while we still can and let's celebrate their 50 years of existence.
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Bigger? Next step is Metallica. But maiden fill stadiums too
 
I’d argue they never went wrong despite not being as mainstream or grossing as much total revenue as Metallica.

Look at Maiden’s longevity and ability to consistently fill arenas globally on long tours that feature both new material and classics.

Maiden has achieved success in cross-channel marketing, with Eddie as one of the most recognizable heavy metal icons.

From a total album sales perspective Metallica’s sold 125-130 Million, Maiden 100-120 Million, Priest about 50 Million.

Touring:
Metallica: 23-24: $305.2M from 43 shows
Maiden 23-24: $93.1M from 71 shows
Priest: hasn’t toured since 2022 and played smaller (sub-5k seat) venues.


No real numbers I could dig up on merchandising revenue.
 
Mosh said:
Iron Maiden’s success is undeniable, but when you compare their popularity to bands like Metallica and Judas Priest, it's clear they've never quite reached the same mainstream level. A big part of that comes down to the band's management, particularly Rod Smallwood, who has been behind Iron Maiden's operations for decades. While Smallwood has certainly helped keep the band’s core identity intact, his decisions have often held them back from achieving the kind of mass appeal that Metallica or Priest managed to capture.

One of the biggest issues is Iron Maiden’s branding. While they’ve got a killer image with Eddie and iconic album covers, they’ve never really pushed themselves into the mainstream in the way Metallica did with their more commercial sound and strategic media presence. Smallwood’s refusal to change the band’s image or embrace more modern trends in the '90s and beyond meant they stayed within a niche, never breaking out beyond metal circles. Metallica, for example, made key changes like working with producer Bob Rock for the Black Album and getting major radio airplay, which broadened their appeal. Judas Priest also made smarter moves by experimenting with their sound and staying relevant to hard rock audiences, while Maiden stuck to their formula.

Smallwood's management also failed to push Iron Maiden into the media spotlight as effectively as Metallica did. While Metallica was all over MTV and late-night talk shows, Iron Maiden stayed more reserved, often keeping their media appearances limited to the hardcore metal scene. This lack of mainstream exposure kept them from reaching new audiences. Even when their songs were radio-friendly, their management didn't make the necessary push for radio play or mass media coverage.

On the touring front, Iron Maiden’s approach was also more conservative. While Metallica and Judas Priest were constantly expanding into new global markets, Maiden stuck to the same formula, reaching their loyal fanbase but missing opportunities to grow in emerging regions. Metallica’s world tours, which included stops in markets like South America and Asia, helped solidify them as a global force. Meanwhile, Smallwood often kept Maiden's touring strategy limited, not always capitalizing on the right moments or new opportunities. It’s a shame, really, because Maiden had all the potential to be the Metallica of the ‘80s and ‘90s, if only their management had taken a more dynamic approach.

I'm curious what everybody else thinks though. Discuss!
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Maiden are definitely on a bigger level than Judas Priest.
 
Mosh said:
Iron Maiden has a massive, dedicated following but Judas Priest has undeniably had more mainstream success, particularly in the U.S. with hits like Living After Midnight and You Got Another Thing Comin’. Maiden, on the other hand, has missed opportunities for broader commercial success. Tracks like Run to the Hills and The Number of the Beast are popular yes, but they focused more on shaping the band’s identity than breaking into wider radio play.

In the long run, Rod Smallwood’s management approach has been a key factor in holding Iron Maiden back from achieving the global superstardom they could have reached. Unlike Judas Priest, who found a way to balance their metal roots with radio-friendly singles and broader appeal, Smallwood’s focus on maintaining Maiden’s niche identity prevented the band from expanding their visibility beyond their loyal fanbase.
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Maiden definitely have had much, much more higher charting hits than Judas Priest. I agree with @Azas here I think you're having a laugh with this thread.
 
dickinson1978 said:
Bigger? Next step is Metallica. But maiden fill stadiums too
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Let's focus on facts and reliable (important) indications:
1. Album sales official data:
Judas Priest: over 55 mln
Black Sabbath: circa 80 mln
Iron Maiden: well over 100 mln, still silver, gold, and platinum discs to receive (after 2021)
2. Live shows:
Judas Priest: mid and big arenas in EU/UK, co-headlining, more support acts, headlining just some festivals, often performing as the second or third attraction of the event.
Black Sabbath (as active touring act): without Ozzy (12 years) - small arenas, theatres, opening for other acts, the second or third attraction of the festivals. With Ozzy - big arenas, headlining some of the biggest festivals, sometimes stadiums
Iron Maiden: big arenas around the whole world, regular stadium tours in Europe, and Latin/South America, sometimes open air shows in other parts of the world, headlining the biggest rock or even music festivals around the world, including festival series as Monsters of Rock, Sonisphere, Soundwave Festivals among others. And that all repeated many times in a row, consecutive touring year after year. Some shows with the biggest attendance ever for the metal band, many consecutive sold-out arena shows, or even double stadium shows. They toured extensively without attractive support acts and so-called co-headlining slots with big names.
3. Merchandise/alternative offers:
Judas Priest: standard, some interesting items
Black Sabbath: standard, some interesting items
Iron Maiden: still growing, gargantuan offer of standard merch, special merch lines in co-operation with the biggest labels in the world: Marvel, Nike, Puma, Monopoly, Triumph, Sport Wear, among so many others. Their imagery is iconic. Eddie is undisputably the most recognizable monster ever produced by a music band. Period.

The whole discussion about the commercial success of IM in comparison with Priest or even Sabbath is pointless. And YES, Sabbs are bigger in the States (mostly as Ozzy's additional incarnation), but finally - they played to smaller crowds (with fewer gigs combined), just some stadiums, and sold 78 - 80 mln copies of albums in comparition with 120 - 130 mln IM result. And... thousands and thousands more times we could read in professional articles, IM is the biggest metal band UK's ever spawned and one of Britain’s most influential and biggest-selling bands. Priests are jealous of them, but even K. K. Downing, who had a hidden resentment towards them, admitted in his autobiography IM reached heights which Priest never did. I feel a respect for him as being honest.
Anyway, Rod isn't the most ambitious and maybe not the best manager in history, but he helped a non-commercial, independent band achieve big commercial success completely on their own. He is the independent manager who cares about "his boys," not the corporate-oriented bloodsucker with billion billion-dollar budget as Q Prime Management (Metallica, GNR, AC/DC. etc.) This changed a lot.

Sheriff_of_Huddersfield said:
I’d argue they never went wrong despite not being as mainstream or grossing as much total revenue as Metallica.
Look at Maiden’s longevity and ability to consistently fill arenas globally on long tours that feature both new material and classics.

Maiden has achieved success in cross-channel marketing, with Eddie as one of the most recognizable heavy metal icons.

From a total album sales perspective Metallica’s sold 125-130 Million, Maiden 100-120 Million, Priest about 50 Million.

Touring:
Metallica: 23-24: $305.2M from 43 shows
Maiden 23-24: $93.1M from 71 shows
Priest: hasn’t toured since 2022 and played smaller (sub-5k seat) venues.


No real numbers I could dig up on merchandising revenue.
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Sheriff - thx a lot, you nailed it!
 
It's hard to determine if anything went wrong without knowing what the band's goals were. Rod is ultimately Maiden's employee, I imagine he's tasked with executing the band's vision. I don't know what that vision is, but I'm inclined to believe he's been successful at executing it due to his still being employed as Maiden's manager.
 
Nomadd said:
Let's focus on facts and reliable (important) indications:
1. Album sales official data:
Judas Priest: over 55 mln
Black Sabbath: circa 80 mln
Iron Maiden: well over 100 mln, still silver, gold, and platinum discs to receive (after 2021)
2. Live shows:
Judas Priest: mid and big arenas in EU/UK, co-headlining, more support acts, headlining just some festivals, often performing as the second or third attraction of the event.
Black Sabbath (as active touring act): without Ozzy (12 years) - small arenas, theatres, opening for other acts, the second or third attraction of the festivals. With Ozzy - big arenas, headlining some of the biggest festivals, sometimes stadiums
Iron Maiden: big arenas around the whole world, regular stadium tours in Europe, and Latin/South America, sometimes open air shows in other parts of the world, headlining the biggest rock or even music festivals around the world, including festival series as Monsters of Rock, Sonisphere, Soundwave Festivals among others. And that all repeated many times in a row, consecutive touring year after year. Some shows with the biggest attendance ever for the metal band, many consecutive sold-out arena shows, or even double stadium shows. They toured extensively without attractive support acts and so-called co-headlining slots with big names.
3. Merchandise/alternative offers:
Judas Priest: standard, some interesting items
Black Sabbath: standard, some interesting items
Iron Maiden: still growing, gargantuan offer of standard merch, special merch lines in co-operation with the biggest labels in the world: Marvel, Nike, Puma, Monopoly, Triumph, Sport Wear, among so many others. Their imagery is iconic. Eddie is undisputably the most recognizable monster ever produced by a music band. Period.

The whole discussion about the commercial success of IM in comparison with Priest or even Sabbath is pointless. And YES, Sabbs are bigger in the States (mostly as Ozzy's additional incarnation), but finally - they played to smaller crowds (with fewer gigs combined), just some stadiums, and sold 78 - 80 mln copies of albums in comparition with 120 - 130 mln IM result. And... thousands and thousands more times we could read in professional articles, IM is the biggest metal band UK's ever spawned and one of Britain’s most influential and biggest-selling bands. Priests are jealous of them, but even K. K. Downing, who had a hidden resentment towards them, admitted in his autobiography IM reached heights which Priest never did. I feel a respect for him as being honest.
Anyway, Rod isn't the most ambitious and maybe not the best manager in history, but he helped a non-commercial, independent band achieve big commercial success completely on their own. He is the independent manager who cares about "his boys," not the corporate-oriented bloodsucker with billion billion-dollar budget as Q Prime Management (Metallica, GNR, AC/DC. etc.) This changed a lot.


Sheriff - thx a lot, you nailed it!
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I agree 100%. And the plane thing and many other things.
 
Metallica has ballads dealing with emotions of one person that people can relate to. Iron Maiden writes about religion, wars and mythology with very few songs you could even consider ballads.
 
Patrick92 said:
Who gives a shit honestly
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For me watching iron maiden playing in my football team stadium was like winning a league. After watching them in a small football stadium in a small town in spain in 96.they couldnt use the backdrops due the wind,all the stage looked bad and i grew up with those awesome stages that i watched on the videos so Im happy for them to be like they are now
 
These are my opinion only:

Iron maiden have done what they want always, in large thanks to Rod they have been successful at their own premises. I think they did well, and still do very well with their tactic. They have never chased "writing a hit song".

Judas priest have done that several times, chasing trends. They have had some success at times, but nowadays they are "just" an established metal band. They have their fans. Glenn even asked his kids what music that were popular in 2000, so even Demolition is not from their heart, just what is popular on radio. And Jane Andrews is very arrogant and have no soul either.

Metallica are their own thing; they wanted to be big and popular even within thrash metal, they spent lots of money on recording with Bob Rock, tried writing songs with more melody and hooks, and became very successful with that. They try hard to please as many fans as possible, but it is impossible. I think Q Prime only have a supporting role regarding their strategy, and Lars is behind their decisions, both good and bad. They certainly did something right when you want to be as succesful as possible.

So no, IM management have not failed in any means :bigsmile:
 
Sth2112 said:
These are my opinion only:

Iron maiden have done what they want always, in large thanks to Rod they have been successful at their own premises. I think they did well, and still do very well with their tactic. They have never chased "writing a hit song".

Judas priest have done that several times, chasing trends. They have had some success at times, but nowadays they are "just" an established metal band. They have their fans. Glenn even asked his kids what music that were popular in 2000, so even Demolition is not from their heart, just what is popular on radio. And Jane Andrews is very arrogant and have no soul either.

Metallica are their own thing; they wanted to be big and popular even within thrash metal, they spent lots of money on recording with Bob Rock, tried writing songs with more melody and hooks, and became very successful with that. They try hard to please as many fans as possible, but it is impossible. I think Q Prime only have a supporting role regarding their strategy, and Lars is behind their decisions, both good and bad. They certainly did something right when you want to be as succesful as possible.

So no, IM management have not failed in any means :bigsmile:
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I know Sabbath’s only being compared incidentally here but, during their original lineup decade or so in the 70s, even Iommi started to chase trends.

This is why Sabotage, while containing genre influencing tracks like “Symptom of the Universe,” sounded so different and more mid-70s heavy rock compared to Sabbath’s first 5 albums and why, even prior, Sabbath Bloody Sabbath started to exhibit some departure from the first four.

Even Iommi’s autobiography discusses his ambition to make Sabbath as big or bigger than Led Zeppelin (was at the time), which affected his musical direction.

I’d say that Ozzy’s solo career, post Randy Rbodes, took a marketing track centering on Ozzy as the “wild man” of metal. While Ozzy produced excellent solo material with a consistent sound and theme despite relying on spotlit studio musicians (again post RR), Sabbath’s post-Ozzy journey included more trend chasing.

Ozzy’s fame, however, diverged from purely music into being a general celebrity personality.

I love early Sabbath but they’re also a case study of not only how drug abuse affects a band but how trend chasing doesn’t improve their music.
 
Iron Maiden are more popular nowadays and they never went mainstream (maybe NPFTD was their attempt on mainstream and didn't go well except Daughter which was a hit back then but didn't age that well). I don't think Maiden chased trends at any point, but Priest and Sabbath obviously did. Ozzy has a reality show, of course he's the most famous metal singer. If you look at the numbers though, Ozzy's latest album (patient number 9) has an EAS of 82k (nobody cared really) and Senjutsu had 653k.
 
I agree with many of Moshes points but replace Rod with Steve and here you have it. It's not about Rod, it's about Steve. Metallica changed because they wanted to change. There's no coach that will make miracles if team is not willing to follow. Blaming Rod for mismanagement is like blaming Kevin for the sound, frankly. Neither has the control required to be held accountable to way Mosh held Rob.
 
dickinson1978 said:
For me watching iron maiden playing in my football team stadium was like winning a league. After watching them in a small football stadium in a small town in spain in 96.they couldnt use the backdrops due the wind,all the stage looked bad and i grew up with those awesome stages that i watched on the videos so Im happy for them to be like they are now
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I'm honestly really happy with where Maiden's at in terms of popularity. I just think it’s kinda dumb how people keep bringing up this Maiden vs Metallica thing, like “why isn’t Maiden as big?” or whatever. Who even cares? Maiden’s already huge.

But like, do people really want them to be like Metallica or KISS? I love Metallica, but their whole way of doing things just feels like too much sometimes. It kinda annoys me seeing them everywhere—on TV with hosts like Jimmy Kimmel, or releasing stuff like the Blacklist with all those covers, or dropping a music video for every song on their last album. Like the whole Black Album celebration... I don’t know, it’s just too much for me. I don’t want all that. I actually prefer less content.

That’s one of the things I like about Maiden—they don’t flood us with stuff, and to me that makes them feel more real. Like, they’re not trying to squeeze every little bit out of the Iron Maiden name. It makes me kinda proud to be a fan of a band that still feels grounded.

Like this new documentary that’s coming out—I’ll watch it for sure, but I don’t really care that much. It’s just a documentary. I’d rather they focus on making new music and touring. And I don’t care if they play arenas or stadiums. That stuff doesn’t matter to me—it’s the music and the live shows that are their real legacy.

Yeah, extra content can be fun, but I’d rather get that when they’ve retired or even after they’re gone. Give us the live albums, documentaries, books and all that in 10-15 years to keep the Maiden legacy alive. But right now, while they’re still active—especially at their age—I’d rather they just keep doing what they’re doing

And just to be clear—I don’t think Maiden’s management is doing anything wrong at all. Quite the opposite, actually. I think they’ve handled things really well over the years. They’ve kept the band feeling authentic and true to who they are, and that’s something I really respect.
 
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