Iced Earth
- Thread starter Forostar
- Start date
Barlow/Schaffer Iced Earth in Greece in 2025, I can already see it.
chaosapiant
Ancient Marinade
Has anyone actually stood by John Schaffer in this situation? I'm not usually one to not listen to music if the artist is a shit. I mean I still listen to Dissection or Burzum at times. But I will never intentionally pop on an Iced Earth song again.
Sure, just like there are enough people ready to make Trump president again despite inciting an insurrection.
wasn’t there one current member of IE who didn’t disavow Schaffer’s actions? Also there was speculation on here that he and Barlow remain friends and Barlow maybe supported what he did. Not sure if there’s any truth to that but it wouldn’t surprise me.
wasn’t there one current member of IE who didn’t disavow Schaffer’s actions? Also there was speculation on here that he and Barlow remain friends and Barlow maybe supported what he did. Not sure if there’s any truth to that but it wouldn’t surprise me.
Yax
Ancient Mariner
Barlow and Schaffer are family by marriage, so even if Barlow isn't a Trumpster, that might factor into it. After all, he's married to his sister.
Hate to break it to you guys, but on at least one gig of the recent Ashes of Ares tour, Barlow dedicated a song to Schaffer and had the audience chant his name. I couldn't find a video of it, but it seems to have been before Blessed Are You (the only video I found of the song from the gig in question starts right at the beginning of the song and does not include the banter before) because in Athens, he dedicated the performance to Schaffer without mentioning his name, probably because the gig was professionally filmed and released.
Nope.
Nope for the "probably because" or nope for the "gig was professionally filmed and released"? Okay, it wasn't "professionally released", it was uploaded on some guy's YouTube channel, but the recording is clearly professional.
Ah, I was thinking more that it wasn't officially released by the band. Can you share the link anyway?
MrKnickerbocker
clap hands
Is Barlow still a cop? I feel like this might reflect poorly on his career.
There’s a difference between supporting his brother in music (and life) and defending the choices he made.
Yax
Ancient Mariner
Tens of millions defends the choices he made. (if you listen to foools... the) Mob rules.
Detective Beauregard
Leviathan of Doggerland
Trump was never convicted of inciting an insurrection.
I don’t defend the poor choices Schaffer made, but I refuse to let politics or an artist’s personal life get in the way of enjoying music. For instance, Ted Nugent is a pedophilic creep, but that doesn’t magically turn Stranglehold into a bad song.
Besides, the vast majority of Iced Earth’s music is fantasy, mythology, and nerdy stuff - not ‘Murica freedom chants.
MrKnickerbocker
clap hands
Yeah, I mean, to be fair, Iced Earth went to shit long before Jon Schaffer became a wacko turd nugget.
Detective Beauregard
Leviathan of Doggerland
Take it back! Jon Schaffer is not a nugget.
MrKnickerbocker
clap hands
Here's the video:
Check out the section right before the 1 hour and 28 minute mark, right before Blessed Are You as you said. You can tell Matt is being very, very careful about his words. He's being grateful to the songs, the band, and the shared history. Very classy. He starts an "Iced Earth" chant. Not a "Jon Schaffer" chant. I'd say this is as politically correct as you can get.
I take it back. I was not being fair to nuggets.
Jer
'Til Tomorrow
I would certainly agree with this part. One can appreciate a piece of art while still finding its artist despicable. There’s still the question of whether you want to use your money to support a despicable artist in order to consume their art, but that line’s going to land in a different place for different people.
Personally, I think a quick reminder of the despicableness of the artist when discussing their art is probably appropriate, and that’s why I started referring to the band as Iseditionist Earth after Schaffer’s involvement in Jan 6 became clear. My opinion on the music itself is unaffected by his un-American behavior, though I was never a fan in the first place.
DJ James
A coma stole my name.
Perhaps this isn't the thread to air out all my personal grievances on the state of things today, but I really wish politics didn't inevitably invade everything I like (I'm sure that statement alone is enough to get some snarky quotes about how bad of a person I am for not following this stuff 24/7). To be more specific, I wish I could keep politics out of music and discussion of music. I understand politics are very heavily involved in every discussion now, but there was a time not long ago when I didn't have to see it being discussed everywhere.
I can only speak as someone who lives a lower class to lower/middle class life. I don't make much money, but it's enough to survive. This is relevant because when it comes to music I still use it as a way to escape every day life, and I like talking with people online about it. My world is a lot smaller than the world on the news - and so is everyone I know's world. This may be because everyone else I know works mostly blue collar jobs like myself, and may not have the most money either, but just trying to get by and help those around me get by is more than enough to fill my world. Adding on top of that all this political drama that permeates everything (including the music I listen to now) is just a little tiring, and I'm atleast a little upset by the state of political discussions online.
All this is to say Jon's actions don't really affect my enjoyment of Iced Earth. In a morbid way, I do think it is funny that he "stormed" the capital. I understand Europeans or non-Americans might be appalled at that statement, but it is pretty funny to me. In a sort "man I can't believe he actually did it" kind of way. Not trying to diminsh the whole thing, but really to myself and just about everyone I talk to (in the real world of working class adults with busy lives), whole thing wasn't really that big a deal. If that last sentence puts me on "thin ice" can I at least get a warning so I know that expressing that opinion is a no-go? I truly don't have a temperature check on how serious the rest of the world views it. I know it certainly is talked about a lot still. Anyways, that's about all I got right now.
I can only speak as someone who lives a lower class to lower/middle class life. I don't make much money, but it's enough to survive. This is relevant because when it comes to music I still use it as a way to escape every day life, and I like talking with people online about it. My world is a lot smaller than the world on the news - and so is everyone I know's world. This may be because everyone else I know works mostly blue collar jobs like myself, and may not have the most money either, but just trying to get by and help those around me get by is more than enough to fill my world. Adding on top of that all this political drama that permeates everything (including the music I listen to now) is just a little tiring, and I'm atleast a little upset by the state of political discussions online.
All this is to say Jon's actions don't really affect my enjoyment of Iced Earth. In a morbid way, I do think it is funny that he "stormed" the capital. I understand Europeans or non-Americans might be appalled at that statement, but it is pretty funny to me. In a sort "man I can't believe he actually did it" kind of way. Not trying to diminsh the whole thing, but really to myself and just about everyone I talk to (in the real world of working class adults with busy lives), whole thing wasn't really that big a deal. If that last sentence puts me on "thin ice" can I at least get a warning so I know that expressing that opinion is a no-go? I truly don't have a temperature check on how serious the rest of the world views it. I know it certainly is talked about a lot still. Anyways, that's about all I got right now.
MrKnickerbocker
clap hands
In general, I agree: let's not judge musicians on their politics. Unless, as is the case here, the musician themself is the one responsible for bringing politics into their own music. Jon started this on The Glorious Burden and it crescendoed by his personal actions at the capitol.
It's the same for any band that puts their radical views into their music: it becomes impossible to separate. And that is not the fault of analytical or judgmental fans. It's the musician's fault.
Personally, you're allowed to feel any way you want about it. I think it's pretty obvious that by finding it "funny" and "not a big deal", you probably agree with his actions (or the sentiments behind them) even if only a little bit. I can't fathom how anyone could think breaking into the capitol building based on lies and conspiracies to overthrow an election, and with a weapon meant to temporarily blind your enemies, could be seen as anything other than a treasonous offense. But, again, we all have our viewpoints. Shrug emoji.
Diesel 11
As you scream into the web of silence...
I can understand the "not a big deal" sentiment though. At the time we were all glued to the news trying to figure out what was happening; after it was all over I kind of find it incredibly laughable that these dipshits thought they could overturn an election like that. If anything I think that making them 'not a big deal' is a good way to invalidate their stupid-ass insurrection. At the time they thought they were essentially launching a revolution. Now they're just a bunch of nuts.
I think January 6th was a big deal but more so that it underscores how dangerous the rhetoric our "politicians" and other grifters use can be at mobilizing people who listen to lies. I have far more animosity towards Trump, Tucker, etc than I do the actual people who stormed the Capitol. They're nobodies.
I will say that a lot of great music has been political in nature, though. Marvin Gaye, Rage Against the Machine, Black Sabbath, Billie Holiday, The Clash, so many more - all of these artists wrote and/or recorded songs or even entire albums in which they used music as their tool to speak out about politics. And their work remains some of the most influential and important as time has gone on.
I dislike the idea that it's a musician's fault that they've written about political issues. It's not a fault so much as it is a topic. There are plenty of artists who write songs that I find moving because of how they tackle political subjects. Others like Mustaine or Schaffer I find worse for their political material. But music is a perfect medium for expression, and that includes your takes on politics.