GREATEST METAL ALBUM CUP - Winner: Iron Maiden - Seventh Son of a Seventh Son!

LooseCannon said:
I think City of Evil is by far the best A7X album, I didn't expect to see it get murdered this badly this quickly. Says a lot, I suppose.
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To be fair, if we were talking relatively to the genre, the Immortal album is a freakin' legend - a lot of stuff should lose against it. And it's not even my genre at that.
 
The first and fourth pairings are total garbage. Having to choose between KISS and Dream Theater is like having to choose between Trump and Hilary. (Ha! See what I did there?) There is no good choice. I'll vote for KISS just because of The Replacements' cover of "Black Diamond." I know it's not the same album, but whatever. After much consideration I have concluded that Dream Theater sucks.

Focusing on the most interesting matchup, The X Factor vs. Firepower: This is, after all, an Iron Maiden forum, and not only that, it is a forum in which otherwise intelligent, educated and thoughtful people nonetheless sing the praises of Blaze Bayley, which I find befuddling, because Blaze is a terrible singer. Let me repeat this for emphasis: BLAZE IS A TERRIBLE SINGER. Most Iron Maiden fans understand this intuitively; a few contrarians on this forum have yet to see the light. The X Factor isn't a terrible album, though, and it features the best individual song in this pairing, namely, Sign of the Cross. But Firepower is a better album top-to-bottom. By a lot. It's great, one of the best releases of the past few years. Firepower may nor may not turn out to be a "classic" of the metal genre, but The X Factor already has had sufficient time to determine whether it's a classic...and, well, it isn't. Voting against Iron Maiden again, for the second straight round I think, because no album with the embarrassing "Fortunes of War" chorus deserves to advance.
 
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LooseCannon said:
This was a survivor's round!

Annihilator knocks down AC/DC. The Aussies are back in the next league.
Testament survives Virgin Steele, who are eliminated from the GMAC after getting lots of notice in early rounds. The next challenge is Kamelot.
Blind Guardian continues their deep run with a decent win over Led Zeppelin's last entry. It's the battle of demons and wizards in the next league, as they'll match up against Iced Earth.
Pearl Jam ends Avantasia's run. Next, they will match up against the mighty Manowar!
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Hmm. I totally missed this round. Shaking my head about the first matchup, as Let There Be Rock is fucking awesome. Not surprised Zeppelin fell, given the Zep Hate on this forum. Very curious whether there will be political votes against Iced Earth. I predict yes.
 
Magnus said:
I know Judas, and I sympathize.
Such a bright mind lost to religion...
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Yeah, right? Curiously, via some insidious plan, actually most of the bright minds throughout history seem to become swallowed and ensnared by religion. I genuinely wonder why this might be. However, at least one does not feel alone.

:ninja:
 
JudasMyGuide said:
Yeah, right? Curiously, via some insidious plan, actually most of the bright minds throughout history seem to become swallowed and ensnared by religion. I genuinely wonder why this might be. However, at least one does not feel alone.

:ninja:
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Couldn't resist teasing you, and use the line provided, apologies.
Deleted my post before your response but since it's still there in your quote:
The only answer I can think of is that there must be some universal law preventing humans from thinking too much.
:ninja:
 
Magnus said:
The only answer I can think of is that there must be some universal law preventing humans from thinking too much.
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Oh, thankfully there is. I can't properly express the joy of being led into thinking just about the proper amount.

The sudden lack of the necessity to repeat to myself how smart I really am in order to actually believe it was certainly a relief, I admit.

:ninja:
 
1- Hey! This record Avenged Sevenfold actually features a song I kinda find enjoyable (Bat Country has one hell of a drum line... yet it's still stained by that sissy bridge). On the other hand we have Abbath continuing his intensive essay under the theme "1001 ways how to rip off Bathory". Tough choice, but I'll go with the evil pandas from Immortal.

2- Easy choice: Gamma Ray because they have the advantage of not being Sabbaton.

4- Black Clouds is absolutely boring. I'm no Kiss fan but this album features God Of Thunder and that alone is enough for my vote.

3- Firepower vs The X Factor? Now here's a tough one. IMO these are two albums that share some similarities and at the same time are really different.
First the similarities:
  • a) I regard them both as a huge return to form by each band.
  • b) They were both huge positive surprises I didn't see coming.
  • c) Both occupy similar positions on my Maiden and Priest rankings (relatively high, ahead of some "classics")
  • d) Loved both albums since the very first time I listened to them.
Now what separates them:
  • a) Firepower was hugely embraced by the majority of fans while The X Factor is still treated as an ugly duckling.
  • b) Firepower is heavy as bricks but plays safe. The X Factor is also heavy and particularly grim, but is much more daring.
  • c) Firepower is about explosion and adrenaline. The X Factor is a dark, emotional album.
  • d) ... and yeah I must admit: Firepower shows a better performance by Halford when compared with its predecessor. On the other hand no matter how off sometimes Bruce sounded on some Fear Of The Dark tracks, there was no comparison between Dickinson and a "young" Blaze (clearly unprepared to fill such gigantic shoes)*. And although I think Blaze improved a lot throughout the years after he left the band he will never be on the same echelon as 90's and 2000's Bruce.
So what gives? I'll go with The X Factor for a single reason. In a period filled with difficulties of all sorts, with new genres in metal thriving, after losing one of metal's best vocalists and hiring a much more modest one with a somewhat meh performance (I won't be as harsh as Mr. @Cornfed Hick or Mr. @Magnus on Blaze but yeah, I must admit... it was a let down) Maiden came out with a record that:
  • a) I still like every single song and its unique ambiance while there are at least two songs in Firepower I consider to be fillers.
  • b) I still think it features some exceptionally brutal songs (one of them being in my top 5 - Sign Of The Cross - and others being among many classics like Man On The Edge, Fortunes Of War, Judgement Day, Look For The Truth or Lord Of The Flies) that I can't help but re-listen to even 25 plus years after they were released. I don't know if I'll do the same with Firepower.
  • c) I still believe this album saved Maiden's career. Brought back the long epics and discarded all the hard rock fm the band started to bring into their sound on No Prayer and especially FOTD. While being a bit different put the band doing what they do like no other metal band. Priest came from an amazing album (Angel Of Retribution) a weird experiment (Nostradamus) and a quite ok-ish record in Redeemer Of Souls. It's not like their legacy was at stake at my eyes like Maiden was in 1993, when I was already getting ready for Maiden to disband.
So, there you go: Iron Maiden.
 
karljant said:
Brought back the long epics
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Oh yeah. That's another knock on The X Factor. One or two "epics" (i.e., long tracks) per album: great, go for it. Five or more: excessive, overindulgent and lazy. My biggest complaint about latter-day Maiden is the overreliance on songs longer than 6 minutes. If The X Factor started that trend, and @karljant is probably correct that it did, then I view that as a fault.
 
Avenged Sevenfold is soulless and terrible. I just can’t shake the image of Blink-182 trying to go undercover as a metal band when I hear this stuff. The whiny-ass singer is intolerable, and the syrupy vocal harmonies trading off with by-the-numbers Maidenesque guitar harmonies are a tonal shift that doesn’t work for me at all. I suppose this album is one of their less annoying ones from the GMAC, but that’s not saying much. Then we have this Immortal album, which has some pretty good music in spots, but laughable Gollum-esque vocals throughout. Still a lose-lose for the listener, but sorry @KidInTheDark666, I’m going with Shityn DJ Jootenael’s nominee here. Winner: Immortal

OK, I gave this Sabaton album a chance. It’s alright, but not as good as Carolus Rex, and it just comes off like B-list Powerwolf worship in the end. I didn’t hear a single song on here that could touch the best tracks on Land Of The Free, and frankly the worst tracks on the Gamma Ray album are just as good as anything on this Sabaton album, so it’s an easy decision. Sorry, Dr. Kiddie’s The DariaapalooseCollin, but Jerostar’s choice is clearly superior. Winner: Gamma Ray

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA, Firepower. Sorry, Dariorosaaperun -1, your nominee is utterly outclassed by Piña Collata’s here. Winner: Judas Priest

I never really understood the appeal of Kiss. Yeah, “Detroit Rock City” is a pretty great song, and “Sweet Pain” and “Shout It Out Loud” are OK, I guess, but the rest of this stuff is pretty forgettable. Sorry, @Dityn DJ James, but even The Dissaapanight’s so-so Dream Theater album is significantly better than this. Winner: Dream Theater
 
karljant said:
1- Hey! This record Avenged Sevenfold actually features a song I kinda find enjoyable (Bat Country has one hell of a drum line... yet it's still stained by that sissy bridge). On the other hand we have Abbath continuing his intensive essay under the theme "1001 ways how to rip off Bathory". Tough choice, but I'll go with the evil pandas from Immortal.

2- Easy choice: Gamma Ray because they have the advantage of not being Sabbaton.

4- Black Clouds is absolutely boring. I'm no Kiss fan but this album features God Of Thunder and that alone is enough for my vote.

3- Firepower vs The X Factor? Now here's a tough one. IMO these are two albums that share some similarities and at the same time are really different.
First the similarities:
  • a) I regard them both as a huge return to form by each band.
  • b) They were both huge positive surprises I didn't see coming.
  • c) Both occupy similar positions on my Maiden and Priest rankings (relatively high, ahead of some "classics")
  • d) Loved both albums since the very first time I listened to them.
Now what separates them:
  • a) Firepower was hugely embraced by the majority of fans while The X Factor is still treated as an ugly duckling.
  • b) Firepower is heavy as bricks but plays safe. The X Factor is also heavy and particularly grim, but is much more daring.
  • c) Firepower is about explosion and adrenaline. The X Factor is a dark, emotional album.
  • d) ... and yeah I must admit: Firepower shows a better performance by Halford when compared with its predecessor. On the other hand no matter how off sometimes Bruce sounded on some Fear Of The Dark tracks, there was no comparison between Dickinson and a "young" Blaze (clearly unprepared to fill such gigantic shoes)*. And although I think Blaze improved a lot throughout the years after he left the band he will never be on the same echelon as 90's and 2000's Bruce.
So what gives? I'll go with The X Factor for a single reason. In a period filled with difficulties of all sorts, with new genres in metal thriving, after losing one of metal's best vocalists and hiring a much more modest one with a somewhat meh performance (I won't be as harsh as Mr. @Cornfed Hick or Mr. @Magnus on Blaze but yeah, I must admit... it was a let down) Maiden came out with a record that:
  • a) I still like every single song and its unique ambiance while there are at least two songs in Firepower I consider to be fillers.
  • b) I still think it features some exceptionally brutal songs (one of them being in my top 5 - Sign Of The Cross - and others being among many classics like Man On The Edge, Fortunes Of War, Judgement Day, Look For The Truth or Lord Of The Flies) that I can't help but re-listen to even 25 plus years after they were released. I don't know if I'll do the same with Firepower.
  • c) I still believe this album saved Maiden's career. Brought back the long epics and discarded all the hard rock fm the band started to bring into their sound on No Prayer and especially FOTD. While being a bit different put the band doing what they do like no other metal band. Priest came from an amazing album (Angel Of Retribution) a weird experiment (Nostradamus) and a quite ok-ish record in Redeemer Of Souls. It's not like their legacy was at stake at my eyes like Maiden was in 1993, when I was already getting ready for Maiden to disband.
So, there you go: Iron Maiden.
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I agree with most, but can't say TXF saved their career. The album (and era) got far more flak than No Prayer and FOTD.

That said, they did what they felt like (but they sure did as well on No Prayer and Fear of the Dark, they always did). And they sure got into long songs. I love most of these, several even more than Sign of the Cross. The Unbeliever is fantastic. Very good chorus but the instrumental mid section, now we're talking, is only beaten by a few others in the complete catalogue.

Firepower is a nice album but does not have the depth of its opponent. It does not have as intriguing solos, it does not have good lyrics, it feels very produced, I can't hear who is doing what. Maybe Tipton did not record a single note on it. Surely not Priest's desert island record.
 
I think X Factor saved Maiden in the sense that it put them on a course for long term success and a formula for making new music that didn’t sound like a retread of old material. There was a pretty clear decision to be made once Bruce left: try to recapture North America (and to a lesser extent Europe) by either going back to a classic 80s sound or going the Metallica route, or they could just focus on doing their own thing and cater to the fans who were into that. Luckily for us, they went with the latter option and we have a slew of great albums as a result.

On the other hand, Firepower is the ultimate in Play Classics. Definitely overproduced, definitely an attempt at recapturing old glories (the album cover even looks like Screaming for Vengeance). It really goes to show how much production influences things though. I have a hard time seeing how the songs are any better than anything on Redeemer of Souls, yet that album was widely panned and Firepower was critically acclaimed and loved by fans across the board.
 
Avenged Sevenfold - Intro sounds like the Backstreet Boys, riff that kicks in is pretty good, the verse/chorus part is the same issue I've had with any of their albums in that it changes genre every couple of bars in an incoherent manner.

Immortal - Intro ok, change riff good too,
vocal laughably bad, I genuinely laughed, It sounds like it could actually be a youtube video entitled "omg!!11 a frog sings Led Zeppelin".
Breakdown part good. Overall musically it's pretty decent, the lo-fi production does no favours though.

Immortal with the win

Sabaton - the groove that the whole song is based around is terrible, keys and choir backing vocals are a red rag to a bull as far as I'm concerned, just doesn't do anything for me.

Gamma Ray - video won't play, picked Salvation's Calling, pretty good musically, vocal has a few corny deliveries with terrible Euro gang backing vocals.

Gamma Ray with the win

Iron Maiden - More detailed opinion here, I wasn't a big fan of this when it came out and remember being heartbroken on first listen when the slow intro of The Aftermath kicked in and it was the sixth song in a row with a slow to mid tempo intro. I've grown to like it a lot over time, I think if the current line up recorded it at some point over the last twenty years without rewriting any of it, the better production, singer and playing input from Adrian Smith would have it on a par with the other material they have released in that period. But it's a flawed record, and the biggest flaw for me is the wimpy guitars and slow tempo, even just listen to the lack of impact "standing alone in the wind and rain" has on the album compared to what we now know it could have sounded like.

Judas Priest - opinion given before

I will vote for Priest here, it's a strong return to form album versus one of Maiden weakest, albeit the best of their weak albums.

Kiss - I don't have this album, but am familiar with 6 of the tracks from live albums. Detroit Rock City is an all time classic, and God of Thunder and Shout It Out Loud are great too.

Dream Theatre - we had this song last round I think

Kiss with the win
 
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