Adrian Smith

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Mosh --it's only silly because Forostar doesn't have a clue (evidently) what skill requirement would be required to play guitar material from SiT. The first guy did indeed look "very able and familiar", Forostar. He also looks about 40! The guys in the 2nd & 3rd videos look like teenagers. How much practise do you reckon the first has over these two? Try about 20 years.

"Not difficult" in comparison to what exactly? "Maiden is no easy music" --seriously, we're not talking every single Maiden track here. Some (I say "some") of Maiden's rhythm guitar work is piss easy. The rhythm parts of Wasted Years are very, very simple. How much more simple can you get than literally 3 or 4 power chords!? This is the sort of thing my guitar teacher would have given me to play along to, to help practise chord changes. Plus, I suspect you're alluding (again) to the complexity of Maiden's music. We are talking about one guitar part. One guitarist cannot play 5 or 6 musical parts at once. Remember, Maiden don't play rhythm & lead parts all back to back in the studio either. What you're hearing that kid do with AtG wouldn't even be what Adrian did in the studio i.e. he wouldn't have moved between all those parts in one recording take. Not saying he couldn't, just saying he didn't.

And to return to SiT specifically: the guitar parts on SiT are not that difficult! Nobody's saying you don't need practise & talent, we're just saying you're overestimating the difficulty (technically) of SiT's music. Maiden have more technically difficult music, for sure.

I see these exaggerated claims as a prime example of the "mythologizing" I referred to in this thread, many pages back.
 
Majority of Maiden's melodies are basic and therefore easy/not so hard to play. But all elements getting together makes their music complex. Which is amazing.
 
Indeed, that's the beauty of it (& most music). Individually, it's nothing stunningly complicated; but woven together it becomes something else entirely. I do agree with comments Forostar has made elsewhere regarding complexity (& interesting elements); I just think, in the case of SiT, he is mistaken in thinking that individual guitar parts are particularly complex, or technically difficult.
 
Majority of Maiden's melodies are basic? Individually nothing stunning is created?
Boy, you guys sure must love this band to death.
 
Particularly when you cherry pick your quotations. Who said "Individually nothing stunning is created"? I said "Individually, it's nothing stunningly complicated" i.e. individually the parts are not complicated. You've no idea what parts I was even talking about. This is not a comment on what it sounds like (collectively), or how pleasing it is to the ears. It is a technical statement of fact, relating to the guitar parts. You seem to confuse the meaning of words like "basic" & "complex", equating one with crap, and the other with the most amazing music you've ever heard. Can simple things ("basic" if you like) not be beautiful, and melodic, and fantastic music? Or even complicated when all combined together? What's so difficult about this?

If you genuinely listen to WastedYears (guitar only) [as posted on this site & elsewhere] & define this guitar part as anything other than a basic, simple, guitar riff --then I'm starting to doubt everything you've ever written on these forums in regard to Maiden.
 
You keep talking about Wasted Years but that is not the most representative song of the album.

Also you keep talking about guitar riffs only. Are in your ears the solos on Somewhere in Time also not stunningly complicated?

EDIT:
CriedWhenBrucieLeft said:
Can simple things ("basic" if you like) not be beautiful, and melodic, and fantastic music? Or even complicated when all combined together? What's so difficult about this?
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They can. But compared to most rock and metal music, I'd say lots of Maiden's individual music (guitar lines, drum rhythms, bass figures) is not easy. All these tempo and rhythm changes surely attribute to that.
 
The riffs make up the majority of the music; solos are not the main elements of tracks. I personally think they're of great interest, but I don't think you can argue they're the building blocks of the track(s). And, no, they're not complicated. Take Dave's HCW lead. I don't genuinely think this lead is complicated. Most of the leads (the whole album) are improvised around Em. Because of this the positioning is pretty familiar to most players; rhythm + improvisation is musically pretty conventional, from a rock perspective (blues & extended scales). When I think of complexity, from a lead/solo improvisation perspective, I think of modes, and more complex & unfamiliar scales. Musically, Maiden don't really do this that much. This is not a criticism.
 
I confess I had removed a rather cynical (and unnecessary) part of my one but last post, which Cried might have seen and might have angered him. I apologize for that part if you have, Cried.
 
Forostar said:
It also has to do with talent. Not only practice.
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There's a big plaque in the band room at my school that says "Hard work will always beat talent if talent doesn't work hard", and I've found that it's quite true. Sure, there's talent there, but I find hard work and practice to be more important. I feel like talent will only get someone so far.

The general attitude I get from this discussion is that SIT not being overly complicated is a bad thing. There's some complicated stuff here and there, ATG is pretty crazy at times, but I'd say as a whole it isn't too bad. Solos included. The music is awesome though, not a bad song on the album. The complexity has nothing to do with that.

The Flash said:
I agree with this comment but way to diss DT. And I know you like them too. Not saying DT don't wank ever but I don't think they should be the first example about guitar wanking. Most people seem to pick DT as their go to example and that annoys me.
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DT is the best and most known example I can think of.
 
I don't think it's a bad thing; that's basically my point. Complexity doesn't equal good, & vice versa. The fact that I'm arguing that SiT isn't complicated has very little to do with my opinion of it as music. Your own point, Mosh, touches on this; complex "wankery" does not equal good music. SiT is an amazing album. Some of the best Maiden have written, in my opinion. The fact that it's, relatively speaking, quite simple (my definition of "quite simple": I can play most of it) only shows me how talented Maiden are. There is great skill in selection; in not always striving for the complex & difficult --as it doesn't necessarily equal good music. SiT is a stunning example of this. So I agree with you...
 
Honestly, does it really matter how basic or how complex or how complicated or not the solos/riffs are? We can all agree that they sound amazing and that's really the only thing that should matter. I've said this before but I'm not very guitar tech savvy but my ears know what sounds good.
 
Just to show you my stance on this complexity/quality matter (as I'm defending my point that states SIT's leads are not difficult to play), Somewhere in Time is my favorite Maiden album and probably my favorite album of all time.

Being able to create music that sounds fascinating without so much complexity is an astonishing talent. Being able to mix basic elements to a complex overall music is a special talent.

Maiden are capable of both playing complex and basic but they have the special talents which is probably why they're this awesome.
 
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