USA Politics

[Azas]

Oh, and a separate, special, friendly (sorta) deconstruction note to @____no5.

So, we’ve clashed several times over the war in Ukraine. I was outraged by the West’s inaction—at its core, I was arguing for the defense of democratic principles and the rules-based order. You, on the other hand, kept insisting that ‘the West should have listened to russia’s concerns about NATO expansion’ and taken russia’s so-called ‘legitimate interests’ into account. That was essentially your position. You can already see where this is going, right?

So… now it’s payback time. I’ll admit, I’m enjoying this a bit—like a gourmet savoring a particularly tasty dish. Okay, here it goes:

You defended the invader’s (russia’s) ‘legitimate interests’ in Ukraine. So why are you now opposed to the United States pursuing its own ‘legitimate interests’ (oil, rare metals, etc.) in Venezuela? Hello? Why the contradiction? At the root of it all, you were the one arguing for the ‘rule of the strong,’ not for the set of rules adopted by the Western world after World War II—territorial integrity, sovereignty, and all that democratic bullshit. And now, this morning, you’ve received another gift: another big bad wolf doing what it thinks is necessary for itself or its country. Why aren’t you applauding this one? I find that rather strange.

Why is it okay for russia to invade a sovereign country, but for the U.S. it’s suddenly a no-no?

Or are you just being you—remaining blatantly pro-russian? I can see how the russian infosphere is squealing like butchered pigs today. This U.S. move is a major blow to putin’s regime—and to autocratic regimes everywhere. (Even though it’s obvious that Trump’s move isn’t pro-democracy, just pro-business.)
Isn’t it ‘practice what you preach’?
Mic drop.

 

[Vaenyr]

I think the US would have no issue allowing the opposition to take over - considering Maria Machado has been glazing their ego and pushing for war to topple Maduro. Whether she were to assume control or Edmundo Gonzalez (presumed winner of the 2024 election) - we'll just have to see.

That being said, it appears the US has quit their bombardment of Caracas, so they're likely fine with the sitting VP to assume control as it appears to currently be the case. I'm not really one for conspiracies, and I know the dust is still just settling from the operation, but the operation as a whole almost seemed too easy?

Apparently the plan for now is that the US will "run" Venezuela for the time being:

Venezuela latest: Trump says US will 'run' Venezuela until 'safe transition can take place'

The president says the US launched an "air, land and sea" operation to take Maduro; Venezuela has called it "extremely serious military aggression".

www.bbc.com

 

[Spaldy]

But of course they will. At least long enough to draft up the oil deals and install a puppet leader.

 

[GhostofCain]

But of course they will. At least long enough to draft up the oil deals and install a puppet leader.

US foreign policy in the last century in a nutshell...

 

[Azas]

It’s worth keeping an eye on Trump’s approval ratings. I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a bump soon. And once Trump gets a taste for this, he may later organize another small, swift, and ‘victorious’ operation or war—to ‘fix things’ in U.S. domestic politics, just like autocrats love to do.

 

[____no5]

There it is, there's the 'But!'

Yes. Whoever comes after Trump being a Democrat or Republican will pick up what Trump has left in foreign policy and double down.
Etiquette might be different substance will be same.

 

[Flaming Blimp Crash]

It’s worth keeping an eye on Trump’s approval ratings. I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a bump soon. And once Trump gets a taste for this, he may later organize another small, swift, and ‘victorious’ operation or war—to ‘fix things’ in U.S. domestic politics, just like autocrats love to do.

The US - for what it's worth - has become more and more war-weary since the invasion of Iraq and subsequent occupation in 2003 for both parties. Trump as a candidate in 2016 lambasted the Bush Jr. administration for the occupation of Iraq because he knew a forever war with no exit strategy was unpopular. The aforementioned is a far cry policy-wise from McCain on the campaign trail in 2008 proposing to bomb Iran.

There was no approval bump from the strike in Iran in June despite it being on, y'know, Iran. Any sort of military intervention against Venezuela was polling at 33% support at best. I'm certain you can take a guess at which party was in favor - and even then there isn't anywhere close to unanimous support with polled conservatives.

The current plan for regime change is to... install Maduro's VP as the new leader. When asked if he'd look to throw support behind Maria Machado, Trump immediately shot that plan down because "Well, she's unpopular and not respected." On top of the Nobel Peace Prize she won over Trump, Ms. Machado is now also the recipient of the "Whoops, I Fell for it (Again)" award after actively encouraging the US's military intervention. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

 

[Flaming Blimp Crash]

Speaking of the VP - contrary to a report from Reuters - she is presently in Caracas and has refuted Trump's statement that she in in cooperation with the US right now. A translation from what I've gathered...

"We will never again be a colony for any empire. We demand the immediate release of our President, Nicolas Maduro, and his wife Cilia Flores. We are ready to defend Venezuela. We are ready to defend our natural resources, which should aid our national development. Together, the Venezuelan people will find a peaceful way forward. Those who use violence and violate international law are in the wrong (...) We call on other nations to stand united, because what happened today in Venezuela can happen anywhere."

Basically another botch job like the summer Iran strike.

 

[____no5]

Basically another botch job like the summer Iran strike.

Nope. This was a highly successful operation, in neocon terms. There was not a single air defense missile fired, which basically means that CIA bought the entire high level Venezuelan military. Thus the words of VP are empty. US is in control of the country, at least for now.

Of course it will end up in disaster and chaos, just like every neocon operation ever did, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria etc., but this is chaos plaguing local populations not US soil.

 

[Ascendingthethrone]

I found it interesting watching Hegseth talk about this operation seeing as most of the product supposedly exported from Venezuela goes straight up his nose.

 

[Onhell]

Interesting video on neoliberal western politics:

 

[____no5]

Interesting video on neoliberal western politics:

Nice guy! Didn't know that the linkage between Nobel Price and NATO was so bluntly stated. Collective West propaganda and US capture of information space is a super weapon almost as powerful as the dollar, if not more so.
Chinese were literally years ahead when they blocked Google and all US based social media and created their own alternatives. There's no sovereignty in 2026 if a country doesn't control its information space.

 

[Yax]

Chinese were literally years ahead when they blocked Google and all US based social media and created their own alternatives. There's no sovereignty in 2026 if a country doesn't control its information space.

I… Agree. Social media is the worst innovation ever, at least up until Chat gpt.

 

[Mosh]

I… Agree. Social media is the worst innovation ever, at least up until Chat gpt.

But state controlled social media is better?

 

[Yax]

But state controlled social media is better?

Less awful, yes. The receipts are in. The EU have been relentlessly attacked by foreign adversaries that use social media to destabilize the membership states. That is probably the number one reason why the extreme right is on the rise everywhere. Now MAGA have joined that party and are waging a social media war on us.

 

[____no5]

Oh, and a separate, special, friendly (sorta) deconstruction note to @____no5.

So, we’ve clashed several times over the war in Ukraine. I was outraged by the West’s inaction—at its core, I was arguing for the defense of democratic principles and the rules-based order. You, on the other hand, kept insisting that ‘the West should have listened to russia’s concerns about NATO expansion’ and taken russia’s so-called ‘legitimate interests’ into account. That was essentially your position. You can already see where this is going, right?

So… now it’s payback time. I’ll admit, I’m enjoying this a bit—like a gourmet savoring a particularly tasty dish. Okay, here it goes:

You defended the invader’s (russia’s) ‘legitimate interests’ in Ukraine. So why are you now opposed to the United States pursuing its own ‘legitimate interests’ (oil, rare metals, etc.) in Venezuela? Hello? Why the contradiction? At the root of it all, you were the one arguing for the ‘rule of the strong,’ not for the set of rules adopted by the Western world after World War II—territorial integrity, sovereignty, and all that democratic bullshit. And now, this morning, you’ve received another gift: another big bad wolf doing what it thinks is necessary for itself or its country. Why aren’t you applauding this one? I find that rather strange.

Why is it okay for russia to invade a sovereign country, but for the U.S. it’s suddenly a no-no?

Or are you just being you—remaining blatantly pro-russian? I can see how the russian infosphere is squealing like butchered pigs today. This U.S. move is a major blow to putin’s regime—and to autocratic regimes everywhere. (Even though it’s obvious that Trump’s move isn’t pro-democracy, just pro-business.)
Isn’t it ‘practice what you preach’?
Mic drop.

No it’s not the same. At all. It will be the same if China had agreed to be in military alliance with Mexico and announcing they would install nuclear missiles there.
In case of Venezuela it’s just about Oil. Oil that goes to China. Actually it’s all about China: Russia and Venezuela, Myanmar, Nepal, Taiwan, Philippines, Thailand, Iran it’s all about China.

You need to travel Azas.

 

[Azas]

Oil is the same kind of ‘legitimate interest.’ If we, as the collective West, abandon laws and rules, then ultimately it’s only the wolf who decides what’s right or wrong. He has ‘interests,’ and he’s completely indifferent to your concerns or mine. So the moment you supported russia, you opened the gates of hell worldwide - so to speak.

And yes, the U.S. is strengthening its sphere of influence because it sees China as its main opponent. And it’s doing it the way it wants to—just as russia did by invading Ukraine. Period.

What happened in Venezuela, at least theoretically, gives its people a chance for change. Have you seen the videos of Venezuelans celebrating? Yes, Trump doesn’t give a fuck about them—but there is a chance now, whereas under Maduro or Chávez there was none. Zero. Nada.

Here’s another perspective on unlawful U.S. actions in Venezuela. My country was occupied by the russians in 1944, and we regained independence only in 1990. Soon after the occupation (1944–1950), there was a constant murmur among citizens that ‘the U.S. will come and rescue us.’ They never came. Many men fled into the forests and fought the russians and collaborators, and this resistance sporadically lasted until 1953. The U.S. and the UK never recognized Lithuania’s occupation and annexation. Very generous. Do you think that helped my country in any meaningful way? All that ‘we condemn and we do not recognize’ talk while my country remained under the russian iron heel.

So I understand why Venezuelans are rejoicing. And I say fuck you to all the ‘good men’ who give nice speeches but do nothing substantial to change anything at the core. Fuck appeasers and ‘non-escalators.’ Fuck those who condemn civilian killings and then immediately go back to their ivory-tower routines.

The point is: Trump showed that, as a policeman, he has the guts to act. The problem is that his intentions may have nothing to do with democracy or people, and everything to do with business. But imagine if, for example, Biden had done this in Venezuela—and oil was only one of his motives—while genuinely trying to improve life there. I would applaud that without hesitation. Because the world as it is needs a good cop. There are plenty of bad ones already.

And I would applaud regime change in Iran as well. It’s a lair of terrorism. They hang their own opposition members. I won’t hide behind political correctness or pacifism, because both can kill. Inaction in the face of evil is infuriating. That said, I fully acknowledge the real problem: who watches the good cop, and who controls his true intentions? That is the question we need to solve.

Given how things are unfolding around the world, countries need to cooperate and grow muscles. This is the time of the wolves.

Mate, maybe you’ve traveled wide and far—but that hasn’t necessarily made you any wiser. Good luck.

Edit:

 

[Detective Beauregard]

I found it interesting watching Hegseth talk about this operation seeing as most of the product supposedly exported from Venezuela goes straight up his nose.

Political differences aside, this is hilarious.

 

[Aggelos]

True that!

 

[Jer]

In smaller-scale U.S. politics, Tim Walz has dropped out of the MN gubernatorial race in the face of this massive Somali fraud scandal that he’s nuts-deep in, and this is probably the end of his political career. Hallelujah.

Amy Klobuchar, currently the #3 ranking Democrat in the U.S. Senate, may now throw her hat in the ring. I would welcome that. There’s already a menagerie of Republican candidates running, including Mike Lindell, the “My Pillow” guy.