USA Politics

Black Abyss Babe said:
The Boyfriend is absolutely adamant that BNW and 1984 must be read together: "decide for yourself which is the bleaker vision" was his assessment.

I've never heard of "We", though ... :S
Click to expand...
One could argue that BNW isn't bleak, depending on the caste obviously. It presents its civilized world as a utopia where things like sickness are a thing of the past. I can imagine people reading the book and seeing the portrayal as a positive. You have to think a bit about the Savage's motivation and about the pursuit of individual interests and interpretations of art (for example) to see that the sanitized and overly organized way of life that are we are presented with might be lacking pain but it also lacks any real depth. It is superficial and thus not satisfying in the long run.
 
Its probably endorsed by the old whinger crowd. Back in my day I didn't watch TikTok I was out in the snow at 5am on my bike delivering newspapers. How all 14 year olds should be. None of this namby pamby college stuff and wanting to work in offices when you grow up rubbish, proper real jobs and getting your hands dirty, you work your way up to being rich that way.
 
Vaenyr said:
One could argue that BNW isn't bleak, depending on the caste obviously. It presents its civilized world as a utopia where things like sickness are a thing of the past. I can imagine people reading the book and seeing the portrayal as a positive. You have to think a bit about the Savage's motivation and about the pursuit of individual interests and interpretations of art (for example) to see that the sanitized and overly organized way of life that are we are presented with might be lacking pain but it also lacks any real depth. It is superficial and thus not satisfying in the long run.
Click to expand...
Exactly - he said that one of them is obviously distopian from the start, the other has the initial impression of utopia with the disturbing details only emerging along the way. He didn't say which was which though, and for some reason I assumed it would be the other way around :confused:
 
How stupid is she? Or how stupid does she think we are?

Everyone knows that this thing is real now - if only because of how many of the people involved (including Trump) immediately went on the defensive - yet only now that this particular horse has bolted do they try to shut the stable door by introducing the word "hoax".

Yup, we're well and truly into doublethink territory now - I wonder, does one of Musk's companies have a line of electric monks in an advanced stage of development?
 
Brigantium said:
Its probably endorsed by the old whinger crowd. Back in my day I didn't watch TikTok I was out in the snow at 5am on my bike delivering newspapers. How all 14 year olds should be. None of this namby pamby college stuff and wanting to work in offices when you grow up rubbish, proper real jobs and getting your hands dirty, you work your way up to being rich that way.
Click to expand...
Too right! And we had to get up half an hour before we went to bed, etc, etc ...
 
Black Abyss Babe said:
Exactly - he said that one of them is obviously distopian from the start, the other has the initial impression of utopia with the disturbing details only emerging along the way. He didn't say which was which though, and for some reason I assumed it would be the other way around :confused:
Click to expand...
Sorry for spoiling that part! If it's any consolation, none of them are really vague about their world building. I can say, to me at least, that BNW the book is very different from Maiden's song. I only knew the latter for the longest time, so once I started reading the book I got something I wasn't expecting.

As for 1984, I remember reading it in the summer of 2020 during the covid lockdowns and while the subject matter (as with most dystopian novels) is obviously bleak and horrifying, the prose and the pacing of the book was a delight to read (for the most part). Though there are moments where you are reminded that some of what you are seeing as fiction on these pages has become part of our everyday lives. Quite an eerie experience.
 
Vaenyr said:
Sorry for spoiling that part!
Click to expand...
No worries - spoilers don't bother me if the story is good. Otherwise, why read the same book multiple times?
Vaenyr said:
BNW the book is very different from Maiden's song.
Click to expand...
Bruce said that too - I think he said there's no swans in the book, among other things.
Vaenyr said:
Though there are moments where you are reminded that some of what you are seeing as fiction on these pages has become part of our everyday lives. Quite an eerie experience.
Click to expand...
Or a warning ... :blink:
 
Gotta say, there is something morbidly fascinating about the right-wing embracing 1984 as some kind of fundamental work about censorship, while many of them have never actually read the book. Orwell was a socialist. Goddamn, the man hated fascists so much that he literally joined the civil war of a different nation to be able to kill fascists. He'd despise conservatives and how they constantly misinterpret his works.

But I don't wanna keep derailing the thread, so I'll talk about something else: It is unfortunately entirely expected but equally disgusting how the right is performing Olympic levels of mental gymnastics to defend the Trump admin about blunders like sharing classified documents on a fucking group chat. Or how Donald the dove of peace suddenly isn't that interested in peace anymore. Or how his promises about ending the current conflicts turned out to be obvious lies, like anyone with more than a couple of functioning brain cells has been telling them for months.

It's also telling how both the Trump voters and the vocal Biden haters on the forum suddenly have no interest in discussing politics and posting in this thread. I mean, I get that it has to be exhausting trying to justify your vote for Trump or your irrational hatred for Biden when Trump is doing all the things people were fearmongering about Biden, daily. But you'd expect at least a shred of integrity and acknowledgement of how fucking incompetent and authoritarian the Trump admin is. I forget, that would require self reflection.

Rant over.
 
srfc said:
They want to have lunch breaks too, the cheek of them, thank god Florida put a stop to that
Click to expand...
And there goes another one who wants to control businesses and children alike. Let them make their money! If they can work without breaks let them, there's no need for the Government to be involved in people's everyday lives. The Government just wants to regulate things they have no business regulating.


... I can't believe how much like MAGAts I sound. Some genuinely believe stuff like this.
 
Vaenyr said:
But you'd expect at least a shred of integrity and acknowledgement of how fucking incompetent and authoritarian the Trump admin is. I forget, that would require self reflection.
Click to expand...

There lies the issue, though. We're not talking about traditional politics involving logical debate, traditional right and left, or even an interest in the democratic process.

I hope this doesn't catch on everywhere - it might - but we could be looking at an era of policy determined by personal identity in a global society and short term emotive thinking. Perceived media ratings and only certain sections of society shouting on social media taking over from considered debate and voting.

There been so much discussion about the failure of the left and the centre, when their failure may be that they are now part of a political system of the past.
 
GhostofCain said:
The unintended consequences of gammon-fuelled xenophobic shit. Like Brexit, but on steroids!

Sickening and pathetic at the same time.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't necessarily call them unintented, but rather collateral. Migrant labor is part of the backbone of US economy and these people know it.

- Aide: Maybe we could raise the wages, so that those jobs become more attractive
- DeSantis: *laughs awkwardly, wiggles and makes hand-accordion movements* What if we get the children to do it?
 
Yax said:
I wouldn't necessarily call them unintented, but rather collateral. Migrant labor is part of the backbone of US economy and these people know it.

- Aide: Maybe we could raise the wages, so that those jobs become more attractive
- DeSantis: *laughs awkwardly, wiggles and makes hand-accordion movements* What if we get the children to do it?
Click to expand...

I was using unintended very sarcastically. ;)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Yax
Vaenyr said:
It's also telling how both the Trump voters and the vocal Biden haters on the forum suddenly have no interest in discussing politics and posting in this thread. I mean, I get that it has to be exhausting trying to justify your vote for Trump or your irrational hatred for Biden when Trump is doing all the things people were fearmongering about Biden, daily. But you'd expect at least a shred of integrity and acknowledgement of how fucking incompetent and authoritarian the Trump admin is. I forget, that would require self reflection.
Click to expand...

No, you're seeing this the wrong way. It's the people suffering from TDS who are hyperfocusing on every minor misstep any government is bound to make. Plus, nobody ever said Trump is a perfect human being, of course he will make mistakes. We need to focus on the big picture. And by that I mean we need to pay attention to the small improvements that are being made. Sure things aren't perfect, but at least we're moving away from a world where generals are dressed in drags and incompetent people endanger air traffic security.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top