USA Politics

[Onhell]

There's no point in this discussion. We've made our points clear.

Yes, you've never been held in a holding cell, er, I mean a "waiting room" and interrogated at a U.S airport and it shows. God Bless the land of the free

 

[Perun]

Oh the US supresses its fair share of speech. Just because it doesn't bother with cartoon characters it doesn't mean it isn't obssessed with the flow of information as much as China or Russia

From what I understand, free speech isn't the problem in the US. You can openly criticise anything you like, but the system actively blocks you from changing anything for the better. Unless you're white and have money, that is.

 

[Jer]

The Black Lives Matter folks would like a word...

Do you have actual examples of BLM protestors being prosecuted for non-violent speech, rather than actual acts of physical violence, looting, or explicit incitation of either? This has been analyzed pretty thoroughly and I'm not aware of any.

Have there been cases where the wrong people were arrested alongside actual rioters and looters and then released without being charged? Yes. And of course we have an ongoing problem with the militarization of the police and inappropriate behavior from their end, which is being slowly addressed as that behavior comes to light (for example, the Minneapolis police department is under a judicial consent decree to fundamentally transform the way they do their jobs after the George Floyd incident). But you don't see people being prosecuted just for saying things other people don't like.

Yes, you've never been held in a holding cell, er, I mean a "waiting room" and interrogated at a U.S airport and it shows.

Yeah, the border patrol / airport situation is dogshit, and I can't believe that the "suspension of constitutional rights for U.S. citizens" argument for airports and any location within 100 miles of the U.S. border hasn't been struck down in court yet. That's clearly unlawful, and when the right case gets the right appeals I'm pretty confident it will eventually get shut down. Foreign nationals with valid passports and visas should also never be detained without probable cause. But in the meantime we still have to deal with all this hysterical post-9/11 bullshit.

From what I understand, free speech isn't the problem in the US. You can openly criticise anything you like, but the system actively blocks you from changing anything for the better. Unless you're white and have money, that is.

This is a more accurate critique.

 

[Onhell]

From what I understand, free speech isn't the problem in the US. You can openly criticise anything you like, but the system actively blocks you from changing anything for the better. Unless you're white and have money, that is.

If Edward Snowden living in Russia is considered being "blocked" then sure

 

[Onhell]

Do you have actual examples of BLM protestors being prosecuted for non-violent speech, rather than actual acts of physical violence, looting, or explicit incitation of either? This has been analyzed pretty thoroughly and I'm not aware of any.

I do, it's going to take a while, but I will find the examples. I mean, sure we aren't seeing cases like those of the Chicago 7, but they are being thrown un unmarked vans by law enforcement with no badges or identification of any kind like vests that say "police" or windbreakers with "FBI" on the back etc.

Yeah, the border patrol / airport situation is dogshit, and I can't believe that the "suspension of constitutional rights for U.S. citizens" argument for airports and any location within 100 miles of the U.S. border hasn't been struck down in court yet. That's clearly unlawful, and when the right case gets the right appeals I'm pretty confident it will eventually get shut down. Foreign nationals with valid passports and visas should also never be detained without probable cause. But in the meantime we still have to deal with all this hysterical post-9/11 bullshit.

You'd think, every time I fly and I do mean EVERY time I get selected for "random" screening. I thought that when I became a citizen those days would be behind me, but no. Is it better than the holding cell? Sure, because at least this time I can go all Karen on them without fear of deportation.

 

[Jer]

If Edward Snowden living in Russia is considered being "blocked" then sure

Snowden is a complicated case, because he provided a huge dump of classified information to a journalist. It's not clear to me whether he used all of the legal whistleblowing options available to him before resorting to an extralegal option, though I know he did try to raise his concerns internally in some fashion and was stymied.

Should he be shown leniency given the sprawling nature of the offenses he revealed? Yes. Should he walk away with just a slap on the wrist given the way he handled things? That depends on the specifics. If he really did exhaust all of the legal whistleblowing options available to him first, then yes, he should be able to avoid prison time. But if he jumped the gun and leaked to the press before trying everything else first, then he should probably serve a modest amount of time in prison.

The Department Of Justice probably should have brokered a plea deal with him that included a lot of public service, ideally having him testifying to Congress and going around to government agencies to give talks on his experience and what he should have done differently to handle the whistleblowing properly. Leaving things dangling in such a fashion that he would be afraid of the death penalty or a 30-year sentence, and choosing to live in Russia rather than face our legal system, is ethically problematic.

Snowden did the U.S. a service, but he did it in an illegal and potentially dangerous way. All of those aspects need to be considered in how justice is handled for him.

 

[Onhell]

Snowden is a complicated case...

I can agree with that. But he's not the only whistleblower facing backlash whether he did it legally or not. Both private companies and the government HATE whistleblowers and will do anything to silence them. Snowden just happens to be one of the "big" names along with Julian Asange (who is a different story, but they get lumped together) and the soldier.... Chelsea Manning (had to look her up).

 

[Onhell]

What a loss. US citizens can't use Tik Tok

It may seem like a little thing, just like the Chinese not being able to use Amazon. But it affects people who don't have a horse in this race. For example, Huawai's phones are no longer Android/Google compatible becaue of that. Here in Mexico we can still buy Huawai products and use tiktok, BUT now Huawai has it's own operating system which has rendered them incompatible with BOTH google AND Apple products. So yes, I know, I know, third world problems, am I right?

 

[____no5]

The US doesn't let you use TikTok and uses Financial credit scores to limit every aspect of your life including housing.

This is a very clever point that many people choose to ignore. I’m happy you brought this up. And from what I see and hear the credit score system probably is way more impactful to people’s lives in the US. And affects way more people.

Edit: The biggest difference, I think, is China will disappear ANYBODY. Politicians, actors, prominent business people, athletes. While the U.S only focuses on the poor and rabble rousers. With more prominent people they put them in jail and then they magically commit suicide.

And another one.
Funny that people truly seem to believe that two empires of the same planet in 2023 are so fundamentally different.

 

[____no5]

Here in Mexico we can still buy Huawai products and use tiktok, BUT now Huawai has it's own operating system which has rendered them incompatible with BOTH google AND Apple products. So yes, I know, I know, third world problems, am I right?

Have you tried this OS? I’ve read some reviews a few years ago -not too impressed.

 

[Onhell]

Have you tried this OS? I’ve read some reviews a few years ago -not too impressed.

I have not, I have an android phone. It's actually very convinient, because the university made a deal with google so all the student and teacher accounts use their services (mail, drive, classroom, docs, etc) So I have my personal and work email on my phone and I get notified of students e-mails in real time.

 

[Azas]

It may seem like a little thing, just like the Chinese not being able to use Amazon. But it affects people who don't have a horse in this race. For example, Huawai's phones are no longer Android/Google compatible becaue of that. Here in Mexico we can still buy Huawai products and use tiktok, BUT now Huawai has it's own operating system which has rendered them incompatible with BOTH google AND Apple products. So yes, I know, I know, third world problems, am I right?

I would not use Huawei - it's China's company and there's good chance your phone may have security issues. Same goes for Tik Tok - another one China's influence tool. I don't installed TikTok on my phone (Samsung) and don't feel any loss.

 

[____no5]

All this hysteria with Tik Tok is a bit overstretched, anyway no Tik Tok or Facebook for me. But I'm WeChat user this you cannot avoid when in China and it's the worst of all as all payments (even between people), social posts, mobile top up, chats, calls, taxi rides and more are being handling via WeChat. Elon Muck's wet dream is to turn X into a Western version of WeChat.

Funny thing with WeChat is that they abuse Apple's Rules and there is a kind of App Store inside the App which of course would be a Huge no no and reason to be expelled from Apple store, but good luck of banning 1.4 billion users.

The moment WeChat is banned I would go and buy Android, it's nearly impossible to live here without WeChat.

 

[Perun]

Elon Muck's wet dream is to turn X into a Western version of WeChat.

Well, it's his declared goal. Luckily, we can just say "no" and not use it.

 

[Onhell]

I would not use Huawei - it's China's company and there's good chance your phone may have security issues. Same goes for Tik Tok - another one China's influence tool. I don't installed TikTok on my phone (Samsung) and don't feel any loss.

Dude.... like... EVERYONE spies on you... literally. If you have a Facebook account, if you've ever bought something on Amazon, if you have a gmail, or sent a WhatsApp message, etc. If it isn't China or Russia it's the US and the UK.

Here's a couple of videos. I recommend watching them all the way through, especially the one with the Snowden interview.

Everyone spies:

NSA spies on EVERYONE (Snowden interview):

 

[Mosh]

It is very narrow, but I've been looking at the 538 presidential primary polls and I'm starting to see a very small path to Nikki Haley pulling off the nomination. I really want to emphasize that this is a granular possibility and I would still put my money on Trump, but there is at least a path and that is more than I can say for any point of the GOP race up until now.

I think it all hinges on her knocking off DeSantis for the second place finish in Iowa. She's already running reasonably ahead of DeSantis in NH and SC, which is not too surprising, and she is coming pretty close in Iowa. If Christie and DeSantis get out of the race and the entire anti-Trump vote coalesces around Haley, it opens up the door for her to beat Trump in NH and SC. I think Christie will get out if he thinks Haley has a shot, DeSantis is more of a question mark but I also think that if a 3rd place finish in Iowa starts to become a strong possibility he's going to get out to avoid an embarrassing result (think Kamala 2020). The DeSantis thing in general is the biggest wrench in this theory, especially when the governor of Iowa recently came out with a DeSantis endorsement. That just seems like such a head-scratcher, why endorse DeSantis now when he is clearly not going to win Iowa, let alone the nomination? But it keeps him in the race longer and makes it less possible for Haley to pull off an upset there. We'll see though, the next month is going to be critical for her.

Again, it's a long shot. But it does solve the up until now unanswered question of who is the Trump alternative, which has been the biggest thing standing in the way of the Trump alternative movement.

National : President: Republican primary : 2024 Polls

The latest political polls and polling averages from FiveThirtyEight.

projects.fivethirtyeight.com

Nikki Haley is now within 2 points of DeSantis in national averages. She's also within 2 points in Iowa and well ahead of the competition for 2nd place in New Hampshire and South Carolina. It's going to be a critical month for her and I'll be curious to see if she gets any major endorsements/candidates dropping out and endorsing her. Could be a game changer in the race if things keep trending in her direction.

 

[____no5]

Stuart Seldowitz ex in charge of Israel -Palestinian affairs and ex top advisor of Obama caught on video to make disgusting comments.
How's possible he is in sensitive positions of power for 20 years this kind of low human?

Warning, video can be disturbing.

 

[Jer]

Not gonna defend the official at all, but one important piece of context is that the vendor had apparently said he was 100% behind everything Hamas did on October 7, including the butchering of civilians, and the verbal abuse from the official began after the vendor said that. Outside of the Times piece, most coverage has omitted that information.

 

[Onhell]

How's possible he is in sensitive positions of power for 20 years this kind of low human?

J. Edgar Hoover: Hold my beer

 

[____no5]

Not gonna defend the official at all, but one important piece of context is that the vendor had apparently said he was 100% behind everything Hamas did on October 7, including the butchering of civilians, and the verbal abuse from the official began after the vendor said that. Outside of the Times piece, most coverage has omitted that information.

Even if it were true, there’s no excuse leveling oneself with a Hamas worshipper and behaving in such a disgusting way.
But honestly after I saw how he harassed the vendor again and again, I wouldn’t believe anything he said to defend his sorry ass.
Context is not relevant here.

J. Edgar Hoover: Hold my beer

Is there any evidence that Hoover ever reached as low? I mean this video is deeply disturbing.