The saving graces of Virtual XI

Amen to that Zare. Just a few comments.

Blaze excels, apart from a few small parts on the VXI-record (near the end of WTWC comes a hard-to-bear-part, I also like him less in the "Noooooo, we can't let them take anymore" part in The Clansman, and it sounds like he's kind of off key on Como Estais Amigos).

Zare said:
The sound and themes of today's Maiden, a band 36 years old, a band that fills stadiums all around the world playing new material, started with Blaze Bayley and The X Factor.
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I have the idea that the start of "today's Maiden sound" came a bit earlier. I am talking about the songs Afraid to Shoot Strangers and Fear of the Dark from the album Fear of the Dark.

TXF and VXI are the castles which were built on these two rocks. One rock is still strong and visible, the other is forgotten. I'd like to see a path to that rock, and both castles should be unlocked and re-opened for public again.

Zare said:
If you support what they've been doing for the last 11 years, you should appreciate Blaze's role in the whole process.
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Absolutely.
 
Zare said:
Oh really?

First of all, Blaze didn't suck on VXI, he did the job right, his voice perfectly matches the record. Yes, i prefer Bruce and i think he would do better job live on some of VXI songs, but Blaze excelled. And i'm sorry to say, but your last statement is bullshit. They never dumped Blaze because of popular demand, they parted ways with him because he couldn't tour. And touring is the most important thing to them. They would have parted ways with him regardless of Bruce.

If you really think that someone (Steve Harris), who is looked upon in the rock community as a staple of band integrity, would listen to any external "demand", you're way off track. He put an slow, progressive 11 minute classic metal track to open a record, in a world where metal bands were desperately trying to induce new elements to their music, to satisfy a change in scene, deliberately distance themselves from earlier work, seeking to retain at least some popularity. He spat his hate in Virus. He put an highly-repetitive 7 minute song as a lead single of VXI to show them he doesn't really care.

If you think he'd listen to your opinion about Blaze, you're dead wrong.
The sound and themes of today's Maiden, a band 36 years old, a band that fills stadiums all around the world playing new material, started with Blaze Bayley and The X Factor. If you support what they've been doing for the last 11 years, you should appreciate Blaze's role in the whole process.
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I'll do this quickly Zare:

He really did suck on VXI.

I also prefer Bruce but there really is no contest.

The fact that Blaze couldn't tour was yet another reason to get Bruce back. I was a fan of Maiden before Blaze and stuck with them during this poisonous era and if you don't think Maiden were under pressure to bring Bruce back, you're delusional.

Please don't try to defend Angel & Gambler. There really is no excuse for that song.

I agree Steve wouldn't listen to "my" opinion re: Blaze. I think he did listen to the sound of dwindling album sales and being forced to play in shit venues though.

Maiden are filling stadia worldwide on the back of the last 4 studio albums and "classic era" tours. FACT. Again, you're delusional if you think this would be happening with Blaze in the band.

VXI's only saving grace (apart from Clansman and the odd cracking Murray solo) is the fact that it was met with a resounding thumbs down from a shit load of Maiden fans which I believe led to the return of Bruce.
 
snake plissken said:
Maiden are filling stadia worldwide on the back of the last 4 studio albums and "classic era" tours. FACT. Again, you're delusional if you think this would be happening with Blaze in the band.
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Wait a minute, you talk about $$-signs and full stadiums, but Zare acknowledges Blaze's role in the development of Maiden's sound. If you like Blaze's voice, that's a matter of taste. But it's hard to deny that he did well on the studio albums. Listen to the intro's of e.g. The Educated Fool or Lightning Strikes Twice. That's really contributing, captivating stuff.

By the way: Outside the US Maiden still played large venues.

You turn this subject into "Bruce did/is way better than Blaze" but it's actually possible to like a singer without Bruce's image looming over him. It's a great pleasure to dive into many different aspects of a band with such a long history. My favourite Maiden albums are Powerslave, Somewhere in Time and Seventh Son of a Seventh Son, but my love for these albums doesn't take an inch away from my appreciation for other sides of this band.

The same thing happens with the albums of the Tony Martin/Sabbath era. If people would just play the whole Headless Cross album, without thinking of the more legendary Dio or Ozzy, then I am sure this listening session would be more rewarding.

So I try to judge the albums by their own strengths and weaknesses, but at the same time I automatically compare with other albums when I sense influence, or recognize patterns I have heard before. I also judge singers by their own strengths and weaknesses. Blaze had some weak characteristics but he also had qualities. And these qualities have played a big role in Maiden.
 
Forostar said:
Wait a minute, you talk about $$-signs and full stadiums, but Zare acknowledges Blaze's role in the development of Maiden's sound. If you like Blaze's voice, that's a matter of taste. But it's hard to deny that he did well on the studio albums. Listen to the intro's of e.g. The Educated Fool or Lightning Strikes Twice. That's really contributing, captivating stuff.

By the way: Outside the US Maiden still played large venues.

You turn this subject into "Bruce did/is way better than Blaze" but it's actually possible to like a singer without Bruce's image looming over him. It's a great pleasure to dive into many different aspects of a band with such a long history. My favourite Maiden albums are Powerslave, Somewhere in Time and Seventh Son of a Seventh Son, but my love for these albums doesn't take an inch away from my appreciation for other sides of this band.

The same thing happens with the albums of the Tony Martin/Sabbath era. If people would just play the whole Headless Cross album, without thinking of the more legendary Dio or Ozzy, then I am sure this listening session would be more rewarding.

So I try to judge the albums by their own strengths and weaknesses, but at the same time I automatically compare with other albums when I sense influence, or recognize patterns I have heard before. I also judge singers by their own strengths and weaknesses. Blaze had some weak characteristics but he also had qualities. And these qualities have played a big role in Maiden.
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Taste is fair enough. Can't argue with a preference but my point is regardless of taste one cannot deny, a vast amount of Maiden fans thought the Blaze era was a disaster and VXI was the final insult.

I live outside the US and saw Maiden during the Blaze era play in a club that holds 1000 people. It wasn't sold out. It was a shocking night on every level.

Again, I have no problem with you liking the Blaze stuff or liking the albums from '84-'88 above all others.

So as much as this isolates me here I remember what went down and how it felt a the time to be a Maiden fan. And it hurt. It was embarrassing being told in my local HMV that they weren't stocking the Angel and the Gambler because they didn't think anyone was interested in it. It was more embarrassing when I made them order it in for me and demanded they play it over the system when I showed up to collect it. After the 946th chorus repeat the dude just turned it off and, quite rightly said, "this isn't Iron Maiden man". Needless to remark I purchsed VXI elsewhere...

I'm not trying to be argumentative nor am I trying to win a popularity contest but I firmly believe this, the best thing about VXI and the ensuing joke of a tour was it woke the band up to the reality that Blaze had to go. The fact that I don't like him as a vocalist is irrelevant.
 
snake plissken said:
Taste is fair enough. Can't argue with a preference but my point is regardless of taste one cannot deny, a vast amount of Maiden fans thought the Blaze era was a disaster and VXI was the final insult.
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Look, I too remember the hate of fundamental hardcore members, but I don't remember it was called a disaster by a huge majority.

snake plissken said:
I live outside the US and saw Maiden during the Blaze era play in a club that holds 1000 people. It wasn't sold out. It was a shocking night on every level.
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Maybe I should say: big venues outside the US where metal wasn't dead yet. I saw Maiden in big halls and indoor arena's. Outside the US. They were great nights. You probably have read my account, but here a link for people who are curious about a less negative, and more in depth analysis.

snake plissken said:
Again, I have no problem with you liking the Blaze stuff or liking the albums from '84-'88 above all others.

So as much as this isolates me here I remember what went down and how it felt a the time to be a Maiden fan. And it hurt. It was embarrassing being told in my local HMV that they weren't stocking the Angel and the Gambler because they didn't think anyone was interested in it. It was more embarrassing when I made them order it in for me and demanded they play it over the system when I showed up to collect it. After the 946th chorus repeat the dude just turned it off and, quite rightly said, "this isn't Iron Maiden man". Needless to remark I purchsed VXI elsewhere...
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While I prefer independent record stores, I am still not interested in the opinion of someone who sells me his records. If I'd do that, then I wouldn't discover music on my own.

snake plissken said:
the best thing about VXI and the ensuing joke of a tour was it woke the band up to the reality that Blaze had to go. The fact that I don't like him as a vocalist is irrelevant.
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At least, back then the band had more guts then nowadays because they
tried to play more material from their latest album.
 
Here's the thing though. It was an unmitigated disaster. If it wasn't Blaze would still be there. I thank the maker he isn't because, and I'm quoting Nicko McBrain here regarding the VXI period, "If things had kept going the way they were, we'd have had to knock it on the head."

The guy in HMV probably was a tool... he was still right though ;)

I've had my say and I respect all views on this...even yours :) I shall now sit back and enjoy the rest of the comments.
 
Forostar said:
At least, back then the band had more guts then nowadays because they
tried to play more material from their latest album.
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AMOLAD tour: whole album.
DoD tour: 6 DoD songs
BNW tour: 6 BNW songs
VXI tour: 6 VXI songs
TXF tour: 7 TXF songs
TFF first leg: mainly new songs from latest albums
TFF second leg:
5 TFF songs

Not really such a difference.
 
I hope your statistics teacher doesn't see that post.

AMOLAD : 100%
DoD : 54%
BNW : 60%
VXI : 75%
TXF : 63%

Thus, if you count out AMOLAD as an exception to the whole career, indeed those two Blaze albums (especially the hated VXI!) have the high representation in live shows. VXI is comparable to '80s albums by representation, even higher than Powerslave.
 
Maiden played Don't Look to the Eyes of a Stranger on the first few gigs of the Virtual XI tour, so technically, that makes 7 songs.

192280-comic_book_guy_13018_screen_large.jpg
 
Yes but with Blaze as singer it surely made more sense to perform as many songs from the Blaze albums as possible. What is bizarre is the lack of TXF/VXI representation on reunion tours. I don't mind either album but it seems the band has almost completely abandoned their 90s Bruce/Blaze eras. Whether or not it was a dark period for metal in general, Maiden seem aware it was their bleakest decade. Which makes the release of From Fear to Eternity all the more interesting...
 
Zare said:
I hope your statistics teacher doesn't see that post.

AMOLAD : 100%
DoD : 54%
BNW : 60%
VXI : 75%
TXF : 63%

Thus, if you count out AMOLAD as an exception to the whole career, indeed those two Blaze albums (especially the hated VXI!) have the high representation in live shows. VXI is comparable to '80s albums by representation, even higher than Powerslave.
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Let's consider AMOLAD an exception then, and VXI is the only one that really stands out. My point was that the number, not the percentage of songs played from each album has remained pretty much the same - Maiden didn't have so much more guts back then than now, they're pretty much sticking to a formula of playing around 6 songs each tour. Thus I believe my statistics teacher need not worry!
Perun said:
Maiden played Don't Look to the Eyes of a Stranger on the first few gigs of the Virtual XI tour, so technically, that makes 7 songs.
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Yeah, and they played The Fallen Angel and Out Of The Silent Planet at a couple of venues on BNW tour.  ;)
 
I must say if Maiden doesn't do a History tour covering NPFTD to VXI, that would be the biggest letdown ever, for me at least.
 
The Mid-Distance Runner said:
Yes but with Blaze as singer it surely made more sense to perform as many songs from the Blaze albums as possible.
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Also in the earlier Bruce era, Maiden
played more from their latest album than from TFF (apart from FOTD).
 
Don't you think I'm a savior, don't you think I can save ya'? Don't you think I can save your life?...  He's still going............ A  Praise to you Snake!
 
The Mid-Distance Runner said:
Yes but with Blaze as singer it surely made more sense to perform as many songs from the Blaze albums as possible. What is bizarre is the lack of TXF/VXI representation on reunion tours. I don't mind either album but it seems the band has almost completely abandoned their 90s Bruce/Blaze eras. Whether or not it was a dark period for metal in general, Maiden seem aware it was their bleakest decade. Which makes the release of From Fear to Eternity all the more interesting...
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Am I the only who isn't surprised about the recent absence of Blaze material? It's their least successful era and only the hardcore fans really know the material. This includes No Prayer and FOTD. If I had my way, Sign Of The Cross would be on every tour, but it makes more sense for maiden to throw in 2 or 3 classics that everybody knows instead. 
 
The Clansman, Futureal and Como Estais Amigo's alone make the album worth getting.
For all the criticism he gets...Blaze helped write some of the best songs on those two albums
 
There ya go... a two hours show.  :)


Be Quick or Be Dead
Lord of the Flies 
No Prayer for the Dying
Man on the Edge
Afraid to Shoot Strangers
Fortunes of War
The Clansman
Public Enema Number One
From Here to Eternity
The Angel and the Gambler
Bring Your Daughter... to the Slaughter
Sign of the Cross
The Educated Fool
Wasting Love
Run Silent Run Deep
Como Estais Amigos
Futureal
Mother Russia
Judas Be My Guide
The Edge of Darkness
Fear of the Dark


:yey:
 
I agree with snake.  

Whenever I think about Maiden, the 90s never happened.

As far as I am concerned, Bruce recorded some great solo records in the 1990s while Steve Harris did some half-decent side project-thingy with some guy called 'Blaze'. It's all worth a listen, but the band Iron Maiden reuinited in 1999.

:D
 
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