Official thread for Final Frontier discussion

MadMax

Invader
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

Just a little improvement on the lyrics:

"So gone is the glory and gone is the gold
Well, if you knew the story, how come it has to be told?"

I clearly hear that instead of the proposed "need a story" and it also makes a lot more sense in context.

I'm also really not sure what I'm hearing at the end of the third chorus line, but it's not "it's oversold", it's something different I hear in every of the three choruses... can't put my finger on it.
 

Jeffmetal

Ancient Mariner
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

Yeah, MadMax. I just heard it properly during the Dallas vid on youtube and the 'oversold' part sounds to me like 'almost sold'.
 

LooseCannon

Enterprise-class aircraft carrier
Staff member
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

Almost sold makes sense too. He's trying to fill up the ship with his marks.
 

JackAttack

Trooper
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

The Mid-Distance Runner said:
I love the live version thanks for posting.  The band are into it.

And you gotta love Dave's shirt.  I really enjoy how he ocassionally bows to the crowd, like at 5:38 in...its almost camp.

You are so right. I love that sort of cheesy side of Dave. It's my favorite thing about him on stage.
 

Jeffmetal

Ancient Mariner
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

It's gentle, humble. Not cheesy. How great would be if more artists (people, actually) were like that.
 

SinisterMinisterX

Illuminatus
Staff member
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

MadMax said:
"So gone is the glory and gone is the gold
Well, if you knew the story, how come it has to be told?"

I clearly hear that instead of the proposed "need a story" and it also makes a lot more sense in context.

Sorry, I just listened again and heard "need" again, just like I have the previous 19 times. (itunes says 20 plays so far)
 

Ranko

I'll shoot the gunner first!
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

"If you knew the story, how come it has to be told" makes more sense.

"If you need a story" can't really be logically connected to the second part of the verse.
 

gor

Ancient Mariner
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

Hello, after a long absence. Here are my 2 cents on the new track and the 2 new artworks: El Dorado is a disappointing 1st single in my opinion. I had the exact opposite feelings than when I was first listening to Breeg, which rocked. Bruce's vocals are some of the worst he has recorded on tape and the song plods along to nowhere. The production sounds bad, but I'll wait for the actual CD to decide. Overall, it sounds like an AMOLAD b-side. The single cover is quite unique, I like it! On the other hand, the cover album is, HANDS DOWN, the worst album cover by Maiden - EVER. By the way, I read about speculations of what the cover would be like if it was drawn by Riggs. Riggs actually submitted some demo sketches to Maiden early on, which were apparently turned down. Khan from IMOC is friends with Riggs and he uploaded them a while back. Here they are:

Abductionrev.jpg

Abductedrev.jpg
 
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

It's a great song and it sounds like classic Maiden. I'm looking forward to buying the new album when it comes out. I regret being angry because they weren't coming to my area but I'm confident now that they'll be back around.
 

Ranko

I'll shoot the gunner first!
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

I think these sketches showed up on the forum a while ago. Even this concept looks much better than the actual cover that they went with.
 

pilau

Trooper
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

I like the first Riggs sketch a LOT! Too bad they chose the current one over Riggs's work. It could have been epic. Actually, both of the sketches remind me of 80s Megadeth album covers :)

Actually I also had a feeling that this was had something to do with the economy crisis - I was happy to see LC's interpretation, I don't think I could have laid that out as good as he did with my English skills :blush: +1 for LC!

Now that Brucie actually confirmed this is the context of the song then I just wanted to say that when I first read the lyrics first thing that came to my mind was banks fooling around with people's money, and MLM (Multi-Level Marketing) that my father once had quite an (not so good) adventure with.
 

Privateer454

Invader
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

Personally, I like the album cover.  While it is definately a big departure, I still dig it. The single cover, while I understand where it came from, I would have rather seen something closer tied to the theme of the single with a more tradtional style Eddie.

The single itself continues to grow on me more and more to where I'm almost to the point of just putting the MP3 player on repeat. I'm stoked by the return to a more old school, if you will, style and though I read that Steve said
the new album gets proggier as it goes
, I hope the new album stays with this style. 
 

Dominocracy

Prowler
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

Hey ladies and gents, first-time poster here. Haven't been on an Iron Maiden board since the official one went fan club only, but all this recent buzz about the new album and single got me excited enough to post something about it. So, without further adieu, here's my $0.02 on pretty much everything related to the new single. Fair warning: this will probably become long-winded.

El Dorado

As soon as that countdown timer went up on the Maiden site, my calendar was set. I downloaded that sumbitch pretty much the minute the download link went live, I hate to say though, my first impressions were more "wtf?" than "holy shit!" on the first listen or two. Not the reaction one hopes for when new Maiden material gets released, but fortunately it grew on me quite a bit after I played it a few times. It's not my favorite song by any stretch, but it definitely rocks like a bastard and sits happily among my most-played songs for the week.

The intro is a definite change of pace from the quiet buildups they've been overusing for a while, though since this is obviously a straight-up rocker, I think it's safe to say they'll show up elsewhere. It's a little jarring on the first couple of listens (especially when you're not expecting it to pop up in a shuffled playlist), but it'll probably make a lot more sense in context with the rest of the album. The first thing that really struck me as I listened (aside from the Mac Truck of an intro) was the bluesy swagger to the riffage, something I've personally been missing when I switch off from one of the earlier albums to something from the Bayley or post-reunion stuff. I cant help but be reminded of that Killers-era attitude, not in the music, but definitely in the spirit. Hopefully that becomes a trend on the rest of the album. I'm a fan of the unexpected little guitar flourishes thrown in around 2:17. It was a nice touch, and I wouldn't have minded more. The instrumental bit leading into the solos and the solos themselves give me a bigtime No Prayer vibe, and judging from the posts from others I haven't missed the mark by much. Solid soloing all around, no complaints here, but my mind wasn't necessarily blown.

Production/mixing/mastering/whatever sounds pretty clean and crispy clear, though at least once before they retire I'd like the three guitars to be little more defined. The YouTube remaster helps this somewhat if you're really listening for the different guitar tones, but the root problem lies in the mixing and no amount of tweaking can really fix it. Also, the aforementioned guitar flourishes are far lower in the mix than they should be. They're there for the soul purpose of standing out, why bury them?

Ah yes, and now a word about the vocals. I actually like where he was going with the more subdued, half-spoken way he goes about this song, however I think that it would've benefited greatly from some No Prayer/Fear of the Dark style balls-to-the-wall rasp. Given that other parts of the song echo that style, it *probably* would've worked pretty well. That said, I really don't mind the singing at all, my real problem is with how separated Bruce sounds from the rest of the band. It almost sounds as if everyone else recorded live in a room and Bruce got added in later. It's a weird disconnect from the rest of the song, and I hope this isn't a recurring problem with the rest of the record.

When it's all said and done, those few mixing booth complaints aside, I like El Dorado quite a bit. It sounds fresh and rocks tears face pretty hard for a band that in all respects should be in their career twilight at this point. As a fan, that's more than I could have hoped for. Judging by the music alone on El Dorado (and keeping in mind that this song by itself is roughly 6/76ths of the entire album) we're in for something far different than the three previous albums from the post-reunion lineup. This song was released to get us excited for what's coming in August and, for me at least, it did its job.

Track Listing & Album Covers

This post is already too long, so I won't say much more. Two songs in particular caught my eye: The Alchemist, clocking in at 4:29, is the shortest song on the album. Maiden hasn't had a real skull-crushing rocker since Be Quick or be Dead, and if the length is any indication, The Alchemist should definitely be a speedy tune. BQobD fast? Probably not, but a guy can dream goddammit. The other is When the Wild Wind Blows, the longest song on the album clocking in just shy of 11 minutes. Not much to say about it other than it's really fucking long and I'm extremely excited to listen to it. If it follows in the tradition of Maiden's other longer-than-reasonable songs (Rhyme, Sign of the Cross), this should be one hell of an album closer. Also, these song titles are really outside the box. I can't think of a single song that has had me as intrigued to listen to it from the title alone as any one of these songs do.

As for the album covers, the El Dorado single is great. It looks like the cover to an old pulp Sci-fi comic, complete with cheesy quotes from the main character and a corny plug for the other stories (read:songs) inside the book (read:album). I dig it.

What I do not dig is the cover for the full album. The spacesuit guys are kinda cool looking, but the overall style of the thing seems off. Especially from Melvyn Grant, who I am a big fan of from his previous collaborations with Maiden, specifically his Death on the Road and Benjamin Breeg covers. It has a cool idea behind it, the whole thing just looks so cartoonish though. Even the goofy nightmare Eddie from Fear of the Dark (another Grant interpretation, btw) had more bite to him than this weird alien thing. Is Eddie really big, or are the spacemen just really small? Anyway, Grant is an awesome artist and has done some great Maiden covers in the past, but I can't rightly call this one of them. Maybe it'll grow on me like El Dorado did, but as of this second I'm not a fan.

... is that a fucking spoon?

Okay, so to put a point on this thing, El Dorado really got me excited for The Final Frontier. Is it the greatest song ever? Of course not, but as far as album teasers go, I can't say I'm at all disappointed. Hell, I don't think I've been this excited for an album since AMoLaD came out in 2006, not to mention that this one comes out the day before my birthday. August 16th cannot come soon enough.
 

Privateer454

Invader
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

Bravo Dominocracy. 

I to am hoping for a generally more hard drivin album than the more recent offerings.  Not cause the others were bad in anyway, just to show the world that they can still do it, even if it is a regressive evolution as it were.  Hopefully The Alchemist is as you predicted and gets released as a single.  Maiden can really use a radio playable (I wont say radio friendly as that to me implies weak kneed) single to generate some buzz outside the inner circle.
 

pilau

Trooper
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

Dominocracy, I am sharing the same opinion with you when it comes to the new single. Wish I had the same expression skills when it comes to English as you have, so I could present my opinion in such a fluent and original manner, but hey, what do you know, at least people get my drift when I post. :lol:

I am glad you pointed out the same problems I have posted about regarding mixing and mastering. The mix is way beyond the standard you would expect from Maiden in my opinion. The problem is really mostly with the guitars, You can almost tell no difference between the three, even in the solo (except for Jan's solo). To make it even worse they are so weak-sounding, comparing to the drums and the bass guitar.

I think Will-I-Am here said that Maiden go against the industry's trend to maximize SPL and compromise dynamic range for sheer volume, which is absolutely terrific, but they're missing the point when their mixes sound like this. A big no no. I really hope we get a different mix for this song in the album and of course that they don't repeat this mistake with the rest of the songs, otherwise all of my expectations (which already went over the top after El Dorado came out) will explode in my face :(
 

Overlord

Prowler
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

gor said:

Looks like a AMOLAD copy to me. Im sorry but I dont believe Riggs drew any covers.

As for El Dorado think im on my 6th or 7th listen and after a few days gap I have listened to it again and it is pretty good. I'm hoping that the album continues in the same vein looks like it could be a 'be careful what you wish for' very loose futuristic concept album.
 

Babo 91

Nomad
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

Heres what i think about the song.

When i first listened to the song i was kind of confused because for some reason i was expecting something completely different. After the first listen i didn't really know what to think but the song seems to get better after each listen, im now on my 20th listen and i reckon its their best single since the wicker man.

As far as the lyrics go, they are typical bruce, full of metaphors and twisted meanings. I think the song is about conmen which could relate to the current economy. I picture a conman offering a boat ride to this awesome place where there are "streets of gold". Hundreds of people pay to go on this ride to el dorado but the boat doesn't even make it there ("ships of fools is sinking as their crack begin to grow) and the conman gets away with his money on a lifeboat.
 

Jeffmetal

Ancient Mariner
Re: Discussion thread for Final Frontier/El Dorado single

One other thing I'd like to talk is on Bruce's doubled vocals on El Dorado, which someone correctly pointed out on this thread - the first chorus on the studio version seems to be only Bruce and the last 2 are doubled, but live Steve sings all the 3 times the chorus is done.
 
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