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Luisma

Years Wasted
Th
I think Bruce was really talking about Pop Music Industry and how this wanted to destroy metal forever. He just putted Britney because she was the featuring star of the Music industry at that moment and I think she was the star at the Rock In Rio pop day.
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That's correct. In almost every concert in 2000 he said something about pop music or pop stars. As a matter of fact this was nothing new because in the 80's he also said things about Rick Asley and the likes so I don't get what's all the fuzz about what he said about Britney or the like
 

The Flash

Dennis Wilcock did 9/11
I think Bruce was really talking about Pop Music Industry and how this wanted to destroy metal forever. He just putted Britney because she was the featuring star of the Music industry at that moment and I think she was the star at the Rock In Rio pop day.
Yeah, and that is fucking stupid.

The music industry is about supply and demand, just like any other industry. If people like metal, metal will be profitable and therefore continue to receive investment by the music industry.

Many metal artists love to rile up the crowds by pushing an "us against them" thing. It's quite pretentious and irritating in my opinion. Henry Rollins of Black Flag once called out Bruce on this very issue in one of his speeches. Rollins is a bit of a prick himself and holds resentment toward Maiden for other reasons, as he describes in the very speech, but it's not an unjust criticism of Bruce.
 
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Black Abyss Babe

Ocean soul
Yeah, and that is fucking stupid.

The music industry is about supply and demand, just like any other industry. If people like metal, metal will be profitable and therefore continue to receive investment by the music industry.

Many metal artists love to rile up the crowds by pushing an "us against them" thing. It's quite pretentious and irritating in my opinion. Henry Rollins of Black Flag once called out Bruce on this very issue in one of his speeches. Rollins is a bit of a prick himself and holds resentment toward Maiden for other reasons, as he describes in the very speech, but it's not an unjust criticism of Bruce.
Bruce and his big mouth ...

With that particular rant from RIR he seems to be suggesting metal is superior to pop simply because it is not mainstream, and possibly also that Britney is inferior simply because she is a pop artist. This is exactly the sort of crap that gets metal a bad name - even if it's true (which is always debatable) it's hardly generous to say so, is it? Also I think Bruce (and Rod) have always been a bit in denial about how much the mainstream actually did notice them.

I think a lot of people who speak derisively of "pop music" are thinking mainly of the cynically manufactured end, typified first by Pete Waterman and later by Simon Cowell and his ilk. (Funnily enough, Motown never got the same kind of criticism, even though they basically made PWL possible.) But not all pop is manufactured and there is actually such a thing as a good pop song, and good pop singers. I must admin I didn't think Britney was a particularly deserving target for Bruce's ire, and I am not a Britney fan.
 

GhostofCain

Ancient Mariner
Wasn’t the criticism also related to not playing/singing live? I seem to remember some rants about this, but it was nearly 20 years ago and I might well be mistaken...
 

The Flash

Dennis Wilcock did 9/11
Wasn’t the criticism also related to not playing/singing live? I seem to remember some rants about this, but it was nearly 20 years ago and I might well be mistaken...
Not singing live was a criticism of Britney throughout her career, but the point isn't really about Britney's merit as an artist, it's more about Bruce going out of his way to bash her on stage to rile the crowd up and the silliness thereof.

Piling up on Britney was a bit of a thing back in the day. She was immensely popular so she became a bit of a scapegoat. Doubt that was the angle Bruce was coming from though, Britney probably just happened to be on Bruce's way, so to speak.
 

Xennon

Educated Fool
Bruce has no time to talk extensively in the LOTB. Maybe it was deliberate at the end of the day, I dont know, but I think not talking too much about the 'real world' is an asset of this last tour. Honestly, I want to pay attention to the drama of Iron Maiden--the voices of the characters and the stories and the lights and so on. Hearing the name Britney Spears will do nothing but destroy this experience.

So, I hope the band realizes what really works well with the LOTB. 1- Let the scenario flow. 2- Do not interrupt the process.
 

Zare

Automaton Sovietico
Rollins is a bit of a prick himself and holds resentment toward Maiden for other reasons, as he describes in the very speech
I like Rollins, and I've only seen the clip where he makes fun of Maiden fans for being harsh on support bands. What's this resentment all about?

And by the way, manufactured pop, like a lot of other "consumer" content or products, went above and beyond supply and demand into the area of opinion shaping. A lot of pop producers have been speaking out against the usual 4 chord bullshit that's been going on for 15+ years.

By the way #2, in the mid to late 1990s there were just 2 weekly metal shows running on three biggest music TV stations in Europe. HBB on MTV and Virus on VIVA2. You cannot tell me that supply and demand is 1500 monthly runs of Metallica's Whiskey in the Jar video vs 1 run of One in a dedicated after midnight show. It makes no sense.
 

Black Abyss Babe

Ocean soul
I like Rollins, and I've only seen the clip where he makes fun of Maiden fans for being harsh on support bands. What's this resentment all about?
He said Maiden fans were narrow-minded because they'd only gone to see Maiden. Well duh, of course they had! Who pays those ticket prices on the offchance that the support act might be mindblowing?

From my observations the worst a Maiden support act will get is a tepid reaction if they're not much good. And if they are good, they might even pick up a few new fans. I gather this is what happened with Ghost.
 

The Flash

Dennis Wilcock did 9/11
I like Rollins, and I've only seen the clip where he makes fun of Maiden fans for being harsh on support bands. What's this resentment all about?
Yeah it's basically that. Resentment towards their fans rather than the band itself, clearly. With the exception of Bruce.

And by the way, manufactured pop, like a lot of other "consumer" content or products, went above and beyond supply and demand into the area of opinion shaping. A lot of pop producers have been speaking out against the usual 4 chord bullshit that's been going on for 15+ years.
I disagree that it constitutes opinion shaping. Common denominator nonsense sells, because a lot of people have no taste. The blame lies on the people. There's always been "usual 4 chord bullshit" because there's always been interest in it. It's not a recent development. All of us hear cookie cutter nonsense everywhere, but yet many of us end up somewhere else.

Pop producers are speaking out for the same reason me and you would speak out against it. Diminished artistic quality.

You cannot tell me that supply and demand is 1500 monthly runs of Metallica's Whiskey in the Jar video vs 1 run of One in a dedicated after midnight show. It makes no sense.
It is, actually, at least that's still the goal. Whiskey in the Jar appeals to the common denominator more and the programming seeks to maximize interest in a given airtime. You can argue that it's an unwise business choice and a bad reading of supply and demand, but supply and demand is still the goal there. What incentive would there be for music companies or music stations to "destroy" metal if it's going to yield profit?
 
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Brigantium

Grim Reaper
Staff member
Agreed, I'd be inclined to put that down to the adrenaline and nerves of playing such a huge show. Even for a pro like Bruce that was still a big fuckin' deal. He had similar histrionics the first time in 85 smashing his guitar as well.

My only complaint is the "lame fucks" remarks are now on the new remaster of RIR, whereas they were thankfully edited off the original release.
Trying too hard to be all rock n roll.
 

Brigantium

Grim Reaper
Staff member
My enduring memory of the 90s is that it was better than the Stock Aitken and Waterman shitstorm that was the late 80s....
 

Black Abyss Babe

Ocean soul
My enduring memory of the 90s is that it was better than the Stock Aitken and Waterman shitstorm that was the late 80s....
My enduring memory of the 90s is that it was a bad time to be into metal and hard rock generally. People who in most circumstances would be quite civil and even friendly would turn on me with mockery and ridicule that sometimes bordered on spiteful when music was the subject under discussion. And when I had a guitar in my hands it was like I was being judged as a person based solely on my musical tastes. A very dark time ...
 
My enduring memory of the 90s is that it was a bad time to be into metal and hard rock generally. People who in most circumstances would be quite civil and even friendly would turn on me with mockery and ridicule that sometimes bordered on spiteful when music was the subject under discussion. And when I had a guitar in my hands it was like I was being judged as a person based solely on my musical tastes. A very dark time ...
Sounds like a black abyss, babe.
 

Black Abyss Babe

Ocean soul
Sounds like a black abyss, babe.
Oh yes, oh yes. I never felt inclined to alter my views and/or tastes to suit them, but it never seemed worthwhile to try to fight my corner either (are you familiar with the phrase "pissing into the wind"?) I just sort of withdrew into my own world and let them all get on with being pretentious, self-absorbed tossers without me. If only I'd know about Maiden in those days I'd have brazened it out and stuck two fingers up at the lot of them!
 

jazz from hell

Ancient Mariner
The 90s were alright, but not for Maiden. Rock music was strong though, Soundgarden, RATM, Dream Theater, but also tekkno and lovemobiles.
 

Brigantium

Grim Reaper
Staff member
My enduring memory of the 90s is that it was a bad time to be into metal and hard rock generally. People who in most circumstances would be quite civil and even friendly would turn on me with mockery and ridicule that sometimes bordered on spiteful when music was the subject under discussion. And when I had a guitar in my hands it was like I was being judged as a person based solely on my musical tastes. A very dark time ...
Yeah, there was that. Hard rock and metal was treated as tacky beyond belief. It wasn't paticularly acceptable where I lived. Grunge scene was sort of tolerated, though, albeit as something scuzzy students were into.
 
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