European Politics

[LooseCannon]

Re: European Union

... with the nice little exception that all the EU member states have their own constitution/fundamental law/whatever you'd like to call such a document already.

So do all 50 States & Commonwealths of the Union.  The only difference is pre-existing status as nation-states, a status that did exist in the USA in the 1780s.  Most colonies self-identified.  IE, you were a New Yorker, or a Virginian, or a Georgian.  This attitude persisted up until the 1880s, when the generation of men who died for the Union (and Confederacy) came into power.

 

[Anonymous]

Re: European Union

"What will happen after we'll join the European Union, can we still select our own food?"

Wales is part of the UK, therefore part of the EU. 







Yeah yeah yeah... Bad joke I know.
*takes his coat and leaves*

 

[Forostar]

Re: European Union

Even though I haven't been in the States I still dare to bet for everything I possess that there are more differences between the European States and each of their habits, cultures, traditions, histories and ideas than between all those US ones.

Proof? The fact that the USA united way sooner than we did.
On a more serious note: all the conflicts of the past tell enough.


edit:
Actually I indeed misspelled that word, Mav, and I was just too late to correct it!

 

[Hunlord]

Re: European Union

So your vote would have made a difference.

I don't live in Carlow. Its mostly farmers and boggers.

This is just going to be like the Nice treaty a few years ago. First time No won, another referendum a few months later, and Yes prevailed.

 

[LooseCannon]

Re: European Union

Even though I haven't been in the States I still dare to bet for everything I possess that there are more differences between the European States and each of their habits, cultures, traditions, histories and ideas than between all those US ones.

Proof? The fact that the USA united way sooner than we did.
On a more serious note: all the conflicts of the past tell enough.

I agree that the longer embedded traditions of various European Union nations makes unification a difficult process, but it's only been going for a few years now...when was the first time they attempted the Constitution?  Hasn't been all that long.  Remember, the USA was "founded" in 1776, but the first President of the United States wasn't elected until 1789.  I wouldn't be surprised if the process takes twice or thrice as long in Europe.

 

[Dr. Eddies Wingman]

Re: European Union

It's not replacing your whole constiturion. If interested you could wonder which are the differences between the two.

Perhaps it won't be easy to admit, but the reasons for Norway to not join the EU are not that hard to imagine.

"What will happen after we'll join the European Union, can we still select our own food?"

I'm not saying that it is replacing our constitution, I'm saying that's what many felt in 1994 and it was partly used as an argument by those who were against joining. However, one issue that played a major role back then was the difference in agricultural policies between Norway and the EU. In Norway we have a quite big number of small farms and the population is not as centralized as in many other European countries. This is partly because the government provides some financial support for farming, to make sure one can make a living from farming in Norway even with a quite small farm. The reason for this, I guess, is a desire to maintain enough farming to provide ourselves with food in a difficult period.

Many farmers feared that if we joined the EU it would mean the end of small-scale farming - that smaller farms would need to merge in order to be profitable because financial support from the government would no longer be legitimate. This would of course mean that only big-scale farms would be profitable. Actually, in rural Norway the majority was against EU membership whereas in the cities, the majority was for it.

Regarding Wales and whales and stuff - no, it was not an issue at all. We are aware that whale hunting is not very popular in the rest of Europe. But we don't care enough to let that decide whether or not to join the EU.

And I believe that if there would be a new referendum over this question within the next 10 years, we would actually vote yes this time.

 

[Onhell]

Re: European Union

Even though I haven't been in the States I still dare to bet for everything I possess that there are more differences between the European States and each of their habits, cultures, traditions, histories and ideas than between all those US ones.

Proof? The fact that the USA united way sooner than we did.
On a more serious note: all the conflicts of the past tell enough.


edit:
Actually I indeed misspelled that word, Mav, and I was just too late to correct it!

They had the luxury of sharing a language... I think that is the biggest key. Not only that, as LC explained they weren't THAT united. Before the Civil War people would say, "the United States are' After the civil war people said/say "The United States is" I doubt we'll have a EU civil war, but the issue is similar.

 

[Forostar]

Re: European Union

Thanks for that info EW! I remember that most Polish farmers also dislike(d) the EU because of their affairs. There, the merging has started, though I think they're still many small farmers left.

Regarding Wales and whales and stuff - no, it was not an issue at all. We are aware that whale hunting is not very popular in the rest of Europe. But we don't care enough to let that decide whether or not to join the EU.

Also not if it'll go like this: "Norway, even if you want to become a member of the EU, this can only happen when you're gonna stop hunting whales" ?

And I believe that if there would be a new referendum over this question within the next 10 years, we would actually vote yes this time.

The whale hunt or the earlier stuff you told?

@Onhell: we had some "European wars" in the past, some smaller, some bigger than European only (e.g. WWI & WWII), the most recent one was in the Balkan. A new one seems almost unbelievable, unless Serbia or/and R is going to f**k up something.

 

[Dr. Eddies Wingman]

Re: European Union

The whale hunt or the earlier stuff you told?

The referendum talk was about joining the EU ... after all, we had a referendum over it both times (in '72 and '94). But I think that now, many think that with the EEAl, which we are part of, imposes many decisions on us and we could as well join the EU and thus have a greater influence on those decisions.

Also not if it'll go like this: "Norway, even if you want to become a member of the EU, this can only happen when you're gonna stop hunting whales" ?

I don't see that as a very realistic scenario. I think the whale hunting is a bigger issue for the animal rights movements than with European governments. But whale hunt is not an important source of income for Norway (the export is of course not very big  ) so if it was really necessary to give it up for some reason I think we would.

 

[Deano]

Re: European Union

Proof? The fact that the USA united way sooner than we did.
On a more serious note: all the conflicts of the past tell enough.

Definitely, the conflicts of the past will ensure cultural integrity within the various member nations of the EU but much of Europe has also been "united" several times over the centuries by various empires that in my opinion have created some kind of bond between the citizens of independent countries.

 

[LooseCannon]

Re: European Union

I suddenly miss my old signature: "SPQR: The Original European Union"

 

[Anomica]

Re: European Union

EU really shows it's views on true democracy...if you have a referendum and the people say 'no', it must be corrected. No is not an option? What's that? Democracy? Saddam couldn't have done it better

 

[Onhell]

Re: European Union

I suddenly miss my old signature: "SPQR: The Original European Union"

I like my myspace quote: "Christendom: The Original European Union"

 

[Forostar]

Re: European Union

EU does not oppose drilling oil at North Pole

The European Union does not oppose drilling for oil and gas at the North Pole. EU commissioner Andris Pieblags says techniques have to be developed to make drilling safe for the local environment. Nature organisations, like the World Wide Fund for Nature (WWF), prefer alternative energy sources to be used. They say the North Pole is too vulnerable.

The Artic is rich in valuable raw materials. R, Norway, Denmark, Canada and the United States want to secure their share of the region. In May next year, they will be able to submit an ownership claim to the United Nations. The Norwegian company Statoil is already searching for oil at the North Pole, but only expects to be able to exploit the region in 2030.


+



Sarkozy's visit to cement new ties with Quebec

QUEBEC CITY — For the first time, a French President will speak before the Quebec National Assembly when Nicolas Sarkozy delivers an address next month heralding a new era in France's relations with Quebec and Canada.

The French President is expected to clarify France's new policy toward Quebec that promotes what Mr. Sarkozy has called “direct and privileged relations” with the province, while building “partnerships” with the rest of Canada.

However, there are concerns within the Quebec government that recent tensions between Premier Jean Charest and Stephen Harper's Conservatives in the midst of the current federal election campaign could undermine the province's aggressive pursuit of a major trade agreement between Canada and the European Union, should the Tories form the next government.

“After all the work that's been done on this issue, I expect it to go forward. I think people can make allowances. Everybody wins when you are clear on the issues,” Mr. Charest said yesterday in reference to his government's criticism of various Conservative policies.

Mr. Sarkozy's historic keynote address will be delivered on Oct. 17, only three days after the federal election. It coincides with the opening of the summit of la Francophonie – a body comprised of 55 French-speaking member states and governments, as well as 13 observer states – gathered in Quebec City to witness the closing events marking the city's 400th-anniversary celebrations.

Mr. Sarkozy, who holds the rotating presidency of the European Union, also plans to attend the Canada-EU summit in Montreal, which begins on the same day. The summit is expected to inaugurate transatlantic trade talks aimed at integrating Canada's economy with the 27 member countries of the European Community.

For the past two years, Mr. Charest has been pursuing a free-trade agreement with Europe, working aggressively to eliminate resistance expressed by other provinces and territories.

The pact would allow companies, from both sides of the Atlantic, access to government contracts and public-sector services. It would eliminate tariffs by promoting unrestricted trade in goods, services and investments, while allowing free movement of skilled workers in an open transatlantic market.

In fact, during Mr. Sarkozy's visit, Quebec expects to sign a precedent-setting manpower mobility agreement with France. The pact would allow qualified personnel from various professions working in France or Quebec to move freely between the two jurisdictions without having to pass required qualifying tests.

For Mr. Charest, the manpower mobility agreement with France could set the tone for launching talks on a Canada-EU trade agreement. According to an unreleased study of the proposed deal, bilateral trade and investments would increase by more than $40-billion a year. The three-day Canada-EU summit also begins on Oct. 17.

“If we continue to persist right up to the day of the meeting, we have a very good chance of launching the negotiations,” Mr. Charest said. “Given the context of an economic slowdown in the United States, this is a significant decision for Canada but especially for Quebec because we are the gateway [to North America] for Europe.”

 

[LooseCannon]

Re: European Union

I'm all for it.  Let's be honest, if Canada enters into some form of partnership with the EU, it can't hurt.  Plus, we become an outlet for US goods into Europe.  That will be amazing and help.  Not that I'm ready to give up the ol' loonie for a Euro, yet.  But I wouldn't be opposed to it in the future.  Especially if the bottoms drop out down below us.

 

[Genghis Khan]

Re: European Union

I agree.  Any trade with powerful nations is good for Canada.

On a side note, I wonder if an increase in the standard of living in more rural Quebec due to trade will diminish anti-confederation sentiments among Francophones.

 

[Onhell]

Re: European Union

"Powerful" nations already trade amongst each other, in fact, almost exclusively. The third world is like a necessary evil for them.

 

[Forostar]

Re: European Union

Guantanamo Bay is part of the US.

Perhaps this was said in a different context, but the question has become pretty relevant now.

Europe cautious on resettling Guantanamo detainees

PARIS - European capitals reacted with caution Wednesday to the idea of resettling terror suspects released from Guantanamo Bay, with Paris seeking a concerted European approach and others opposed to the idea.

The Netherlands went furthest, ruling out accepting any of the inmates despite broad European support for U.S. president-elect Barack Obama’s promise to shut down the notorious military detention centre.

"If they are not to be tried but cannot return to their own countries, it is first and foremost the responsibility of the country which arrested and imprisoned them, the United States," a Dutch foreign ministry spokesman said.

"The Netherlands will not take in Guantanamo inmates."

Portugal and Germany had previously signalled that they might accept some detainees, but France was also cautious, welcoming the imminent closure of the camp, but calling for a common European position.

"We think consultation between Europeans should continue because we think it is natural that our response should be discussed and coordinated between Europeans," French foreign ministry spokesman Eric Chevallier told AFP.

Germany had previously made a similar announcement.

"In our view Guantanamo must be closed on legal and humanitarian grounds, in terms of international law and human rights, and for moral reasons," German government spokesman Thomas Steg told reporters on Monday.

"If we begin to review such closure plans and take a stance, then it can only be in a European context based on a discussion with all member states."

Obama has promised to close down the detention facility - part of a sovereign U.S. naval base Cuba - after he comes to office next month, raising the question of what to do with the remaining 250 inmates.

Some of the prisoners, alleged "enemy combatants" captured since 2001 by U.S. and allied forces around the world during the so-called War on Terror, are no longer considered a threat by US authorities and will be resettled.

The prisoners come from a variety of countries, mostly in the Middle East, and some may want to go home, but others fear they will be re-arrested in their homelands and could face torture or a lengthy incarceration.

On Tuesday, the U.S. State Department welcomed signals from Germany and Portugal that they might be prepared to help out, raising the possibility that other European allies might provide asylum for former detainees.

France currently holds the European Union’s rotating presidency, but is due to hand the torch to the Czech Republic next week, and officials indicated that no joint decision on Guantanamo detainees would be taken beforehand.

State Department spokesman Sean McCormack said Tuesday that reports Europe might accept inmates were "quite encouraging" and marked "a new attitude" on the part of allies who rejected similar requests by President George W. Bush.

He singled out Germany and Portugal, whose foreign minister, Luis Amado, called on his European Union counterparts earlier this month to help the United States close Guantanamo by taking in detainees from third countries.

"Portugal and Foreign Minister Luis Amado should be praised for what they have done in, sort of, blazing a trail for a new European attitude in this regard," McCormack said.

Nevertheless, aside from Portugal, Europe appears cool on the idea.

"At the moment we haven’t received any official application from the United States to take any prisoner yet so it’s not an issue," Swedish foreign ministry spokeswoman Miriam Mannbro said.

"For Sweden, the United States has the responsibility for their prisoners."

Media reports suggest that Denmark will also refuse any U.S. request, and Poland was also dubious about the idea.

"We haven’t received any request from the United States, and in any case we haven’t the experience to deal with this kind of prisoners," Polish foreign ministry spokesman Piotr Paszkowski told AFP.

 

[LooseCannon]

Re: European Union

That's awesome.  NIMBY!  "US, we want you to close your terrorist torture camp.  However, we are unwilling to assist you in any way.  You see, you have to keep the terrorists or send them back.  Despite the fact that many European countries have healthy, vibrant Muslim communities...well, we just plain don't want to deal with them, even though splitting some of these guys up over a couple continents might be the best way to go."

 

[Forostar]

Re: European Union

Heh, I guess the US wants to get rid of Guantanamo as much as other countries.

Why would the US be a worse host than European Union countries X, Y and Z?
Why would someone from the US think different about these inmates?


Why not split the guys over some United States, there's enough states to spread them. About 5 in each state?