Habberdasher
Trooper
Also, the lyrics to Alexander are historically inaccurate. They DID follow him to India, but were turned back due to the fact his soldiers were tired of the combat, pain and the glory.
Why has some great songs been overlooked when it came to playing them live?
- Thread starter Dantif3r
- Start date
Forostar
Ancient Mariner
Private Benjamin Breeg
Trooper
This is the ponderment for the fans of many bands, I'm guessing. There are those -- Porcupine Tree, for instance -- who do a great job of shuffling oddities into the mix. But most mainstream bands and their fans seem to suffer this same disconnect between what the bands like playing and what fans want to hear. I'm also a Kiss fan and they do a great job of convincing themselves that fans have expectations to hear these dozen or so staples...which, to me, is simply code for "we're too lazy to practice oddities...sorry."
There are certainly songs I think Maiden could ditch. I'm not sure why they think there's a pressing need and overwhelming desire to hear Iron Maiden or Run To The Hills or The Tropper EVERY SINGLE TOUR (or so it seems anyhow).
On the flipside the band does their nostalgia jaunts with relative frequency, so they do a better job than most bands of mixing up old and new material, even if not always in the same tour.
Still, a tired song is a tired song.
There are certainly songs I think Maiden could ditch. I'm not sure why they think there's a pressing need and overwhelming desire to hear Iron Maiden or Run To The Hills or The Tropper EVERY SINGLE TOUR (or so it seems anyhow).
On the flipside the band does their nostalgia jaunts with relative frequency, so they do a better job than most bands of mixing up old and new material, even if not always in the same tour.
Still, a tired song is a tired song.
Private Benjamin Breeg said:
First of all, this newcomer just got interesting. A fan of both Porcupine Tree and Kiss? Speaking my language.
More importantly: a band has to consider more than the hardcore fans. Sure, I've seen The Trooper live a bunch of times. But if someone came to their first-ever Maiden show - especially on a nostalgia tour - and didn't get to see The Trooper, they'd be rightly disappointed.
For example: despite being a huge fan, I've never seen Kiss live. If someday I do, and they fail to play Detroit Rock City, I'm gonna be nine kinds of pissed off.
Another example: I'm a Dream Theater fan, and just saw them for the first time last year. They didn't play Metropolis - both their signature song and my favorite song. (Not just my favorite DT song - my favorite song, period.) I knew it was unlikely based on the setlists already played on that tour, but I was still sad.
There is a balance that has to be struck between setlist variation, and making sure everyone gets to hear the classics live. For most of their career, Maiden has been good at it. It's only in the past decade that they've started nostalgia tours, which has changed the equation.
Private Benjamin Breeg
Trooper
SinisterMinisterX said:First of all, this newcomer just got interesting. A fan of both Porcupine Tree and Kiss? Speaking my language.
More importantly: a band has to consider more than the hardcore fans. Sure, I've seen The Trooper live a bunch of times. But if someone came to their first-ever Maiden show - especially on a nostalgia tour - and didn't get to see The Trooper, they'd be rightly disappointed.
For example: despite being a huge fan, I've never seen Kiss live. If someday I do, and they fail to play Detroit Rock City, I'm gonna be nine kinds of pissed off.
Another example: I'm a Dream Theater fan, and just saw them for the first time last year. They didn't play Metropolis - both their signature song and my favorite song. (Not just my favorite DT song - my favorite song, period.) I knew it was unlikely based on the setlists already played on that tour, but I was still sad.
There is a balance that has to be struck between setlist variation, and making sure everyone gets to hear the classics live. For most of their career, Maiden has been good at it. It's only in the past decade that they've started nostalgia tours, which has changed the equation.
You make great points for sure. And I agree that a band like Kiss does have some staples...(Detroit, Rock & Roll All Nite, etc). But honestly I do think the band conveniently overstates this.
For instance Kiss has made it a point to play 100,000 Years on just about every tour since reuniting back in '96. No problem with me. It's a great song. But I think if you expect that people outside the diehards insist on it you're thinking too much. The casual Kiss fan probably knows a half dozen songs. Probably the same with Maiden or perhaps fewer even.
In Kiss's case I think they just fall back on the things they can play in their sleep and use it as an excuse to not dig deeper. It feels and seems that way to me. Maiden I really think feels they NEED to play Iron Maiden and Run To The Hills. Still if we didn't hear them for one tour and still heard a few other staples (Number Of The Beast and The Trooper) to keep the casuals awake, would it kill anyone??
Is the SONG Iron Maiden really that popular that it couldn't be passed over for....something else just once? I'm guessing not.
But like with Kiss, I think Maiden feels they need to hit certain signposts on time. Gene spits blood during song x....breathes fire during song y....Paul trapezes out into the audience HERE. Maiden is somewhat the same way. Eddie gets rolled out during Iron Maiden, etc. But surely there aren't "laws" governing such things.
Make Ed come out during Powerslave. Easy. Bruce can wave the flag...in some other tune.
Private Benjamin Breeg said:But like with Kiss, I think Maiden feels they need to hit certain signposts on time. Gene spits blood during song x....breathes fire during song y....Paul trapezes out into the audience HERE. Maiden is somewhat the same way. Eddie gets rolled out during Iron Maiden, etc. But surely there aren't "laws" governing such things.
I don't think that that's quite correct. Maiden have their signature moves, but they have a decent bit of variation with it. Eddie coming out during Iron Maiden is one thing that never changes, and I don't think it should. I'd miss it a lot. However, the walk-on Eddie has come at various points... and what about the A Matter of Life and Death tour? Playing the entire new album was something they hadn't done before... and they didn't play a lot of classics, which got them a lot of flak. I really can't see the Kiss connection there.
Private Benjamin Breeg
Trooper
Perun said:
No, you're right. And that example (playing all of A Matter...) is where Maiden, I think, does a good job of mixing it up compared to many bands. The fact that they do this album-tour / nostalgia tour (I know they'd hate that description) sequence of late helps this. Kiss would never dream of playing an entire new album. They're far worse in that department without a doubt.
Still it would be nice to hear, say, Flight Of Icarus instead of The Trooper one go 'round. Or The Prisoner instead of Run To The Hills. But the above comment about a band feeling compelled to play their known numbers is well noted, even if I don't always agree that it's necessary.
In the end I guess it's a good problem to have....so many good songs that it's difficult to keep people satisfied.
There are groups out there who don't have this "problem" and would simply flounder without regularly touching bases x, y, and z. 
I've seen Maiden 5 times since Somewhere In Time....and it wouldn't hurt my feelings if they skipped The Trooper, Iron Maiden. I do like when the open with Aces High with Churchill's speech and then blast into the song. I at the last concert in '08, Bruce made mention of doing a song that no one expected and they did Moonchild. People were talking about it on the walk back to their cars....and it was great live. Would have loved to made the Matter of...where they played the whole album...not sure there is a bad song on that.