Tribute? Stealing? Just innocent influence? Where to draw the line?

Whoops, I dropped a weblink.



  • You should already know it.
  • Listen closely to the lyrics.
  • Then, listen closely to the instrumental section starting from 3:46 on.
  • The song was recorded in 1974.
  • Post your results in spoiler tags. I don't want to give it away all too easily.
 
LooseCannon said:
The use of parody in the US has been the constant source of legal battles.  Consider:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hustler_Ma ... v._Falwell
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The Hustler v. Falwell case was a little different, in that I don't think it had anything to do with copying or copyright infringement.  As I recall, Falwell sued for defamation, and the S.Ct. held that (I'm paraphrasing) if you're a public figure, you are fair game for parody. 

As for Perun's weblink...
Wow.  I wasn't aware of that song.  That's disappointing.  I obviously recognize the lyrics,from HBTN.  I also recognize the instrumental riff and the solo from another song (or two) but I can't place it at the moment.  **EDIT:  Just figured it out.  Sounds just like the instrumental bit in Nomad.**  Was this the subject of any comment by Harris?  **EDIT: Just went to the Commentary for Nomad and saw that Maverick identified it, too.  Did some further research, and it appears that some of the Iron Maiden guys are friends with the Beckett frontman.**
 
cornfedhick said:
Wow.  I wasn't aware of that song.  That's disappointing.  I obviously know the song that borrowed the lyrics, and I recognize the instrumental riff and the solo from another song (or two) but I can't place it at the moment.  Was this the subject of any comment by Harris?
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The Nomad. The entire instrumental section is lifted (and improved, in my opinion). And no, this isn't common knowledge... the song was (re)discovered two years ago, but it never gained any mass exposure (although it is mentioned on the Commentary). I'm inclined to think that the Maiden boys meant this as a tribute, since they covered another song from that band on the B-Side of Two Minutes To Midnight.
 
I'll say it's improved. I must admit, it has to be labelled as a tribute - I don't think Maiden will deliberately rip another bands piece of music off in such a way.

Nice to hear the original as well, thanks for the Link Perun
 
At the risk of being labeled a flatterer, I must say that, finding
the reference to Beckett's song
on Maverick's Commentary (after spending about 30 minutes listening to song after song on my iTunes) really drives home just how valuable a resource that website is for Maiden fans.  I would never in a million years have known of this connection without it (and Perun's post here). 
 
thanks Perun

@Albie : if it was a tribute, why not to be credited ? so the musicians of Beckett could make some money of the royalties

@cornfedhick : you could have known the connection if you had bought Eddies Archieve  ;)
a lot of fans search the influences of their favourite bands, I found a lot of things searching the roots of Led Zeppelin  ;)

...songs like Stairway to heaven, rock n roll, and many more are almost copied from other bands
not to speak for "when the levee breaks" that has the same lyrics with the original without
being credited
 
cornfedhick said:
In contrast, independent creation is okay -- the famous hypothetical of a monkey accidentally typing Hamlet would not be copyright infringement (even if Shakespeare's works were still protected by copyright law).  However, as Gamma Ray presumably is well aware of Iron Maiden's catalog, and thus had "access" to the works, I doubt they could credibly make this argument.
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This happened when the Rolling Stones recorded 'Anybody Seen My Baby' (off the 1997 album Bridges to Babylon). After hearing the song, someone told Jagger and Richards that their chorus sounded a lot like k.d. lang's 'Constant Craving' from 1992. They said they'd never heard the song before, but to avoid any legal trouble they just added k.d. lang to the song's credits.

BTW - I also listened to Life's Shadow by Beckett... Holy crap - even if the instrumental is a tribute, the lyrics are a direct ripoff... What a shame, it seems that the best part of the lyrics from one of Maiden's best songs weren't even written by Maiden...
 
gulranek said:
What a shame, it seems that the best part of the lyrics from one of Maiden's best songs weren't even written by Maiden...
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Are you referring to
"Cruelty has a human heart" (in Paschendale) which came from William Blake?
 
I was looking up the most recent "Metal that sounds like other metal" videos yesterday, and I found the same video as Forostar's last one. I think there are more parallels that could be made from the songs in that video.

The first is already mentioned - the copied riff from "Exciter". But the next is much worse:

"Hell Is Thy Home" takes the riff from "Leather Rebel" as shown in the video, but it sounds like it's paired with the A-G-A progression of "Night Crawler" (listen to the verse of the latter and compare).

"Real World" is compared to "The Sentinel" by Priest, but I think the vocal line reminds even more of the bonus track "Living Bad Dreams" from the remastered edition of Painkiller.

"Heart of the Unicorn" does, as indicated sound a bit like Painkiller, but the guitar line reminds me of "Metal Meltdown" ...

But the riff from "The Clairvoyant" is so obvious that it's embarrassing.

It's almost as if Gamma Ray have become a tribute band  :D
 
Yes. I find it very naive to think that many metalheads won't recognize all these classics.

Invader also recently found out some "borrowing" by Gamma Ray.
Sorry, Invader I still didn't check it.. :/
 
Um...  I didn't recognize any as I've never listened to Priest and other "classics"...
 
Not only Priest, I'd say read back the topic. ;)

One of the latest findings started by the ear of Invader. That early guitar riff in the intro from From the Ashes has something of Deja-Vu, but surely not as much as other comparisons.   

It comes back at 1.34-1.45 and 2.43-2.53.

3.17 and further is also very Maidenish. They were a big inspiration for GR's latest album!
 
Land of the Free II? Haven't heard it yet. I only own three, I'm barely starting to see the ones on No World Order... I'm positive were I more familiar with Metal's "classic" lexicon I'd recognize such transgressions easily, I do it with other bands and genres...
 
Forostar said:
Not only Priest, I'd say read back the topic. ;)

One of the latest findings started by the ear of Invader. That early guitar riff in the intro from From the Ashes has something of Deja-Vu, but surely not as much as other comparisons.   

It comes back at 1.34-1.45 and 2.43-2.53.

3.17 and further is also very Maidenish. They were a big inspiration for GR's latest album!
Click to expand...

The part from 3:52 reminds me of "The Loneliness of the Long Distance Runner"  :D I also think I hear a little of "Brighter than a thousand Suns" in the opening line ...
 
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