The (Archeological) Discoveries Topic

Scientists say Copernicus' remains, grave found

WARSAW, Poland (AP) — Researchers said Thursday they have identified the remains of Nicolaus Copernicus by comparing DNA from a skeleton and hair retrieved from one of the 16th-century astronomer's books. The findings could put an end to centuries of speculation about the exact resting spot of Copernicus, a priest and astronomer whose theories identified the Sun, not the Earth, as the center of the universe.

Polish archaeologist Jerzy Gassowski told a news conference that forensic facial reconstruction of the skull, missing the lower jaw, his team found in 2005 buried in a Roman Catholic Cathedral in Frombork, Poland, bears striking resemblance to existing portraits of Copernicus.

The reconstruction shows a broken nose and other features that resemble a self-portrait of Copernicus, and the skull bears a cut mark above the left eye that corresponds with a scar shown in the painting.

Moreover, the skull belonged to a man aged around 70 — Copernicus's age when he died in 1543.

"In our opinion, our work led us to the discovery of Copernicus's remains but a grain of doubt remained," Gassowski said.

So, in the next stage, Swedish genetics expert Marie Allen analyzed DNA from a vertebrae, a tooth and femur bone and matched and compared it to that taken from two hairs retrieved from a book that the 16th-century Polish astronomer owned, which is kept at a library of Sweden's Uppsala University where Allen works.

"We collected four hairs and two of them are from the same individual as the bones," Allen said.

Gassowski is head of the Archaeology and Anthropology Institute in Pultusk, in central Poland, and Allen works at the Rudbeck Laboratory of the Genetics and Pathology Department of Uppsala University.

Copernicus was known to have been buried in the 14th-century Frombork Cathedral where he served as a canon, but his grave was not marked. The bones found by Gassowski were located under floor tiles near one of the side altars.

Gassowski's team started his search in 2004, on request from regional Catholic bishop, Jacek Jezierski.

"In the two years of work, under extremely difficult conditions — amid thousands of visitors, with earth shifting under the heavy pounding of the organ music — we managed to locate the grave, which was badly damaged," Gassowski said.

Copernicus is believed to have come up with his main idea of the Sun at the center of the universe between 1508 and 1514, and during those years wrote a manuscript commonly known as Commentariolus (Little Commentary).

His final thesis was only published, however, in the year of his death. His ideas challenged the Bible, the church and past theories, and they had important consequences for future thinkers, including Galileo, Descartes and Newton.


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450px-Jan_Matejko-Astronomer_Copernicus-Conversation_with_God.jpg

The astronomer Copernicus: Conversation with God, painted by Jan Matejko (1872)
 
That's pretty cool indeed! Although I wonder what they're going to do with the remains now..
 
*nods*

This person also wonders.

I guess a decent reburial, but not before everything has been completely researched (if there's more to do).
 
It kind of reminds me of when French archaeologists brought the mummy of Ramesses II to Paris for examination- it was actually received with military honours, because it was issued a passport which listed its profession as "King (deceased).

So there are reference points for such cases...
 
I think he should get the same treatment upon his death that any great 16th c. scientist ended up getting.

BURN HIM AT THE STAKE!
 
Black hole confirmed in Milky Way

There is a giant black hole at the centre of our galaxy, a study has confirmed.

German astronomers tracked the movement of 28 stars circling the centre of the Milky Way, using two telescopes in Chile.

The black hole is four million times more massive than our Sun, according to the paper in The Astrophysical Journal.

Black holes are objects whose gravity is so great that nothing - including light - can escape them.

According to Dr Robert Massey, of the Royal Astronomical Society (RAS), the results suggest that galaxies form around giant black holes in the way that a pearl forms around grit.

'The black pearl'

Dr Massey said: "Although we think of black holes as somehow threatening, in the sense that if you get too close to one you are in trouble, they may have had a role in helping galaxies to form - not just our own, but all galaxies.

"They had a role in bringing matter together and if you had a high enough density of matter then you have the conditions in which stars could form.

"Thus the first generation of stars and galaxies could have come into existence".

The researchers from the Max Planck Institute for Extraterrestrial Physics in Germany said the black hole was 27,000 light years, or 158 thousand, million, million miles from the Earth.

"Undoubtedly the most spectacular aspect of our 16-year study, is that it has delivered what is now considered to be the best empirical evidence that super-massive black holes do really exist," said Professor Reinhard Genzel, head of the research team.

"The stellar orbits in the galactic centre show that the central mass concentration of four million solar masses must be a black hole, beyond any reasonable doubt."

Observations were made using the 3.5m New Technology Telescope and the 8.2m Very Large Telescope (VLT) in Chile. Both are operated by the European Southern Observatory (Eso).


"The most spectacular aspect of our 16-year study, is that it has delivered what is now considered to be the best empirical evidence that super-massive black holes do exist"
Professor Reinhard Genzel Head of the research team
 
German archaeologists believe history needs to be rewritten. Check out this link:

Ancient Roman battlefield excavated in Lower Saxony

So far, the most sensational Roman-era finds in Germany were a few remains of towns and settlements far outside of the imperial frontiers, which proved that during the Augustaean campaign (between ca 20 BC and 17 AD, if memory serves me), Germania was indeed considered a full Roman province that was already being Romanised. However, no ancient source speaks of Roman military operations so deep in Germania afterwards, and certainly not in the 3d century, and there are absolutely no other archaeological finds that serve as evidence for that. I'm really looking forward to hearing more of this.
 
sêaking about Germania
it's strange that this word comes from an ancient land
(today between Iran -Pakistan) called Karamania
 
The word certainly does not come from the name Karmania. At best, they are related.
 
It was the name of one tribe that resided at the lower Rhine. Caesar named them Germani cisrhenani, and they were part of the larger group of the Eburones. The Gauls used the name to refer to all their eastern neighbours, and the Romans continued with that tradition, well knowing that it was inaccurate.
 
right, but Ceasar didn't name them out of the blue ; probably this was a transcription of what this name sounded in their proper language -something very common these times
 
I said that that was the name of a small tribe residing at the lower Rhine. It was their name. A small tribe living at the lower Rhine carried the name Germanians, and the Gauls and Romans took that name and gave it to the people living east of the Rhine.
 
Wiki no_5, wiki. :)

Germania was the Latin exonym for a geographical area of land on the east bank of the River Rhine (inner Germania), which included regions of Sarmatia as well as an area under Roman control on the west bank of the Rhine. The name came into use after Julius Caesar adopted it from a Gallic term for the peoples east of the Rhine that probably meant "neighbour".
 
My source is an Der Kleine Pauly, an Encyclopaedia of Antiquity written by renowned scholars. I really just rephrased what is written there.
 
Forostar said:
Wiki no_5, wiki. :)

The name came into use after Julius Caesar adopted it from a Gallic term for the peoples east of the Rhine that probably meant "neighbour".

ok I quite! if the term means something in a language, then is useless to search it in southern Iran  :)

Perun said:
I said that that was the name of a small tribe residing at the lower Rhine. It was their name. A small tribe living at the lower Rhine carried the name Germanians, and the Gauls and Romans took that name and gave it to the people living east of the Rhine.

again this was a common practice ; Romans were the tribe around Rome and Hellenes a tribe in central Greece.
same thing for Angli, who gave their name to England
 
____no5 said:
again this was a common practice ; Romans were the tribe around Rome and Hellenes a tribe in central Greece.
same thing for Angli, who gave their name to England

I never said anything else. I just told you where they took the name from.
 
Pretty interesting that they've crossed the Rhine. In the Netherlands they never did (until now they think so ;) ).
 
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