Paschendale_CRO
Trooper
that's cool!!
Scary news
- Thread starter Wrathchild666
- Start date
[!--QuoteBegin-Wrathchild666+Jul 11 2004, 12:54 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Wrathchild666 @ Jul 11 2004, 12:54 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--] So, SMX will buildings be affected if this happen just like an Earthquake? [/quote]
Sorry about the delay in responding - my home computer is temporarily out of commission. However, Mav's answer was correct. Most buildings would be torn from their foundations and roll along the surface of the earth. Even with a strong foundation, tall buildings would stand almost no chance of survival. The only type of building that might survive would be one that is:
a. very flat, with a large surface area to height ratio
b. very securely fastened to the ground - the foundation of a typical house would be nowhere near sufficient
c. solidly constructed, such that pieces would not easily be torn loose
The only building that I can think of which fits the above conditions is the Pentagon - the US military headquarters just outside of Washington DC.
And as Mav said, human casualties would be enormous. It's possible all humans would be killed, and if any survived it might not be enough to keep the species alive. The same would be true of all animal species. Plants would stand a better chance of survival; though many would die, their seeds should survive.
Sorry about the delay in responding - my home computer is temporarily out of commission. However, Mav's answer was correct. Most buildings would be torn from their foundations and roll along the surface of the earth. Even with a strong foundation, tall buildings would stand almost no chance of survival. The only type of building that might survive would be one that is:
a. very flat, with a large surface area to height ratio
b. very securely fastened to the ground - the foundation of a typical house would be nowhere near sufficient
c. solidly constructed, such that pieces would not easily be torn loose
The only building that I can think of which fits the above conditions is the Pentagon - the US military headquarters just outside of Washington DC.
And as Mav said, human casualties would be enormous. It's possible all humans would be killed, and if any survived it might not be enough to keep the species alive. The same would be true of all animal species. Plants would stand a better chance of survival; though many would die, their seeds should survive.
Wrathchild666
Trooper
Talk about catastrophe.
Black Ace
Trooper
WOW! It's a good thing I came here! Back in the IMBB they'ld probably day somethin like :"Man,that's a bummer! LEt's fuck till then so we'll all have a good time" [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/biggrin.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'biggrin.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/biggrin.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'biggrin.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/biggrin.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'biggrin.gif\' /][!--endemo--] .Allright [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/rolleyes.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'rolleyes.gif\' /][!--endemo--] . May be I exagerated a bit. But somewhere around there.[!--emo&:lmao:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/lol.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'lol.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
I must differ Perun. Didn't you hear that an ex member of Jethro Tull changed his sex to female? Yes! Men are turning to females and females to males. I'm not saying the armageddon's comig(firstly because i'm an atheist) but that your statement was wrong
Cheers
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/biggrin.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'biggrin.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/biggrin.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'biggrin.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/biggrin.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'biggrin.gif\' /][!--endemo--] .Allright [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/rolleyes.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'rolleyes.gif\' /][!--endemo--] . May be I exagerated a bit. But somewhere around there.[!--emo&:lmao:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/lol.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'lol.gif\' /][!--endemo--] I must differ Perun. Didn't you hear that an ex member of Jethro Tull changed his sex to female? Yes! Men are turning to females and females to males. I'm not saying the armageddon's comig(firstly because i'm an atheist) but that your statement was wrong
Cheers
Black Ace
Trooper
And if the earth would stop spinning around it's ax, it would be an disaster. The part of the earth which was opposite to the sun at the moment of the halt, would be forever doomed to an eternity of darkness and night,while the part that was facing the sun,would have an everlasting daylight... [!--emo&:unsure:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/unsure.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'unsure.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
Cheers
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--] Cheers
Black Ace
Trooper
I never ment to outexplain the masters of physics (not to mention veterans on this board) just wanted to make my oppinion known. That's what BB's are all about,no [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/cool.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'cool.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/rolleyes.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'rolleyes.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/cool.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'cool.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/rolleyes.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'rolleyes.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
A
Anonymous
Guest
[!--QuoteBegin-Black Ace+Jul 18 2004, 01:54 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Black Ace @ Jul 18 2004, 01:54 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--] And if the earth would stop spinning around it's ax, it would be an disaster. The part of the earth which was opposite to the sun at the moment of the halt, would be forever doomed to an eternity of darkness and night,while the part that was facing the sun,would have an everlasting daylight... [/quote]
Very pertinent remark. [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/cool.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'cool.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
If the situation lasted, though, it would be like Venus, who shows constanlty the same face to the Sun. One side being scorched, the other in deep-frozen night (temperatures close to the Absolute Zero). Venus still spins on her axis though...
Anyway, what could make the Earth stop? The rotation would re-start at one point or another, according to the celestial rules.
Well, I'm no expert... [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/sleep.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'sleep.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
Very pertinent remark. [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/cool.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'cool.gif\' /][!--endemo--] If the situation lasted, though, it would be like Venus, who shows constanlty the same face to the Sun. One side being scorched, the other in deep-frozen night (temperatures close to the Absolute Zero). Venus still spins on her axis though...
Anyway, what could make the Earth stop? The rotation would re-start at one point or another, according to the celestial rules.
Well, I'm no expert... [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/sleep.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'sleep.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
A
Anonymous
Guest
[!--QuoteBegin-Perun+Jul 9 2004, 09:44 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Perun @ Jul 9 2004, 09:44 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]As for the signs of armageddon, the fact that men challenge to build the highest buildings is true; the fact that men become women and vice versa isn't.[/quote]
Actually, yes that can happen too. There have been cases where a female begins to morph into a male, and vice versa. I don't remember the exact numbers, but I think this happens to about 1 in every 10 000 people, so it's not too uncommon. It usually starts to happen once the person reaches puberty. Needless to say, it's usually very emotionally devastating for someone who's going through this.
This natural "switch" from one gender to the next comes from evolution. Nature has a way of taking care of shit by itself, by evolution. For example... If a species (for whatever reason) happens to have more female members than male members, over time the species will evolve to produce a gene in which some females will change into males over time, to even the ratio of females to males. Or maybe the species will evolve to have more male offspring naturally, to even the ratio. In the case with humans, I suppose this evolutionary trait hasn't faded out completely yet.
I'm not sure, but I think this situation also happens with certain species of frog (don't know which one.) Actually now that I think about it, this was what happend in the movie Jurassic Park. In the Beginning of the movie the dinosaurs were all female, to control breeding. But in the cloning process, the dinosaurs' DNA had been mixed with the DNA of a certain species of frog, since the two DNA's were very similar. This peticular species of frog has been known to morph from one gender to the other, which was what happend to the dinosaurs in Jurassic Park... some of the females became males, which made it possible for them to breed beyond control (which aided in the downfall of Jurassic Park.)
Now before anyone says anything... yes I know the Jurassic Park was only a movie. However, the only thing stopping dinosaurs from being cloned in this day & age, is the fact that there's no dino-DNA to work with. Anyhoo, I'll just end here before this gets too off-topic... Sorry about the really long post.
Actually, yes that can happen too. There have been cases where a female begins to morph into a male, and vice versa. I don't remember the exact numbers, but I think this happens to about 1 in every 10 000 people, so it's not too uncommon. It usually starts to happen once the person reaches puberty. Needless to say, it's usually very emotionally devastating for someone who's going through this.
This natural "switch" from one gender to the next comes from evolution. Nature has a way of taking care of shit by itself, by evolution. For example... If a species (for whatever reason) happens to have more female members than male members, over time the species will evolve to produce a gene in which some females will change into males over time, to even the ratio of females to males. Or maybe the species will evolve to have more male offspring naturally, to even the ratio. In the case with humans, I suppose this evolutionary trait hasn't faded out completely yet.
I'm not sure, but I think this situation also happens with certain species of frog (don't know which one.) Actually now that I think about it, this was what happend in the movie Jurassic Park. In the Beginning of the movie the dinosaurs were all female, to control breeding. But in the cloning process, the dinosaurs' DNA had been mixed with the DNA of a certain species of frog, since the two DNA's were very similar. This peticular species of frog has been known to morph from one gender to the other, which was what happend to the dinosaurs in Jurassic Park... some of the females became males, which made it possible for them to breed beyond control (which aided in the downfall of Jurassic Park.)
Now before anyone says anything... yes I know the Jurassic Park was only a movie. However, the only thing stopping dinosaurs from being cloned in this day & age, is the fact that there's no dino-DNA to work with. Anyhoo, I'll just end here before this gets too off-topic... Sorry about the really long post.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Although Jurassic Park represents "pop-corn science", there's some truth in what is presented. The "gender switch" occurs depending on the temperatures the eggs are kept at: a difference a few degrees and you get a female or a male (I can't remember which way it goes though).
However, this only happens in reptiles. Mammals have their gender determination done as soon as a sperm cell and an ovum meet and put in common their respective sexual chromosomes: XX will be female and XY will be male.
The subsequent development of the foetus will determine the phenotype of the individual, though. Extremely rarely, an XY will develop female sexual organs or an XX male ones. This can mean trouble for the individual, say a human, when it reaches puberty...
I won't develop more of this here, as I am writing these things off the top of my head, based on old biology courses that my brain has almost forgotten (and it's early morning right now, so I'm not quite awake yet, and not fully functional in the brain department [!--emo&^_^--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/happy.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'happy.gif\' /][!--endemo--] )
However, this only happens in reptiles. Mammals have their gender determination done as soon as a sperm cell and an ovum meet and put in common their respective sexual chromosomes: XX will be female and XY will be male.
The subsequent development of the foetus will determine the phenotype of the individual, though. Extremely rarely, an XY will develop female sexual organs or an XX male ones. This can mean trouble for the individual, say a human, when it reaches puberty...
I won't develop more of this here, as I am writing these things off the top of my head, based on old biology courses that my brain has almost forgotten (and it's early morning right now, so I'm not quite awake yet, and not fully functional in the brain department [!--emo&^_^--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/happy.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'happy.gif\' /][!--endemo--] )
A
Anonymous
Guest
[!--QuoteBegin-Black Ace+Jul 19 2004, 06:24 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Black Ace @ Jul 19 2004, 06:24 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--] I'm talking about dex change operations [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [/quote]
[!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/lol[1].gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'lol[1].gif\' /][!--endemo--] What's that? [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/wink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'wink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [/quote][!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/lol[1].gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'lol[1].gif\' /][!--endemo--] What's that? [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/wink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'wink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
A
Anonymous
Guest
[!--QuoteBegin-Black Ace+Jul 18 2004, 12:54 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Black Ace @ Jul 18 2004, 12:54 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]And if the earth would stop spinning around it's ax, it would be an disaster. The part of the earth which was opposite to the sun at the moment of the halt, would be forever doomed to an eternity of darkness and night,while the part that was facing the sun,would have an everlasting daylight... [!--emo&:unsure:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/unsure.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'unsure.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
[/quote]
Hmm...
Try this experiment:
Pick an object to be your "sun" (possibly a lamp). You be Earth. Walk in circles around that object, without spinning around your axis at all (that is, always facing North, for example... presuming you don't live near a pole). Do you have a "light side" and a "dark side," or do different sides of your body face the "sun" at different points?
To get the effect you describe, you'd need the Earth spinning around its axis at such a rate that one point of Earth always faces Sol. Earth's moon actually does this relative to Earth (as do most moons relative to their planets), due to tidal forces, I think.
As far as the remarks on evolution, that's not how it works. A species can't just "grow" a gene that would be useful... it has to already have it, and it has to end up being useful enough that individuals possessing that gene are more likely to survive to reproduce, or at least not harmful enough that individuals possessing it are more likely to die or otherwise not reproduce.
Evolution and natural selection are often-misunderstood concepts; most people just read the definition in the glossary of their Biology book so they'll know be able to write something that looks correct on a test, then forget everything about it except what they see in movies. It's actually a very simple concept, though -- so simple one might even call it obvious:
If something is good enough at making more of itself, there will be more of it.
Think about it... if you want.
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [/quote]
Hmm...
Try this experiment:
Pick an object to be your "sun" (possibly a lamp). You be Earth. Walk in circles around that object, without spinning around your axis at all (that is, always facing North, for example... presuming you don't live near a pole). Do you have a "light side" and a "dark side," or do different sides of your body face the "sun" at different points?
To get the effect you describe, you'd need the Earth spinning around its axis at such a rate that one point of Earth always faces Sol. Earth's moon actually does this relative to Earth (as do most moons relative to their planets), due to tidal forces, I think.
As far as the remarks on evolution, that's not how it works. A species can't just "grow" a gene that would be useful... it has to already have it, and it has to end up being useful enough that individuals possessing that gene are more likely to survive to reproduce, or at least not harmful enough that individuals possessing it are more likely to die or otherwise not reproduce.
Evolution and natural selection are often-misunderstood concepts; most people just read the definition in the glossary of their Biology book so they'll know be able to write something that looks correct on a test, then forget everything about it except what they see in movies. It's actually a very simple concept, though -- so simple one might even call it obvious:
If something is good enough at making more of itself, there will be more of it.
Think about it... if you want.
A
Anonymous
Guest
A real interesting topic after a long time! First of all, I feel sorry for the dude who even started to belive in the rumor that the sun might rise from the west. Really, pal, where do you live?
Did anyone stop to think what it would take to stop the earth from turning? The law of conservation of angular momentum suggests that something of atleast equal and opposite spin must come in contact with our dear planet. No need to worry if the pentagon would be uprooted, the impact will be strong enough to set everything on flames. And by flames I mean millions of degrees of temperature; of the likes of nuclear fission and fusion. There WOULD be no earth to spin anymore, let alone the talks of day-night and people sliding away. As Nephellim said, the only way we can witness such an event is by smelling green weed.
As for the sex-transformation, well I hate biology. What I can tell is that most of what Mav said is pretty accurate. What can happen at best is an individual may show signs of the opposite sex due to some hormonal imbalance. But biologically, they are still the same sex. Some people get their sex changed manually through some medical procedure, which I'm still not very sure about.
Come on people, a little touch with awarenes never hurts.
Did anyone stop to think what it would take to stop the earth from turning? The law of conservation of angular momentum suggests that something of atleast equal and opposite spin must come in contact with our dear planet. No need to worry if the pentagon would be uprooted, the impact will be strong enough to set everything on flames. And by flames I mean millions of degrees of temperature; of the likes of nuclear fission and fusion. There WOULD be no earth to spin anymore, let alone the talks of day-night and people sliding away. As Nephellim said, the only way we can witness such an event is by smelling green weed.
As for the sex-transformation, well I hate biology. What I can tell is that most of what Mav said is pretty accurate. What can happen at best is an individual may show signs of the opposite sex due to some hormonal imbalance. But biologically, they are still the same sex. Some people get their sex changed manually through some medical procedure, which I'm still not very sure about.
Come on people, a little touch with awarenes never hurts.
[!--QuoteBegin-chipperMDW+Jul 20 2004, 01:09 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(chipperMDW @ Jul 20 2004, 01:09 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--] As far as the remarks on evolution, that's not how it works. A species can't just "grow" a gene that would be useful... it has to already have it... [/quote]
That is not entirely correct - or at least, it was stated somewhat unclearly in my opinion. Allow me to clarify...
Your statement is correct in the sense that an organism can't create a complete new gene from scratch; it can only modify an existing gene. However, new genes can and do arise from random DNA mutation during DNA replication in the parent. It is extremely rare because DNA replication contains a "proofreading" process which eliminates most mutations. However, given enough time and enough DNA replications, new genes created through mutation are inevitable. In fact, such mutated genes are a major source of evolutionary changes.
You also said:
"If something is good enough at making more of itself, there will be more of it."
This is true, but evolution requires that the offspring be viable and fertile and eventually produce offspring of their own. Evolution is a process that requires multiple generations; one set of offspring doesn't mean anything by itself.
Don't get me wrong - I'm not trying to be the kind of jerk who nitpicks every little point just to look smart. It's just that (as you correctly pointed out) many people don't understand evolution very well. For that reason, I'm just trying to make sure that the information posted here is crystal clear and accurate. Besides, if I or anyone else is wrong about this stuff, Maverick will be jumping down our throats any second now. [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/biggrin.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'biggrin.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
That is not entirely correct - or at least, it was stated somewhat unclearly in my opinion. Allow me to clarify...
Your statement is correct in the sense that an organism can't create a complete new gene from scratch; it can only modify an existing gene. However, new genes can and do arise from random DNA mutation during DNA replication in the parent. It is extremely rare because DNA replication contains a "proofreading" process which eliminates most mutations. However, given enough time and enough DNA replications, new genes created through mutation are inevitable. In fact, such mutated genes are a major source of evolutionary changes.
You also said:
"If something is good enough at making more of itself, there will be more of it."
This is true, but evolution requires that the offspring be viable and fertile and eventually produce offspring of their own. Evolution is a process that requires multiple generations; one set of offspring doesn't mean anything by itself.
Don't get me wrong - I'm not trying to be the kind of jerk who nitpicks every little point just to look smart. It's just that (as you correctly pointed out) many people don't understand evolution very well. For that reason, I'm just trying to make sure that the information posted here is crystal clear and accurate. Besides, if I or anyone else is wrong about this stuff, Maverick will be jumping down our throats any second now. [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/biggrin.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'biggrin.gif\' /][!--endemo--]Wrathchild666
Trooper
[!--QuoteBegin-abhi+Jul 20 2004, 06:20 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(abhi @ Jul 20 2004, 06:20 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--] A real interesting topic after a long time! First of all, I feel sorry for the dude who even started to belive in the rumor that the sun might rise from the west. Really, pal, where do you live?
[/quote]
Singapore, why? [!--emo&^_^--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/happy.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'happy.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
[/quote]
Singapore, why? [!--emo&^_^--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/happy.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'happy.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
A
Anonymous
Guest
[!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Your statement is correct in the sense that an organism can't create a complete new gene from scratch; it can only modify an existing gene. However, new genes can and do arise from random DNA mutation during DNA replication in the parent.[/quote]
Yup. I meant that a species can't intentionally create a gene. Rather, the genes for sex change would accidentally occur (though mutations), and then, after they exist, those genes could increase or decrease some individuals' chance to survive and reproduce.
[!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]This is true, but evolution requires that the offspring be viable and fertile and eventually produce offspring of their own.[/quote]
Exactly. In other words, if something is good enough at making more of itself, there will be more of it. Then, if those somethings are good enough at making more of themselves, there will be more of them. Then if those somethings are good enough at making more of themselves... (repeat infinitely).
So in my original statement, when I said "something," I really meant all "somethings," not just the first "something." Sorry, I'm a computer scientist; we make recursive definitions sometimes. [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'tongue.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
But now, see how that simple, seemingly obvious statement neatly expresses what you just said about viable and fertile offspring? (You are, of course, absolutely correct).
Now, that statement is incomplete... it doesn't (directly) explain why when something is good at keeping its kids alive, there is more of it. It also doesn't explain why there would be more of something that keeps its siblings or cousins or even very distant relatives alive.
So... a more complete (but less neat) statement might be:
If something is good enough at influencing the creation of things of a certain likeness to itself, then there will be more things with that likeness to it.
[!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]I'm just trying to make sure that the information posted here is crystal clear and accurate.[/quote]
No problem. Thanks for clarifying my muddy waters.
Yup. I meant that a species can't intentionally create a gene. Rather, the genes for sex change would accidentally occur (though mutations), and then, after they exist, those genes could increase or decrease some individuals' chance to survive and reproduce.
[!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]This is true, but evolution requires that the offspring be viable and fertile and eventually produce offspring of their own.[/quote]
Exactly. In other words, if something is good enough at making more of itself, there will be more of it. Then, if those somethings are good enough at making more of themselves, there will be more of them. Then if those somethings are good enough at making more of themselves... (repeat infinitely).
So in my original statement, when I said "something," I really meant all "somethings," not just the first "something." Sorry, I'm a computer scientist; we make recursive definitions sometimes. [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'tongue.gif\' /][!--endemo--]But now, see how that simple, seemingly obvious statement neatly expresses what you just said about viable and fertile offspring? (You are, of course, absolutely correct).
Now, that statement is incomplete... it doesn't (directly) explain why when something is good at keeping its kids alive, there is more of it. It also doesn't explain why there would be more of something that keeps its siblings or cousins or even very distant relatives alive.
So... a more complete (but less neat) statement might be:
If something is good enough at influencing the creation of things of a certain likeness to itself, then there will be more things with that likeness to it.
[!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]I'm just trying to make sure that the information posted here is crystal clear and accurate.[/quote]
No problem. Thanks for clarifying my muddy waters.
A
Anonymous
Guest
[!--QuoteBegin-chipperMDW+Jul 21 2004, 08:25 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(chipperMDW @ Jul 21 2004, 08:25 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--] Yup. I meant that a species can't intentionally create a gene. Rather, the genes for sex change would accidentally occur (though mutations), and then, after they exist, those genes could increase or decrease some individuals' chance to survive and reproduce. [/quote]
[!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
Sex is determined -- at least in mammals -- by chromosomes, namely X and Y, conveniently called "sexual chromosomes" as opposed to the autosomes (but that's another story), and not by a set of genes.
Mutate any gene or set of genes on either X or Y (or both) and you won't get any influence sexual determination (you can get many other things, like haemophilia, for instance, but no sex change). Even homosexuals have the chromosomes of their own sex and it was proved that sexual preference is not linked to any genetic determinant.
What the f*ck am I doing in this conversation? [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'tongue.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
[!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--] Sex is determined -- at least in mammals -- by chromosomes, namely X and Y, conveniently called "sexual chromosomes" as opposed to the autosomes (but that's another story), and not by a set of genes.
Mutate any gene or set of genes on either X or Y (or both) and you won't get any influence sexual determination (you can get many other things, like haemophilia, for instance, but no sex change). Even homosexuals have the chromosomes of their own sex and it was proved that sexual preference is not linked to any genetic determinant.
What the f*ck am I doing in this conversation? [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'tongue.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
A
Anonymous
Guest
[!--QuoteBegin-Wrathchild666+Jul 21 2004, 06:40 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Wrathchild666 @ Jul 21 2004, 06:40 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--] Singapore, why? [!--emo&^_^--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/happy.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'happy.gif\' /][!--endemo--] [/quote]
you tell me why! [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'tongue.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
Mav is dead-on about the determination of sex in mamals. Hello, mutation (or evolution) ain't never gonna lead to a sex change, nor will it lead to an increased population of one sex as compared to the other. Male and female are equally vital forms of life for it's preservation. If u'r gonna talk about evolution, look for some other cause, such as developing a giant head, or losing the last finger.
Anyway, most scientists think that the process of evolution has come to a stand-still due to various factors affecting our enviornmental conditions, including human activities. So, we can safely assume that what we have as our body is all what we'll ever get. So, let's not waste any bit of it and let's be a bit more enlightened than "uh, sum1 told me sun gonna rise from west, that right?" (sorry dude, i couldn't resist! [!--emo&--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/wink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'wink.gif\' /][!--endemo--] )
you tell me why! [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'tongue.gif\' /][!--endemo--] Mav is dead-on about the determination of sex in mamals. Hello, mutation (or evolution) ain't never gonna lead to a sex change, nor will it lead to an increased population of one sex as compared to the other. Male and female are equally vital forms of life for it's preservation. If u'r gonna talk about evolution, look for some other cause, such as developing a giant head, or losing the last finger.
Anyway, most scientists think that the process of evolution has come to a stand-still due to various factors affecting our enviornmental conditions, including human activities. So, we can safely assume that what we have as our body is all what we'll ever get. So, let's not waste any bit of it and let's be a bit more enlightened than "uh, sum1 told me sun gonna rise from west, that right?" (sorry dude, i couldn't resist! [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/wink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'wink.gif\' /][!--endemo--] )
A
Anonymous
Guest
[!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Sex is determined -- at least in mammals -- by chromosomes, namely X and Y, conveniently called "sexual chromosomes" as opposed to the autosomes (but that's another story), and not by a set of genes.[/quote]
That statement is certainly true and I have no argument with it.
I don't think you catch my drift, though, since my point had nothing to do with sex determination, but with evolution.
I was speaking hypothetically about no particular category of organism.
<point>
If a species were to develop a set of genes that determine <CHARACTERISTIC>, then it would be because such genes would arise though mutation, then be selected for by the reproductive success of individuals with those genes... not because the species would "decide" that having the gene would be a good idea.
</point>
In my statement, I happened to replace <CHARACTERISTIC> with "ability to morph into a member of the opposite gender" to stay in tune with previous comments. I could easily have replaced it with "eye color" or "ability to produce venom" and made the same point.
Now, perhaps having a set of genes coding for the ability to switch gender is a ridiculous concept in humans, but it could certainly apply to <ORGANISM>, whether or not <ORGANISM> actually exists. If you don't agree with that, then just pretend I said "eye color."
That statement is certainly true and I have no argument with it.
I don't think you catch my drift, though, since my point had nothing to do with sex determination, but with evolution.
I was speaking hypothetically about no particular category of organism.
<point>
If a species were to develop a set of genes that determine <CHARACTERISTIC>, then it would be because such genes would arise though mutation, then be selected for by the reproductive success of individuals with those genes... not because the species would "decide" that having the gene would be a good idea.
</point>
In my statement, I happened to replace <CHARACTERISTIC> with "ability to morph into a member of the opposite gender" to stay in tune with previous comments. I could easily have replaced it with "eye color" or "ability to produce venom" and made the same point.
Now, perhaps having a set of genes coding for the ability to switch gender is a ridiculous concept in humans, but it could certainly apply to <ORGANISM>, whether or not <ORGANISM> actually exists. If you don't agree with that, then just pretend I said "eye color."