Savatage Week on Maidenfans (Sep 14-20, 2009)

Who shall we discuss next week?

  • Children Of Bodom (Perun)

    Votes: 1 10.0%

  • Alice Cooper (LC)

    Votes: 1 10.0%

  • Saxon (Yax)

    Votes: 1 10.0%

  • Apocalyptica (Onhell)

    Votes: 1 10.0%

  • Deep Purple (SMX)

    Votes: 6 60.0%
  • Total voters
    10
SinisterMinisterX

SinisterMinisterX

Illuminatus
Staff member
Time for Savatage Week - including TSO and/or any other Savatage-related bands you care to discuss.

Don't forget to vote for next week's band.

I haven't listened to a Savatage album in about 3 years, I think. I'm gonna put on the discog now.
 
Sweetness!!!

I like winning things. Regardless of it it would have been discussed at a later date anyway.

So let's see...

I have a couple of favorites in terms of albums and songs and things. Hands down win is Wake of Magellan, which has to be one of the greatest things ever written (an album as a whole). Favorite songs off that album include the title track, The Hourglass, and Stay (and yes I know its the acoustic version, I still like it). Other albums worth mentioning are Handful of Rain, Gutter Ballet and Hall of the Mountain King. Not such a fan of their earlier stuff (Fight for the Rock, Power of the Night are weak in my opinion, mostly fillers or unoriginal rock songs).

I also particularily like Ghost in the Ruins, a live album, the version on there of most songs are better than the original studio versions. In fact, I owe my love of Savatage to that album. Without it, I doubt I would have got into them especially if I had heard Power of the Night first or something.

I'm not sure what it is about Savatage, but on some of their songs the use of complex harmonic movements with piano and other classical instruments, great riffs, and a nice overall concept (as in lyrics fitting with the music) while keeping it heavy somehow, just works. Perfectly. I'm thinking in this case of songs such as The Wake of Magellan, Gutter Ballet, When the Crowds Are Gone, Hall of the Mountain King, Follow Me, One Child, Alone You Breathe, and Believe. Speaking of Believe, that is one of my top favorites, ever. Although I haveto be in the mood for it, it's a rather dark depressing song in that really melancholy way. So beautiful though.

And now we come to the bad part. I was not impressed with Poets and Madmen (their last release in 2001). The only reasonable song on there is Stay With Me Awhile. TSO is an interesting experiment and I quite like the stuff they produce (of what I've heard, I do not have Beethoven's Last Night or whatever its called). Still, holiday songs can only go so far.
And then somebody suggested I look into Jon Oliva's Pain because it was "Savatage reincarnated" (that's in Oliva's own words). Well if it is, then I pity it, a real downgrade. It sounds about as flaccid as Oliva is obese. Perhaps Global Warning is a flop and I should listen to Taj Mahal, but my ears are not going to be easily persuaded. No question the greatest musical disappointment I've had so far.

But overall: Savatage rules!

I only wish it would have stayed in its original form...
 
I heard Oliva say that he was initially upset that TSO was doing so well when it was still SAVATAGE with a different name, he concluded that what was keeping him from massive success all these years was the band's name. Um... how can someone be THAT dumb? Seriously, TSO was more than just a name change, who the hell doesn't like a rocked out Christmas? THAT is what did it. Because I wasn't too happy with the Beethoven concept album, I'm still not a big fan of it, but I love their Christmas albums. 

I for one like Edge of Thorns, but you're right Nat, Wake of Magellan is by far their best.
 
So what do I know of Savatage? Well, it almost starts and stops with Gutter Ballet. That's it.

But I do quite like this album, not necessarily completely to my taste, but some brilliant moments.
 
Albie, do you often like to hear one album per artist? If I recall well it went exactly like this with Opeth and probably more artists(?)

Another album can always be better (or different) than the first you have heard.  :)
 
SA-VA-TA-GE WEEK  :yey: :yey: :yey:

:) Gutter Ballet is the ultimate masterpiece of the metal band (them and Warlord) that I respect the most -including Maiden
All the metal fans we've been wowed then, even if the hard die fans they were insisted that Hall of Mountain King, or Sirens
were more powerful albums ...Well 20 years later, the majority of the critics and the fans all agree that Ballet is their most
precious album

Gutterballlet.jpg


  1. "Of Rage and War" – 4:47 ****
Excellent power metal, unbelievable opener of an incredible album
  2. "Gutter Ballet" – 6:20    *****
Classical elements of Jon Oliva's piano, and a wonderful song
  3. "Temptation Revelation" (Instrumental) – 2:56 ****
A nice instrumental passage by the brothers Oliva (guitar -piano)
  4. "When the Crowds Are Gone" – 5:45 *****
Incredible ballad, one of metal genre finest in fact.
Powerful lyrics, great guitar passages, what a melody, what a refrain
Savatage made a few reprises of it with the same or not title the later years
  5. "Silk and Steel" (Instrumental) – 2:56 ***1/2
Technically the song seems ok, Chris Oliva shows us his skills on the acoustic guitar and the melody brings mermaids on mind
  6. "She's in Love" – 3:51 ***1/2
Very powerful, even popular, I don't like that much though
  7. "Hounds" – 6:27 *****
Masterpiece. Those lyrics, Jon's theatrical performance, and again a very touch-full melody. Chris Oliva makes his guitar cry here
  8. "The Unholy" – 4:37 ****1/2
Galloping Power metal. Genious as well
  9. "Mentally Yours" – 5:19 ***1/2
The weakest moment IMO, yet an ok song
  10. "Summer's Rain" – 4:33 ****1/2
Another all time favourite ballad.
  11. "Thorazine Shuffle" – 4:43 *****
Very theatrical song, a big moment -but a sad moment as well: the album, this listener's paradise closes here

Tomorrow I'll talk about Power of The Night, a relatively unknown early album of them -and underrated as well
 
 
Forostar said:
Albie, do you often like to hear one album per artist? If I recall well it went exactly like this with Opeth and probably more artists(?)
Click to expand...
I guess what it's down to is that I will try any artist, but will only go further if it really appeals to me. If the music is that good, I'll get more of their stuff. I have a shed load of Tapes/CDs by several artists - all just the one album.
 
Thanks for explaining. Interesting.

In theory you could have tried "the wrong album" numerous of times. All those "single" albums you have heard could have been worse -in your opinion- than another one you have not heard. Bands can change, albums vary in quality, taste changes, etc. etc.

Of course I also stop checking other albums if I really wouldn't like the first thing I've heard. But if it's not that bad (not really supergood either) I am always curious how the rest would sound.

Ah well, people differ, so do their methodes (and curiosities).  :)
 
That's why I refuse to listen to Lamb of God. The one and only album I bought and later returned, sucked. Royaly.
 
Interesting rating there Quetzalcoatlus.

I went back to check mine and the one's with 5 stars are When The Crowds Are Gone, Gutter Ballet, and Summer's Rain. Everything else is at 4 stars. Which does strike me as a tad peculiar, should probably go back and listen to that album. However, the 5 star ratings are definitely accurate. As for Power of the Night, I suppose it is alright, but honestly I don't think its that underrated, especially as compared to some of their other early stuff (like Fight for the Rock). Quite a few of the songs on there have promise but none of them feel as if they've reached their full maturity (I'm thinking of Warriors, In the Dream). Or maybe I just rate stuff differently to the rest of people, I mean, I do like The X Factor and most Maiden fans don't I think (not on this forum obviously).
 
Forostar said:
In theory you could have tried "the wrong album" numerous of times.
Click to expand...
I may well of done. But every so often I stumble across a real gem and I venture further - like Staring at the Divine by Alabama Thunderpussy.
 
I had the same reaction when I first heard that name. Haven't actually heard their stuff despite the fact that I've heard nothing but great things about them.
 
They were active in the years 1996–2008. I never checked them out myself but have often seen their name in metal mags. What I read about them never invited me much to be honest. The band name isn't that convincing either.
 
What do you expect for Southern Rock?


At any rate. I've listened to all my Savatage albums. Power of the Night, Gutter Ballet, Edge of Thorns and Wake of Magellan. All of them very awesome not only given the time period, but have withstood the test of time. I hadn't heard Power of the Night since I purchased it like two years ago and I was blown away at how solid it was.

I listen to the TSO albums even in July, so I know those fairly well. Safe to say their second to last release (that's if they FINALLY put out Snow Castles) The Lost Christmas Eve is their most solid effort. The Christmas Attic does have weak tracks and what really holds Christmas Eve and other Stories together it's its great story. LOVE that album, I've even gotten choked up at times.
 
I always thought that the track "Gutter Ballet" was like a writing collaboration between 'Arry and Jim Steinman. I find it has elements of that epic rock sound so associated with Steinman and the riff as it comes out of the chorus could be on any Maiden track.
 
I started the week by checking out the first half or so of their discog - all the way through Streets. Then I decided to skip to the end and listened to Magellan. And even though it's obvious they took a creative leap once Paul O'Neill joined, I heard some seeds in those early albums which still had echoes on Magellan.

I don't think Savatage's name was the entire cause of their demise - it was Hall Of The Mountain King. That was their first big hit, their first video on MTV, and it's cheesy (the video even more so). I know it took me forever to give them a second chance. So maybe the name isn't at fault (even if Savatage is a 84% silly band name), but changing their name sure didn't hurt.
 
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