Opeth

By Request, Part 1 - Orchid:

  • Total voters
    10
I mean, yeah, it's not about metal and to me not even about the dynamics, or at least not primarily. A Fair Judgement is all clean vocals and it isn't even particularly hard (or maybe it feels that way, because it's on Deliverance, but still). If Mikael took that one as a blueprint, I think 70 % of Newpeth bashers would be more or less happy.


Still, I don't get the fandom's obsession with Pale Communion (Eternal Rains sounds like an epic introduction that suddenly stops, Eternity is one of the most easily overplayable songs by them ever - and I really hate Mikael's vocals there - Goblin is a throwaway, River sounds way too un-Opethian, etc), but in general, I like Newpeth. BUT I miss what made them special.


There's only ONE song I can't stand - Will O the Wisp. As a song it's okay, nice even, but the way Mikael is aping Ian Anderson (including the vocal inflections - the nasal "You're stuck to the failures of-your-li-hi-hife") makes it sound almost like a parody to me, I can't help but find it strangely grating.
I got a lot of downvotes on Reddit for this opinion, but come on, mates.
 
JudasMyGuide said:
Still, I don't get the fandom's obsession with Pale Communion (Eternal Rains sounds like an epic introduction that suddenly stops, Eternity is one of the most easily overplayable songs by them ever - and I really hate Mikael's vocals there - Goblin is a throwaway, River sounds way too un-Opethian, etc), but in general, I like Newpeth. BUT I miss what made them special.
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Well you singled out three of my favorite songs. :D Goblin might be just an instrumental, but it has a great groove (also a big fan of the band of the same name that the song is inspired by, they nailed the vibe). I think River is actually one of the most Opeth-y songs on the album. The riffing toward the end is some of their heaviest post-Watershed work. The folk-y stuff is a little out there but at least they're trying new things, which I associate with pre-Heritage Opeth more than the last four albums. Songs like that show a larger palette than whaat Opeth typically is working with on recent albums. In general that's why I rate Pale Communion significantly higher than the other Newpeth albums. It felt like the abandonment of death metal wasn't a limit to their sound because each song had such a unique flavor both in context of the album and compared to other Opeth material. Sorceress and ICV both feel very bland by comparison with fewer attempts at trying new sounds.
 
Saw some leaks coming through about the new album on the Opeth subreddit:
"The Last Will & Testament"
  1. §1 - 06:11
  2. §2 - 05:40
  3. §3 - 05:11
  4. §4 - 07:05
  5. §5 - 07:35
  6. §6 - 06:16
  7. §7 - 06:28
  8. A Story Never Told - 07:10
Total Length: 51:36
Pre-order is up so it's all but official, until October 11th. First single is expected tomorrow!
 
(!!)

Well, I thought that was a placeholder name. I wonder if there's a concept here then. Hard to understand from the lyrics because, believe it or not, it's not Jer-safe! First listen sounded good, heavy and chaotic but still has that newpeth sound.
 
Shmoolikipod said:
it's not Jer-safe
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NSFJ

I love the new track. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that if this song is any indication, Opeth has finally made the album that I have been desperately wanting them to make. I thought the growl-free Opeth was fine on Heritage and Pale Communion because it felt like they were trying new stuff. On (especially) Sorceress and ICV, it felt more like the band was unnaturally restricting their metal side for arbitrary reasons. There were so many moments on both albums that felt like they would benefit from more of the classic Opeth dynamics and some growls. I mean, the title track to Sorceress was just screaming for more metal. Without the metal element, I feel like Opeth was just turning into a bland throwback prog rock band without anything interesting to bring to the table. Now they are keeping that proggy sound but bringing in the growls again and creating something unique. It's not quite death metal, but it's not quite prog rock either. It's pretty weird but at the same time it feels like Opeth is actually trying new things again. With how generic and derivative their recent material has been, it's easy to forget that at one time Opeth was pushing boundaries with their music. Honestly it's the most fresh Opeth has sounded since Ghost Reveries. Really looking forward to the rest of the album now. Welcome back Opeth!
 
Huh

JudasMyGuide said:
But yeah, the rhythm section. I realised in another life, I should have been a drummer, because really it's often the drummer who makes or breaks the band for me.
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This WAS kind of a momentary hyperbole, but it also is kinda true. I mean, I'll be the first to extol the virtues of Watershed as the last Opeth album I genuinely loved, but I realise there's a lot to the fact Opeth just don't excite me before and after Lopez.


As for the new song, I kinda like it, but with the harsh vocals it's certainly like Mikael's concentrating on the less important facet of the metal sound. Yep, it's chaotic, dark and sounds like most fun they've had in studio since

MrKnickerbocker said:
Lotus Eater.
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yeah, the aforementioned Watershed, but it still sounds a tad stiff. In fact, I dislike a lot about it - some of the wailing vocals took right from ICV, the incoherent mixture of Lotus Eater... and in general it just sounds like a better version of Charlatan (in fact it sounds very similar to my ears on this first listen).

I don't hate it, mind you, but I'll give it a few more listens and we'll see how my opinion develops.
 
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After a few listens the song hit me, and now I quite like it. The mix isn’t great (the bass is once again overpowering, which is an odd statement coming from a bassist), but those growls hit like a semi and the chorus is catchy as hell.

@JudasMyGuide

I don’t love some of the clean vocal parts, either, as they sound too atonal and shifting. I don’t hear many similarities to Charlatan, though. If anything I get more of a Pale Communion feel, which I consider to be their best effort since Watershed.

Regarding Charlatan, did you know that in addition to Mendez, Mikael and Fredrik also played bass? Three basses and no regular guitar on the song at all. Definitely didn’t pick up on that my first few listens.

“It’s kind of interesting too that there’s no guitars! We’ve never done that before, but Mikael was afraid it would sound too nu-metal, and he wanted to avoid that territory, so when Martin Mendez played the original bass, Mikael and I both played bass too, left and right, with loads of distortion. We used the upper register of a tenor bass to get the higher pitches at the start. It’s not de-tuned at all, but we just cranked the fuzz pedals through the Olsson amps and played bass!”

- Fredrik Åkesson
 
Detective Beauregard said:
After a few listens the song hit me, and now I quite like it. The mix isn’t great (the bass is once again overpowering, which is an odd statement coming from a bassist), but those growls hit like a semi and the chorus is catchy as hell.
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Good to know, as usual, I like to like things rather than dislike, so I hope my appreciation will grow likewise.

Detective Beauregard said:
I don’t hear many similarities to Charlatan, though.
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I was a bit drubl yesterday evening while listening to it and my thoughts went there immediately, without checking. I'll contrast the songs against each other ASAP, I was merely going with the gut feeling (dunno if it was the melody, the atmosphere or just the intros?) Like I said, I'll check.

Detective Beauregard said:
Regarding Charlatan, did you know that in addition to Mendez, Mikael and Fredrik also played bass? Three basses and no regular guitar on the song at all. Definitely didn’t pick up on that my first few listens.
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I didn't pick it up by ear, but I have definitely read that quote you put there somewhere.
 
Also, mates, I can't live without Opeth, so I'm updating that document collecting all the talk and opinions and whatnot on Opeth that I posted back in 2019 (9/11 2019, to be precise, the last post on page 42 in this very thread) with stuff that's been posted in the meantime (and sure, there's a lot).

I would promise a deadline, but considering how fragmented it is (with all the talk in the Greatest Metal Song Cup etc.), it's really a bitch, so I can't make any promises. Also, the fact the forum's been fucked up pretty badly recently - I believe you've noticed - made me have some undue delay even in the Nightwish discography thread, so we'll see about that.

@Mosh will be glad that today I finally - ten years after the fact - got around regarding River, I've been spinning the song repeatedly today, after I played PC in car on our way home from the trip with the family (we were spinning Hendrix' Are You Experienced? - which is just an awesome album, btw, I just love both how almost every song is catchy somehow and also Mitch Mitchell's drumming). I still like the latter part more than the former - and it overall (especially the soloing parts) sounds as if The Allman Brothers Band have decided among all their quasi-prog inclinations to make a simultaneous Eagles and Dream Theater tribute - which from me, definitely a resident Allman (and DT) fanatic should be a compliment, but I'm not sure it is, or at least, I'm not sure if it's what I want from Opeth - but it's been playing in my head all day long and like I said, I've made peace with that track.


EDIT (23rd August): Believe or not, the most torturous is the walk through the Best Band thread, picking the sole Opeth mentions there. Now, that was... something, 150 pages of various shitposting, butthurt feelingz, bile, some absolutely insane results (Bill Ward eliminating Bill Bruford etc.) and some outright bizarre statements, like after tens and maybe hundreds of posts of the deep, profound, insightful musical analysis he always does you get

Mosh said:
I will always vote against everything The Doors
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in the round with Ray Manzarek.

Anyway, I did it for you. I have the entire Best Song ever yet to go through.
And shit, I think I forgot the greatest metal album cup. I wonder if I'll make it through before the end of the year, heh.
 
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I'm not sure how the rules against double-posting go nowadays, but I can't keep editing that last post forever.

So, the Opeth on Maidenfans, Maidenfans on Opeth project is coming along well - although I'm only nearing the end of 2020 and the word document is already 224 [EDIT: 257 in December, after formatting] pages long, lol. I had to actually create headers and sub-headers and an automatic table of contents so that I would not get completely lost. It's also kinda fucked up because I want to keep the sections - general band talk, commented discography etc. set apart AND within that at least some semblance of chronological order ... and really, fuck me, because all the Opeth talk is sprinkled everywhere on the forum, in this thread, in the Survivors thread, the Greatest Metal Album cup, the Greatest Metal Song cup, various places like the Stage banter thread, Your Top Influential albums and whatnot. It's insane, I'm definitely not doing this for another band, however I might love it.

Thankfully, I'm not starting anew and I have some kind of structure and stuff collected up to 2019.



Anyway, I'm gonna put here what I wrote on Reddit recently, to someone who was really thrilled the growls are back:

Two points - while I understand your preference for growls or their significance for you, I wouldn't say that's the primary change from Heritage onwards. I mean, yes, Mikael hasn't been growling, but what I miss the most is the atmosphere and style - I mean, the growls don't even feel all that prominent on, say, Moonlapse Vertigo and they're completely gone in A Fair Judgement - and yet both songs are classic Opeth (and Moonlapse might be my no. 1 Opeth song, actually). Face of Melinda - another Oldpeth classic and fan favourite, even "soft" for most of its runtime, and yet it doesn't sound like Newpeth.

With this new single and the return of the growls, I feel like both Mikael and some parts of the fandom concentrate more on the aspect that is somewhat less important - because stylistically, this is still Newpeth.

Second:

but the the growls sound actually decent. I'm sure there's some studio magic going on there, but he doesn't sound like he's in pain when he does them on the song.
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I would say there's definitely some studio magic present. When I saw them two years ago, the growls were okay, at least million times better than on the bonus tracks of Sorceress, for example, but also not as good as before. Passable, but the years and the smoking and everything has took its toil, I don't think he'll ever again be a truly consistent growler. Which leads me again to my first point - I'd love it if he saved the growls for the songs where it really fits (something truly Oldpeth in style).



Also, we've been playing Ghost Reveries with wifey yesterday in the car and... yeah, it was our first love (the first Opeth album I bought, we were spinning it continuously back then, all the time, several times in a row, in fact) and it just thrills me all the same even nowadays. And BTW - I still don't get NP's hate for Ghost of Perdition - since he's the resident Lopez lover and that song is possibly either his best or second best performance on the album (bar possibly Harlequin Forest).

(oh, and my obligatory "Hounds are fucking underrated" comment. Not just the Purply/Heepy gallop with the organ, not just the amazing subdued section with that jazzy riff... but also the second half, with the atmospherics and crashes of the cymbals being used for pure atmosphere and ambience, with the switch back to the brutal for the ending... man, I just love, love, love the track)
 
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JudasMyGuide said:
And BTW - I still don't get NP's hate for Ghost of Perdition - since he's the resident Lopez lover and that song is possibly either his best or second best performance on the album (bar possibly Harlequin Forest).
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I grew out of that after seeing the song live. I like it now, but still think they have many songs that are way better.
 
I have only heard it once, so I'm not making any conclusions, apart from that the chaotic intro is really fun (with the keys having this Zappaesque sound to them to boot). I will listen to it again once I get home from work.


But this... this is probably the best I can do, sorry

2Wolves.png


92m2ns.jpg
 
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