OPETH DISCOGRAPHY RANKING GAME - Still Life wins!

[Mosh]

I think it's the only record in the discography where I feel like Mikael was forcing the songwriting and half the time just stopped caring. Even Heritage (though I dislike it) feels more genuine, sort of like the St. Anger debacle.

Yea, that about sums it up for me as well. It also feels like there's a loose concept in there, but kinda gets lost Iron Maiden style. It's a pretty stark contrast from the sheer focus you get on Heritage, for better or worse. The bad production is the biggest head scratcher of this album though, considering Opeth were once the gold standard for modern production. This was true even on Heritage.

This was the second album with Fredrik on lead guitar, and he is an absolute beast of a player. Shame he joined at their weakest moment, though.

Not sure if this is a controversial take, but going from Peter to Frederik was similar to going from Adrian to Janick with me. I think they're both great guitar players but they lost something when Peter left the band. Frederick butchers the old solos and plays a lot of stuff that just doesn't fit the band's new prog sound IMO. A more appropriate lead guitarist choice may have helped bring a certain dimension to Nupeth that's currently missing.

 

[Detective Beauregard]

Ah, Sorceress. Everyone seems to crap on this album, but I enjoy it far more than Heritage and even more than In a Cauda Venenum, baby. It isn’t as consistent as Heritage, but the high points are much stronger. The album definitely has an identity, which makes sense after all because it’s Mikael Akerfeldt’s Angry Divorce Experience in 3D. You can hear the sorrow and frustration in Mikael’s voice throughout the record, which gives it far more personality than the randomness of Heritage (although far less personality than if Mikael threw in some growlies).

Much like Heritage, the album is bookended by fluff instrumental pieces – even if they are strong in their own sad little way. The title track, Will o’ the Wisp, and Era are all part of Nupeth’s greatest hits, with Will in particular being my favorite track on the album for its upbeat take on the tried-and-true Damnation formula. The title track is simply catchy as hell throughout, and while Era gets a bit monotonous in its first half, the outstanding choruses and solo make up for it.

My second tier of tracks begins with The Wilde Flowers, which has a lot of strong moments but at times also feels a bit too hipstery for my rampant nonhipsterism. Incredible ending, though. Chrysalis is another solid tune, with an aggressive first half and moody ending. As @Mosh said, this is also where I started to question why the album wasn’t produced in a more metal fashion, as well as why it lacked the odd growl here or there.

I actually quite like Sorceress 2, as it has an eerie beauty that I enjoy. I also love how Mikael decided on a surprise happy final arpeggio out of nowhere. The Seventh Sojourn is another rip roaring good time, adding a bunch of Eastern elements that Opeth (and even Nupeth) aren’t known for. I really like the rhythm section here in general, and I’m also a fan of the ethereal ending.

Strange Brew is where the album starts to lose me, and that continues through the hilariously medieval offerings of A Fleeting Glance. Neither of these songs do much to grab me, and while neither outright suck (no Opeth really sucks), pretty much every track on freaking Heritage is more memorable.

In the bonus track realm, Spring MCMLXXIV is a fine little bluesy jam, but it’s understandable why it was left off the album proper as it doesn’t fit the overall style. The Ward would have fit the album, though, and it’s odd that it wasn’t included. Great “ah ah ah” chorus and killer bass line!

There are two moments on the album that should have been trimmed or altered, however, and those are the verses of Chrysalis and Era. Both are catchy in short bursts, but they run on for far too long. I understand that brevity isn’t Opeth’s forte, but previous lengthy excursions would switch sections often enough to keep me interested. That is not the case here. They at least should have thrown a riff or key change in there to mix it up.

Not sure if this is a controversial take, but going from Peter to Frederik was similar to going from Adrian to Janick with me. I think they're both great guitar players but they lost something when Peter left the band. Frederick butchers the old solos and plays a lot of stuff that just doesn't fit the band's new prog sound IMO.

Can't say I completely agree with this, but I understand some of it. From a technical standpoint, Frederik can play circles around Peter, but Peter's sound was definitely a part of what gave Opeth their classic identity. He played with a lot of dissonance and precision, whereas Frederik is more of a shredder.

 

[Shmoolikipod]

The album definitely has an identity, which makes sense after all because it’s Mikael Akerfeldt’s Angry Divorce Experience in 3D. You can hear the sorrow and frustration in Mikael’s voice throughout the record, which gives it far more personality than the randomness of Heritage (although far less personality than if Mikael threw in some growlies).

Interesting, I always felt it's the lightest Opeth record and this is also part of the reason I could rank it so high, it stands out this way. You've got easier melodies, more "standard" rock energy (Era, Chrysalis), and instead of "dying men in bewildered soliloquies", "I'm a sinner and I worship evil". I could say the shitty production killing the atmosphere supports the cause, but I kinda would prefer if the album sounded normal.

The last songs definitely feel underdeveloped. First four songs however are very fun, especially the title track, that's an iconic intro for me and I love the chugga chugga. As was said Akerfeldt should have made an exception to the "no metal rule" for Chrysalis, but I still like it the way it is. Sorceress 2 and Seventh Sojourn are in the twilight zone between being nothing-burgers and quite successful for what they are.

It's a nice album all in all, I think it gets too much hate. Maybe 7th was too high, but it fills a niche, and I won't see a public Opeth ranking without Heritage dead last so I regret nothing.

Sorceress 2, but Spring MCMLXXIV. And the Seventh Sojourn. Hmmm...

 

[Diesel 11]

Put off writing this but I listened to Sorceress a few days ago and it's a massive step up from Heritage in every way. The majority of the songs sound like actual songs and they all had something good within them. "Strange Brew" has the same issues that a lot of the Heritage tracks do, but there's some cool shit happening in the heavier sections. I'm pretty impressed by Mikael's voice and the vocal layers they've built here, it's a lot more interesting than I'm used to with Opeth.

Really liked the ballads "Will o the Wisp" and "A Fleeting Glance", "Era" was a strong closer, even the bookending intro/outro tracks were way better than Heritage's. The opening to "Seventh Sojourn" is epic as fuck and I was really expecting a big track instead of essentially an instrumental, but the outro section was really really cool. It's far from a perfect album, but it's at least a C+, likely a B-. Nothing on Heritage is calling me back in, but I can definitely see myself returning to this one in future.

 

[Mosh]

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11: Orchid
12: Sorceress
13: Heritage

Total score: 40

Highest score: 7 (@Detective Beauregard)
Lowest score: 1 (@JudasMyGuide)

Prior to Opeth's change in direction with Heritage, I think a general consensus would probably show Orchid as Opeth's weakest album. This seems to reflect as still largely the case as it still only performed better than two out of four of the Newpeth albums. Opeth has an exceptionally strong discography, so a third to last place finish isn't a terrible result, but it still comes as a little bit of a surprise to me and feels a little low. I actually think Orchid is a great album and I would prefer the Iron Maiden-esque rambling riffing and winter forest vibe to anything they have put out in the last decade with one notable exception. Once you get into the band's golden period, it gets a little bit harder to defend the debut. It's an enjoyable listen and presents a vibe just like Heritage, although a much different vibe. And, like Heritage, the album's greatest downfall is that the songs just aren't that memorable. There are a lot of great riffs and ideas, but each song just feels like a string of unrelated ideas. Still, enjoyable to listen to and a vibe goes a long way.

With the exception of a couple bottom rankings, Maidenfans were largely kind to Orchid. Despite finishing third to last, only two lists actually placed the album in the bottom three. Generally it performed one or two slots better, but, unlike later albums, nobody really gave it a particularly strong rating. Going forward, each album is going to have some big defenders. The other thing I'll point out is that some of these rankings are very close, Orchid only lost to the next album on the list by one point. On the other hand, the gap between Heritage/Sorceress and Orchid is more significant. I expect the general consensus on this album will be that a lot of the fans enjoy and respect this album, but it's far from a goto album for anybody, which leads to a relatively lower ranking.

 

[MrKnickerbocker]

Orchid is far from my favorite Opeth album, but it is one of the key albums I always listen to in October. It has an undeniably dark, spooky atmosphere that could only be achieved by having very little time or money in which to record (also recording in a basement helps).

I agree with everything Mosh has said, but I still truly enjoy this record. Some songs really are indistinguishable from others. Some parts don't make any sense. But the overall listening experience is fantastic. I adore the Maiden madness of In Mist She Was Standing, the spooky middle section of Under The Weeping Moon, the gothic piano interlude, all of Forest of October, and the rest is just gravy.

Orchid came in 9th place for me. Still in the bottom half of the discography, but a full percentage point higher than Heritage or Sorceress. Despite some other albums ranking higher, I always come back to this album with delight.

 

[Shmoolikipod]

I like all Opeth albums that aren't Heritage, that being said, I have Orchid second to last. Sadly it came late to my Opeth party and I never gave it special attention like I did the others, however my thoughts on it remained consistent whenever it came up:

In Mist She Was Standing is a banger, fast triplets are a cheat code to making me like your song. I totally love the ending as well, the clean/heavy changes feel more random than I'm used to. I love Under the Weeping Moon too, especially the atmospheric part. Maybe they're comparable to Advent/The Night and the Silent Water.

Forest of October I also always like but can't for the life of me remember how it goes, as I said that's on me for never giving the album a chance.

Spoiler

At this rate, if I disappear when Morningrise comes round in the list, just reread this reply to get my thoughts on it, because that's basically what I'll say about Nectar. Oops

And the last two songs, I never really liked. Perhaps they're beginning to tread water, but I don't enjoy them as much, and I'm just about ready to press stop by the middle of The Twilight is My Robe.

Despite the last two tracks, it's still a good album, but it pales in comparison to other Opeth albums which all have at least one song of the same caliber as IMSWS, or are at least much better crafted.

 

[Detective Beauregard]

There are a lot of great riffs and ideas, but each song just feels like a string of unrelated ideas. Still, enjoyable to listen to and a vibe goes a long way.

This is pretty much exactly how I feel, as well. I've been listening to Orchid over the last few days (although I was shocked to see that the 11th place album wasn't In Cauda Venenum), and the overall experience is enjoyable. The mix isn't great, but generally I can look past that considering this is a debut album.

The best part of Orchid? That sexy fretless 6-string bass! I love Martin Mendez, but there will always be a part of me that misses the bass-forward lead stylings of Johan De Farfalla. Thankfully we get more of this on the superior Morningrise.

While I still have to listen to a few tracks that I haven't heard in a while (namely Forest and Apostle), the individual songs in general aren't as strong as some of their parts. For example, that middle atmospheric creepy section in Weeping Moon is fantastic, but I'm struggling to remember any other section of the song other than the intro - and I just heard it this morning!

I'll update this after I hear the two remaining tracks, but one thing that confuses me is how Requiem is essentially two one-minute pieces in one. Why not just make these two separate tracks? While I enjoy both sections (especially the latter), there's no apparent musical theme between them.

 

[Mosh]

No update til Monday folks, so keep the Orchid talk going!

 

[MrKnickerbocker]

The best part of Orchid? That sexy fretless 6-string bass! I love Martin Mendez, but there will always be a part of me that misses the bass-forward lead stylings of Johan De Farfalla.

His playing on these first two albums is really something special. It somehow fits perfectly and yet feels alien at the same time (which I think makes it fit even better). Similar to the early Symphony X albums with Thomas Miller, though Miller's playing certainly fits more obviously within the whole.

 

[Diesel 11]

Orchid was a big step up from the previous two. It's biggest issue is that lack of cohesiveness, but almost every individual section is really, really good. Not really pure death metal by any means, maybe even less heavy than the melodeath I'm used to. A couple times it almost felt power metal-y. But it's really great metal, lots of Maiden influence, Mikael's vocals are awesome, the musicianship is great, atmosphere is excellent. Hone in on the songwriting and you'd have an A, I can definitely give it a B+ and a part of me could see this rising higher. I just wish that it didn't stop and start so chaotically, it felt like most of the time when they really started cooking it was over before it began.

 

[Mosh]

Orchid was a big step up from the previous two. It's biggest issue is that lack of cohesiveness, but almost every individual section is really, really good. Not really pure death metal by any means, maybe even less heavy than the melodeath I'm used to. A couple times it almost felt power metal-y. But it's really great metal, lots of Maiden influence, Mikael's vocals are awesome, the musicianship is great, atmosphere is excellent. Hone in on the songwriting and you'd have an A, I can definitely give it a B+ and a part of me could see this rising higher. I just wish that it didn't stop and start so chaotically, it felt like most of the time when they really started cooking it was over before it began.

Opeth's genre has always been really murky, but yea their earlier albums are even harder to pin down. If anything I think the early Opeth albums kinda highlight how much they're a prog rock band masquerading as extreme metal. There's some melodeath in there, some folk metal, even a little black metal on Morningrise, but at the end of the day the glue that holds it all together (including their new albums) is the blending of styles even within metal subgenres and wandering song structures.

 

[Mosh]

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9:
10: In Cauda Venenum
11: Orchid
12: Sorceress
13: Heritage

Total score: 41

Highest score: 9 (@Shmoolikipod)
Lowest score: 2 (@Mosh @KiDDo @KidInTheDark666 @Detective Beauregard)

This one was close! ICV managed to beat out Orchid by just one point despite Orchid generally getting more favorable ratings. As you can see, a lot of people ranked this one second to last. But it also had a couple big defenders. In addition to the outlier #5 ranking, there were a couple #6 and #7 placements as well. Orchid generally didn't have that kind of support, and in the end that one last place ranking may have made all the difference. There's a little bit of a bigger gap between ICV and the next album on the list as well.

Generally this follows the Maidenfans' distaste for Newpeth, although it's somewhat surprising that it knocked out a metal album even if it is a lower rated one usually. ICV has a little bit more riffing, a little bit more of an edge, and feels more like an Opeth album in tone than either Sorceress or Heritage, so it makes sense to me that it would perform better than those two. While Sorceress has more defined "songs," it also feels more uninspired and generic than ICV. On the other hand, ICV has a lot of meandering moments and actually feels quite similar to Orchid to me in the sense that none of the songs really go anywhere. Still, it's more enjoyable to listen to overall and is probably more successful at capturing that "vibe-y" sound than Heritage was, although I still prefer Heritage by a hair.

I tend to believe that, with the exception of Sorceress, there are no bad Opeth albums. And even Sorceress has a lot of redeemable qualities. ICV follows suit by not being a particularly great or memorable album, but an enjoyable listen overall. Not sure I would reach for this if I want a Newpeth fix, but it definitely feels like a step in the right direction compared to other material. I would be curious to hear how they move forward with the upcoming new album, but I also think it has been such a long time since ICV and the band has made some dramatic stylistic decisions since then that I wonder if this album kinda ends up being a sort of nonissue in terms of the band's long term direction. As a result, I reckon it will probably remain a lower rated Opeth album as the years go by.

 

[MrKnickerbocker]

I ranked ICV at #8 on my list, and I don't know if it deserves that. I think, ultimately, what stands out to me is that very little stands out. It's not great. It's not terrible. It's fine. Honestly, isn't that maybe the ultimate sin for an Opeth record?

I appreciate that some of the production veers closer to metal, I appreciate the darkness and heaviness of a lot of the riffs and the atmosphere, and I appreciate the hell out of songs like Lovelorn Crime and the sublime jazzy weirdness of The Garroter. All Things Will Pass is also a banger. And that refrain of "the river of time flows on blind and ruthless" is incredible.

There's a couple tracks that start or end great (Heart in Hand), but literally feel like 2 songs pasted together (which I suppose is better than a single track sounding like 6-7 songs pasted together a la Heritage). Songs like Dignity, Next of Kin and Charlatan are the definition of 7/10 Opeth songs where everything sounds good, they just don't really do much for me. Also, way too much talking/sampling.

Overall, I enjoy ICV, but it will never creep into my top Opeth albums.

 

[Shmoolikipod]

Wooooah, that's a lot of #12s guys.

I would be curious to hear how they move forward with the upcoming new album, but I also think it has been such a long time since ICV and the band has made some dramatic stylistic decisions since then that I wonder if this album kinda ends up being a sort of nonissue in terms of the band's long term direction. As a result, I reckon it will probably remain a lower rated Opeth album as the years go by.

I don't really understand what you mean here. It's bound to be lower rated as it's Newpeth, but it's the consensus best of those (not here I guess). But how is TLWAT related?

I do like ICV a lot, enough for it to break the old/new boundary I imagine most of us have. I always thought of it as Pale Communion's more awesome brother, but I realized when we were at Sorceress that it share a similar warm, fun aura that I really like to that album, which is responsible for a lot of the awesome sauce.

It comes in more forms here: you have the Sorceress kind, straight up good vibes like Dignity (compare to the math exercise ERWC) and the ascending run in Next of Kin. But also sampling, which breathes life into songs and is sorely missing in most metal if you ask me. This album is layered enough without it, but it's still welcome. And also having some outsider songs like The Garroter and Charlatan. There's even a song I never get to hear called Continuum! Talk about pushing boundaries!

It's a no filler album I meant what I wrote about Continuum. I had to get up every single time... , which is impressive for Newpeth. Yes it still inherits some Heritages, but in much smaller quantities. There's also a lot of drama in Universal Truth and All Things Will Pass, and an incredible solo in Lovelorn Crime.

Now, the the reason why I could only barely let It pass a single classic metal album (clarification: Still Life to Watershed), is that there's no true behemoth here like on those albums, some of which have multiple. Also: I like metal. These songs that are a complete journey each by themselves are the best thing about Opeth and they don't really exist here. Still, for consistency and quality, it's easily the best of the lesser albums.

Spoiler: And least it's not freezing anymore

Well, I managed to drag this for 2:45 hours. "Drag", I write slowly anyways. But I still have 15 minutes to sit on this chair, so I'm going to think of some controversial words and write them.
Monkey.
Shirt.
Shit.
Opeth.
Auto-correct.
Shin.
Waterloo.
\n.
Chair.
Sand.
Sorry if this any of this annoys you but it surprisingly helps me burn the time.
Pasta.
Technology.
Plastic.
Reality.
Hunger.
Whispers.
Murmurs.
Voices.
Purpose.
Unity.
Hey look I can leave two minutes early!

What do you mean in 27 minutes?!

 

[Detective Beauregard]

warm, fun aura

straight up good vibes

Classic Opeth descriptors if I've ever heard them.

 

[Detective Beauregard]

I gave In Cauda Venenum a good listen a few weeks ago, but since I don't remember most of it (not a great sign), I'm giving it another spin.

The Good:
- The first half of Dignity. That heavy riff is simple but catchy.
- The first half of Heart in Hand. The opening instrumental bit reminds me of the background music from Mortal Kombat II. Instant win.
- I think there was a catchy part at the end of Next of Kin. Maybe.
- Lovelorn Crime is a good ballad. It's no Face of Melinda or anything off Damnation, but it's good.
- I dig Charlatan and its "Big Bottom" three bass, no guitar approach. Unique idea, and the first two-thirds of the song is catchy as hell.
- Let's be real: The Garroter is Opeth gone Broadway. I can see Mikael creeping around the stage with a garrote and a funny hat, while the rest of the band (particularly Fredrik for maximum comedic effect) prances around as alley cats. This song just makes me laugh.
- The last few minutes of Continuum is the catchiest part of the album, hands down.
- All of All Things Will Pass. Super catchy tune, and I've never heard Mendez rock a slow Dio Sabbath gallop before.

The Meh:
- The last few sections of Dignity. One part is happy and the other is Nupeth paint-by-numbers. Lame.
- The second half or so of Heart in Hand. Too pretty and sunny.
- The end of Charlatan. Just no.
- Universal Truth. I just heard this song an hour ago and I don't remember a thing about it.
- The first two-thirds of Continuum. See above.

The Bad:
- There's no clear filler track (outside of the intro, but I'm not really counting that), which is in stark contrast to the previous Nupeth albums we've discussed.
- Too many Swedish people mumbling. I don't like voice clips in music as it is, but when me (and most of the world) can't even understand them, they're pointless. I think Opeth writing the lyrics in Swedish and forming melodies around those Swedish syllables may have caused quite a few of the lines to be rushed. A lot of them just don't flow well, at least in English. Next of Kin is a great example.

 

[Mosh]

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9: My Arms Your Hearse
10: In Cauda Venenum
11: Orchid
12: Sorceress
13: Heritage

Total score: 47

Highest score: 13 (@The Dissident)
Lowest score: 1 (@KidInTheDark666)

My Arms Your Hearse always comes off as a bit of a black sheep Opeth album to me. Compared to the first two albums, it feels like a step toward more of their signature style. More mix of clean vocals/growls, tighter syncopated riffing and less folk/black influences. The songs are still long but not overwhelmingly so like on the first two albums. There is also a little bit more cohesion. Despite having more common with the following albums, you will never hear this one discussed in the same breath as Still Life or Blackwater Park as the band's sound is nowhere near that level yet. The songwriting is still a bit choppy and the production is really rough with the reverb drenched vocals pushed to the back and a thin clean guitar sound that is unlike the full warm sounding guitars that we would hear later. In some ways, the jump from MAYH to Still Life is more striking than any other two Opeth albums just because the band took such a quantum leap as writers and performers.

Funnily enough, I think this all somewhat explains how My Arms Your Hearse is not just the first album on our ranking to receive a #1 ranking on a list, it's also the only album that received both a first place and a last place ranking, making it the most statistically polarizing of the Opeth albums. Being such a unique sounding album, I think it has a certain charm to it. You get the rawness of early Opeth but with a little bit more material that you can easily grab on to, as opposed to the onslaught of seemingly unrelated riffs. There are also some really beautiful moments throughout the album that hint at the melodic edge to come, such as on Credence. Demon of the Fall is, of course, the most enduring song from the album and probably for good reason. It's a bit of an oddball Opeth song really. It's not a sprawling epic, it has a very simple opening riff, and almost feels like the band going for a more "commercial" type of extreme metal. You could easily hear this song being released as a single, which is essentially impossible for the vast majority of Opeth's catalog. So I can see how many would have a soft spot for it. I definitely do, although it was only enough for me to rank it #10. Despite having a lot of interesting material, I feel this album tops out pretty early and kinda lacks the consistency of later albums or even Morningrise. Would love to hear them bring back some of the songs besides Demon though.

 

[MrKnickerbocker]

MYAH is the death metal version of In Cauda Venenum for me.

Besides Demon of the Fall, there is not one single song that sticks out. There is no other great song. The overall package is a nice moody, autumnal spookfest, but it all bleeds together in one wall of mediocrely-produced noise.

There are certainly great moments throughout...
- the piratey heavy riffs in April Ethereal that sound like the next logical evolution of the previous two albums
- the clean vocal section of When (honestly all of the clean vocal sections as they show Mikael growing in his performance ability)
- the PUNCH-PUNCH-PUNCH-PUNCH riff of the Amen Corner and the outro of The Amen Corner..

...honestly a lot of the music on this album is really great, but the songs never quite get there with that one exception. The lack of a real bass player also loses a lot of their fullness, especially coming out of the Johan years.

I personally ranked it third to last, yes below the first two albums, as I truly don't find much that stands out. But if this is the worst of the good Opeth albums, it's pretty great.

 

[Mosh]

The lack of a real bass player also loses a lot of their fullness, especially coming out of the Johan years.

TIL Mikael plays bass on this album. Honestly I don’t pay that much attention to the bass until Martin joins, so I’ll have to go back and listen for what y’all were talking about with the first two albums. I didn’t really notice a huge difference in that area on MAYH vs the first two albums.