Maryland abolishes death penalty

How about the old "I cast thee out" solution - dumping the most heinous murderers on a remote island with nothing but the shirts on their backs and letting nature take its course?
 
mckindog said:
How about the old "I cast thee out" solution - dumping the most heinous murderers on a remote island with nothing but the shirts on their backs and letting nature take its course?
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Rather than tearing each other apart, I reckon they'd get along quite well ;)
 
bearfan said:
Pretty much any premeditated murder has to at least be considered for the death penalty. It would depend on the specifics of the case, but off the top of my head .. serial killers, mass murderers, the more heinious child murders, cop killers, and I think some treason convictions should apply as well. The Rosenbergs for example certainly deserved it.
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There are no instances where the Death Penalty should be applied. Premeditated murder? So... I'm going to teach you NOT to kill people by killing you? That makes no sense. The death penalty works on the fanciful assumption that there is an afterlife and you are going to pay for your crimes in some "hell," which to be honest NOBODY has any idea if it exists or not, even religious people... there is a reason it's called "faith."

"But Onhell, we are punishing them by not allowing them to live anymore!" you say. Again... how is that punishment? How is it letting them escape with LIVING with what they have done in a 10 x 10 cell, the guilt, the public humiliation and stigma, the possibility of being beaten and raped in prison and eating shitty ass food that will cut their years considerably, etc... how is that punishment? It isn't. The death penalty is no different from burning of heretics or medieval hangings and beheadings attended by the whole village. It is a spectacle, it is not to punished the guilty, it is to reenforce the collective consciousness of the innocent, "WE don't do this," "We do not allow this." It is Eye for an Eye and stupid. Preaching to the choir.

I feel that the only reason it is still around in the US is because the current system of rehabilitating jailbirds sucks. Johnny Depp said it best in "Blow." "I went in with a bachelors in pot and came out with a PhD in cocaine." There is no ACTIVE interest in rehabilitating prisoners, they are left to be self directed in finish their school or pursuing constructive skills.

Edit: Perfect example parading through CNN right now, the Jodi Arias murder trial. She was found guilty, she could possibly face death. Did anybody see her face when she was read her verdict? Devastated... but that won't matter when she's dead. If she were given life in prison she'd feel that way for years... now THAT'S punishment.
 
This has to be one of the most engaging threads in ages. Lots has been said, and I have only read half of it (not yet mckindog's link).

I'll throw in a quote by the late Pope John Paul II. During his 26 years as leader of the Roman Catholic Church, he frequently called for an end to the death penalty. Among his statements on this issue was the following:

"A sign of hope is the increasing recognition that the dignity of human life must never be taken away, even in the case of someone who has done great evil. Modern society has the means of protecting itself, without definitively denying criminals the chance to reform. I renew the appeal I made most recently at Christmas for a consensus to end the death penalty, which is both cruel and unnecessary."

(Homily at the Papal Mass in the Trans World Dome, St. Louis, Missouri, January 27, 1999). (source)
 
It strikes me how some people tend to sidestep from the core of the discussion. When it's about weapon possession, people talk about killing with bananas. When it's about the death penalty, people talk about abortion. Different goals, different circumstances, different alternatives. These are different matters.

My own stance? Every time an innocent person is executed, it's one too many.
Can't resist mentioning that this especially has been going wrong in Texas (when just focusing on the USA).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrongful_execution#United_States

But I also oppose death penalty when it concerns people who really did commit the crime.
I have no other reasons than the ones already mentioned.

Gandalf made good points, so did the other fellow in white I quoted.
These two haven't been highlighted that much:
It's cruel and unnecessary. (At this point of writing, I still haven't read mckindog's link; hope I'll find time later).
 
I have read that story, mckindog, although I did it somewhat rushed.

Might I summarize this as a terrible act of torture and murder, and that these guys have a (short?) prison sentence? Did I read a possible 10 years?
 
Forostar said:
I have read that story, mckindog, although I did it somewhat rushed.

Might I summarize this as a terrible act of torture and murder, and that these guys have a (short?) prison sentence? Did I read a possible 10 years?
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More or less.
I'm not so much concerned of the sentence, but the nature of the crime.
I had no personal connection to it, but the case happened within an hour of my home.
Its enormity basically flipped me from my position of being opposed to capital punishment.
Like many on here, I used to think society was a better place by not stooping to the cruel and unnecessary punishment of the death penalty. I still believe that in most cases.
But monsters like these are the exception. These are not pathetic creatures like Gollum. There are no shades of gray, no questions, no 'yes, but.' They are Sauron - simply, completely, indisputably, evil.
Cried pointed to the need for distance, to make sure vengeance and retribution are not your motivating factors. And he is right.
But the opposite is also true.
When you debate these things strictly on a philosophical level, and you neglect to talk about what actually happened, you have to guard against your ideals blinding you to the actual facts of the case.
This pair targeted a girl for no other reason than she was vulnerable. They committed the most dreadful acts imaginable against her for no other reason than they thought it might be fun.
They had no more remorse than you would have about swatting a fly.
There is no doubt, no extenuating circumstance.
They exemplify the very worst in humanity. Ending their lives is not stooping to their level.
Letting them live is devaluing the life of their victim and every other person like her.
 
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