How good are Iron Maiden (individually)?
- Thread starter Gosheto
- Start date
chaosapiant
Ancient Marinade
My fave is, and always will be 2112. There is not a single filler on that album, imo.
lightintheblack
Invader
Murder89 said:
Sorry I know this is a Maiden forum but only someone who is not familiar with Blackmore and Pages work in the 70s could come to that conclusion! Blackmore in the 70s was simply untouchable both as a live guitarist and in the studio his work with Deep Purple and then Dio era Rainbow has never been equalled in the hard rock metal scene.ok these days he ia a 65 year old man who dresses up in tights and plays medieval nonsense most of the time but that does not detract from his absolutely genius guitar work in his prime years.Page was a brilliant and innovative guitarist in the studio but sometimes sloppy live mainly due to substance abuse! both these guys are revered by all 3 Maiden guitarists and thier influence is clear in all 3s playing and to be honest neither Dave,Adrian or Janick would claim to be anywhere near the level of those 2 as players.It was the combination of Dave and Adrians guitar work that made Maiden the band they were/are and of course the addition of Janick to those 2 has done the band no harm either.Dont get me wrong i think the Maiden guitarists are excellent my favourite being Dave whose tone and playing i love but they are not IMHO among the finest individual rock players as i said its the combination of the 2/3 that is awesome!!
Murder89
Officer Friendly
Blackmore (I'm not even mentioning Page) wasn't the best not even during the 70s.
I'm only referring to skills.Being on a Maiden forum doesn't have anything to do with the point.I know Dave isn't a monster of skills but neither is Blackmore and people have to understand that being innovative at some point doesn't mean being more skilful. I find it strange that we are living in 2010 and people still can't accept that some ''legends'' have been surpassed 30 years now.
What Dave is playing on the first album is enough to surpass anything Blackmore has done before and after that.
Don't get me wrong, Blackmore is one of my favourite guitarists but that doesn't mean I have to treat him like a god.We are talking about individuals and even from the 80s the world was filled with guitarists more skilled than Blackmore.Being innovative, being influential to others is another story.
The 3 amigos have all proven themselves to be very modest in words.
What they are playing is of more importance in what we are discussing.
I'm only referring to skills.Being on a Maiden forum doesn't have anything to do with the point.I know Dave isn't a monster of skills but neither is Blackmore and people have to understand that being innovative at some point doesn't mean being more skilful. I find it strange that we are living in 2010 and people still can't accept that some ''legends'' have been surpassed 30 years now.
What Dave is playing on the first album is enough to surpass anything Blackmore has done before and after that.
Don't get me wrong, Blackmore is one of my favourite guitarists but that doesn't mean I have to treat him like a god.We are talking about individuals and even from the 80s the world was filled with guitarists more skilled than Blackmore.Being innovative, being influential to others is another story.
The 3 amigos have all proven themselves to be very modest in words.
What they are playing is of more importance in what we are discussing.
Twarkle
Nomad
Murder89 said:
Good post, though I don't fully agree with your assessment of Blackmore over Murray at that time. Also deserving of mention in the conversation of 1970's hard rock guitarists who were as good as Page and Blackmore are Michael Schenker and Uli Jon Roth. And though he wasn't as revered as the man he replaced in Deep Purple, Tommy Bolin was an amazing guitar player with great chops, and was as comfortable playing fusion as he was rock.
Murder89 said:
That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.
Dave's work on the debut is great. But better than Blackmore's entire 70s? Get real.
Murder89
Officer Friendly
SinisterMinisterX said:
That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.
Dave's work on the debut is great. But better than Blackmore's entire 70s? Get real.
Yup sad but true.
And why do you keep mentioning the 70s?Blackmore had improved a lot in Stranger in Us All.
Anyway, I expected I would get such reactions.Some things are unthinkable for some people.In the end you can believe what you want.
Jeffmetal
Ancient Mariner
No wonder he got this douchebag on his avatar. Needless to say he thinks Malmsteen is light years better than Blackmore, also. I love Maiden and all the guitarrists that played in the band, but saying any of the 3 are better than Blackmore or Page is not fanboyism, is complete lack of judging.
I completely agree with lightintheblack. Schenker and Roth are some of my fave guitarrists, but they aren't genius, Blackmore and Page are genius!!! Smith and Murray are more remarkable than Roth, though. Gers is amazing, but as someone said the strength of Maiden is in the sinergy, not in the individuality. I'd love to see any of the three leading a project of their own after Maiden hang their axes, Smith done quite well with Psycho Motel and Gers some great songs with White Spirit. Now, all we need is someone smartass come and say "Well, any of the Psycho Motel or the White Spirit debut are better than any Purple or Zeppelin albums..." Then, I'll laugh really loud.
I completely agree with lightintheblack. Schenker and Roth are some of my fave guitarrists, but they aren't genius, Blackmore and Page are genius!!! Smith and Murray are more remarkable than Roth, though. Gers is amazing, but as someone said the strength of Maiden is in the sinergy, not in the individuality. I'd love to see any of the three leading a project of their own after Maiden hang their axes, Smith done quite well with Psycho Motel and Gers some great songs with White Spirit. Now, all we need is someone smartass come and say "Well, any of the Psycho Motel or the White Spirit debut are better than any Purple or Zeppelin albums..." Then, I'll laugh really loud.
Cap Maronis
Trooper
To be fair as inventive and great Page was, my god was he sloppy and did he get even worse as the years went by...
If we're talking 70s, I always have to throw Lifeson a bone, and to leave out Brian May in this conversation would be a travesty.
If we're talking 70s, I always have to throw Lifeson a bone, and to leave out Brian May in this conversation would be a travesty.
Forostar
Ancient Mariner
Jeffmetal said:
This has nothing to do with individual qualities of musicians but start laughing:
I never cared much for Purple and Zeppelin. But I love the White Spirit album, and also played Psycho Motel's debut very often when it came out. This race is already won for me.
Suicidehummer
Trooper
Murder89 said:
I almost shit my pants laughing at this classic!
You seem to have no sense of subtlety because Blackmore is a far superior musician to that retard Malmsteen. "Oh boy, he can play a million notes a second!" Well guess what, Blackmore can play one note and make it mean more than Malmsteen's whole song. Malmsteen has absolutely no taste, no songwriting skill, and no skill in general, besides moving his fingers fast. It's a stretch to call him anything more than a skinny Zakk Wylde.
All I can say is it takes a monumentally stupid person to think speed equates to skill. Blackmore was a pioneer. Malmsteen is a tool.
lightintheblack
Invader
Suicidehummer said:
I totally agree with what you say about widdly widdly Malmsteen suicidehummer except for the "skinny Zakk Wylde" part seeing Widdly these days i dont think you could call him the skinny anybody!!
I have no liking nor even respect for Widdly he basically tried to clone Blackmore even down to the stage clothing but took what Blackers had done with the neo classical side of things and completely destroyed it with his tasteless widdling as far as the likes of Malmsteen,Vai and Satriani are concerned then whilst i can accept they do have skill ie they can play very fast there is no real musical value,melody nor feeling to thier output they may as well go onstage with a giant speedometer and compete with each other!! guitar playing is not a sport but an art and these guys simply dont understand that it seems!!Coming back to the Maiden guys then as i said individually none are among the all time greats but the Murray Smith partnership is right up there with Priests Downing and Tipton and Thin Lizzys Gorham and Robertson and IMHO surpasses these partnerships Janick is a decent enough guitarist but the weakest of the 3 but i can understand why they kept him when Adrian returned as he has written some great songs and is a big part of the Maiden family now but in all honesty i dont think he is as good as the other two
Twarkle
Nomad
lightintheblack said:I totally agree with what you say about widdly widdly Malmsteen suicidehummer except for the "skinny Zakk Wylde" part seeing Widdly these days i dont think you could call him the skinny anybody!!
Vai has no musical value, melody, or feel? Come on man, the guy is far more than a shredder. He is a complete musician.
Only in rock in metal is having developed speed and superb technique looked down on and equated with lack of feel. Having a high degree of technique is a requisite in many types of music. It's a total cop out. There is absolutely no correlation between speed and feel or lack of feel and vice versa. There are plenty of fast guitar players across multiple genres who have tons of feel, and plenty of slow guitar players who have no feel. Why is having monster technique a bad thing when all it is is another tool that gives players more options in which to choose how to express themselves?
There are a ton of boring shredders, there is no doubt about that. Hell, I studied under Joe Stump for a year, I know all about pointless shredding. But there are plenty of highly regarded players in the world who have the speed/feel combination.