Here we go again...Iron Maiden sued over the rights of 6 songs

Forostar said:
Show off.
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32 years. It is not a big deal write 10 songs a year, if there are several songwriters in a band. That would make 320 songs. I'm not saying they are all good. Of some songs I only remember the title and who wrote it. I have a plastic bag full of C-cassettes.

I'm just saying that I think Steve remembers who wrote the lyrics. Maybe not who changed a couple of words though.
 
soundwave said:
I think you nailed it.
...but the most interesting thing will be the proof. I'm really curious if McKay is sitting on some bootleg as a smoking gun.
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Thanks. On the proof issue I also spoke about bootleg not being evidence at all.
A question to you all : McKay brings in several bootlegs, from 1976 to 1978. What would be on those bootlegs, what audio could be recorded on those bootlegs, that verifies Wilcock writing the song? A recording of Harris voice saying "lets play that new one that Dennis wrote" is the only thing that could turn those bootlegs into an evidence.

There is zero evidence in this case, and McKay has succeeded in stirring up the thing. There is 20+ pages only on these boards discussing accusations that are based on nothing.
 
Zare said:
Thanks. On the proof issue I also spoke about bootleg not being evidence at all.
A question to you all : McKay brings in several bootlegs, from 1976 to 1978. What would be on those bootlegs, what audio could be recorded on those bootlegs, that verifies Wilcock writing the song? A recording of Harris voice saying "lets play that new one that Dennis wrote" is the only thing that could turn those bootlegs into an evidence.

There is zero evidence in this case, and McKay has succeeded in stirring up the thing. There is 20+ pages only on these boards discussing accusations that are based on nothing.
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Well, if he presents a bootleg before Wilcock was in the band and then a bootleg with Dennis in the band, and songs that have changed their lyric he plants a doubt and the possibility that Wilcock could have rewritten the lyrics... If the judge takes into consideration what happened with Hallowed, he could have a reasonable doubt about Steve writing the song... However, if I was that judge I wouldn't think it IS PROOF that Wilcock wrote the lyrics
 
Zare said:
Ok I see. That's really groundwork for what we're discussing here so I didn't know it had to be explained. Intellectual property is legally transferable. Whether all legal procedures have been met is the real question and the answer is probably no. What that means is that I don't believe Maiden didn't compensate these early members under the counter back in early to mid 80s.
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It's worth remembering that when the events of this case took place Rod was not yet on the scene - he only appeared after they had already done the Spaceward demo and Paul Di'anno was in the band. Who knows how much more chaotic things may have been in those heady days before Rod took them in hand, when it had probably not occurred to any of them that it would ever be important?
 
Elaborate that, naivety or ignorance.
I already said it is perfectly normal for a high school band that changes members frequently to forget who brought in what. People came to play not to develop intellectual property.
 
I'm asking this as a hypothetical, not directly in reference to Maiden: If I wrote some song lyrics in a vacuum, then later discovered they are eerily similar to another song already written/published, am I liable for plagiarism? And if yes, does that mean that I should be constantly Googling lyrics by other bands to make sure my work is completely original? The same question goes for music. If I write a riff then find out later that another band has a similar riff? The opening riff to Wickerman sounds very similar to Running Wild by Judas Priest. Should Priest have sued Maiden? And how can you possibly prove that a band actively/intentionally stole your work?
 
Forostar said:
"We thought it was not important"

That is not a good speech in court.
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You don't seem to take into account "we" are a bunch of uneducated high school dropouts.
If the plaintiff thought that it was important then why didn't he register his property and monitor how its being used after his exit from the band?
 
Ziggyplayedguitar said:
Then again Steve could have re-wrote them between bootlegs.
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Yes he could. However, you must take into consideration than in any trial, if you make an affirmation you should prove that affirmation. If Steve says he re-wrote them, he should prove it (and he should have make that affirmation from the start) if not, he should at least present some proof that either makes the judge think that he wrote it or at least that Dennis didn't. Once again, what happened with Hallowed does not benefit Steve's case because he's perceived as dishonest for not crediting other people.
 
srfc said:
LOL

Steve doesn't have to prove anything.
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So you are a lawyer and that's your advice?

Let me see if I understand you. You suggest that Steve should not present any proof that he wrote the lyrics when someone else says he has and presents at least some evidence that present the reasonable doubt that Steve did not wrote it?

You're joking aren't you?
 
chaosapiant said:
The opening riff to Wickerman sounds very similar to Running Wild by Judas Priest. Should Priest have sued Maiden? And how can you possibly prove that a band actively/intentionally stole your work?
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The opening riff to Running Wild is an e chord. Good luck to Priest proving they invented an e chord.
 
Luisma said:
So you are a lawyer and that's your advice?

Let me see if I understand you. You suggest that Steve should not present any proof that he wrote the lyrics when someone else says he has and presents at least some evidence that present the reasonable doubt that Steve did not wrote it?

You're joking aren't you?
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Steve is already creditted and has been paid handsomely for writing the songs for the past 38 years. It's Dennis who has to prove differently
 
srfc said:
Steve is already creditted and has been paid handsomely for writing the songs for the past 38 years. It's Dennis who has to prove differently
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Ok. So you don not understand that that's the whole point of the case? If he is credited and is proven that he should have credited Wilcock he would have to pay a handsomely sum of money.

Oh and by the way, in a trial it doesn't matter you prove that you have written 10000 songs, you have to prove you wrote the one's that are being challenged or at least, as I have said before, present reasonable doubt that (in this case) Wilcock DID NOT wrote them... Let me ilustrate you further:

When Hallowed came into the light (it was played in the soundcheck before Maiden played under the moniker Genghis Khan) Steve had presumably written 15 songs by himself and at least 6 songs with other people (Di'Anno & Murray), however, he "presumably" lifted lyrics (which means he wasn't able to write the song completely by himself) from a song he didn't write although he has been credited as the only writer of it.

As you can see, the whole matter presents a reasonable doubt that maybe he didn't write ALL the lyrics to a song in which he is credited as the sole writer. It doesn't matter if it is two lines or a whole verse, is just means that you didn't write the entire song
 
Luisma said:
Ok. So you don not understand that that's the whole point of the case? If he is credited and is proven that he should have credited Wilcock he would have to pay a handsomely sum of money.

Oh and by the way, in a trial it doesn't matter you prove that you have written 10000 songs, you have to prove you wrote the one's that are being challenged or at least, as I have said before, present reasonable doubt that (in this case) Wilcock DID NOT wrote them... Let me ilustrate you further:

When Hallowed came into the light (it was played in the soundcheck before Maiden played under the moniker Genghis Khan) Steve had presumably written 15 songs by himself and at least 6 songs with other people (Di'Anno & Murray), however, he "presumably" lifted lyrics (which means he wasn't able to write the song completely by himself) from a song he didn't write although he has been credited as the only writer of it.

As you can see, the whole matter presents a reasonable doubt that maybe he didn't write ALL the lyrics to a song in which he is credited as the sole writer. It doesn't matter if it is two lines or a whole verse, is just means that you didn't write the entire song
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And how does any of that prove that Dennis wrote any of it?
 
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