European Politics

I'm not sure that China would be able to intervene directly, but the Chinese and Russians have been getting closer recently. Who knows what might happen.
 
The Flash said:
There's probably no chance of them making fun of a person posting his rankings of Maiden songs on a Maiden forum, though, so I'm cool with that. ;)
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They might get pretty pissed that you rank 'Alexander the Great' so highly though. :eek:

That's horrible to hear about what the IOC have done. I thought the Olympics were supposed to be about bringing people together, peace, unity and all that.

If Ukraine does collapse into civil war then who cleans up the mess? I guess Russia would be the most likely option despite NATO's tendency to get involved in this kind of thing. NATO involvement in Ukraine would be very dangerous considering the Russian backing of the current regime. Vitaly Klitschko should challenge Viktor Yanukovych to a boxing match to sort it out.
 
So all news websites have live tickers on the happenings on the Maidan. I still have no idea whatsoever how big all this is.
 
Hard to tell...but it's pretty massive...

Some of these are pretty graphic...


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For what it is worth .. and after the Syrian Red Line .. it is not worth much. Obama is declaring another line.

President Obama vowed Wednesday that there would be “consequences” for Ukraine's leaders if violence against protesters continues.

“We expect peaceful protestors to remain peaceful and we’ll be monitoring very closely the situation, recognizing that with our European partners and the international community there will be consequences if people step over the line,” Obama said after 25 people were reported dead in overnight protests. “And that includes making sure the Ukrainian military does not step into what should be a set of issues that can be resolved by civilians.”
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http://thehill.com/blogs/global-aff...a-threatens-consequences-for-ukraine-violence
 
This is bad .. I am surprised (in a good way) that this is getting a fair amount of coverage here in the US. Part might be because of all the journalists in the general area for the Olympics, but it is a lead story even on the local news stations.
 
Police armed with weapons...many surrendered and captured officers...full out war right now.

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Just watching the 10 o'clock BBC news. Frightening. 75 dead since Tuesday. It looks like events in Kiev, & now elsewhere in Ukraine, are really spiralling out of control. I'm finding it hard to understand why any state would start shooting its citizens.
 
A summary from the Guardian on the Ukraine:

  • Yulia Tymoshenko has been released from custody in Kharkiv and is expected to fly to Kiev.
  • The parliament has impeaced President Viktor Yanukovych and called for elections on May 25
  • Some eastern cities have declared their support for the new government although Yanukovych said there was a coup in Kiev
  • Britain, Poland and other EU countries have declared their support for the new government while Russia attacked the demonstrators who formed it as “extremists and pogromists”.
Some eastern cities have declared their support for the new government - I certainly do not like the sound of this.
 
I read a timeline on the BBC's website earlier and Viktor Yanukovych has been messing up Ukraine for at least a decade now. In 2004 he won the presidential election but it was rigged and he lost the re-run to the pro-European candidate. He won the next election in 2010 then threw Yulia Tymoshenko in jail for no reason. He's not going to give up any time soon.
 
I doubt anyone is shocked about this
Cash: $12 million. Decoration of a dining hall and tea room: $2.3 million. Statue of a wild boar: $115,000. "A bribe": $4,000.

These are some of the expenses detailed in financial documents found in President Viktor Yanukovych's abandoned residence, which was occupied by protesters after the leader fled the capital.

As thousands of Ukrainians continued to tour Yanukovych's opulent estate outside of Kiev on Sunday, evidence was uncovered of lavish spending in an economy that is teetering on the verge of default.

Yanukovych left Kiev on Friday night after opposition protesters took control of the capital and the national parliament in the wake of deadly clashes with police last week. More than 70 people were killed and hundreds were injured.

While visitors gawked in awe and outrage at Yanukovych's luxurious mansions, ponds and exotic animals, journalists combed through heaps of documents that appeared to show a leader who basked in extravagant wealth while his country sought bailouts from both the West and Russia.

Many of the financial and other documents were burned, while others were dumped in a lake before Yanukovych fled his closely guarded residence, flying to the eastern city of Kharkiv, where his support base is strongest. Divers were able to retrieve many of the documents, and activists laid them out to dry.

Photos of the documents were posted online by Mustafa Nayem, a top Ukrainian investigative journalist for the Ukrainska Pravda website and Hromadske.tv online news channel. Other respected Ukrainian news outlets also reported on the documents.

One was a receipt for $12 million in cash. Another invoice was for a payment of $10 million. Some 80,000 euros (about $110,000) went for curtains in a room called the "knight's hall." Another 1.1 million euros (about $1.5 million) was spent on plants. Wooden decor for a handful of rooms cost $2.3 million.

Notably, $115,000 was spent for a statue of a "running boar," possibly intended for Yanukovych, who is an avid hunter.

One page listed expenditures, and next to item No. 47 on the sheet was a payment of 32,580 hryvna (nearly $4,000) for what was described as a "bribe" used in a bidding process.

The documents were sure to fuel more anger among protesters.

Yanukovych's whereabouts were unknown Sunday. An aide said she last spoke to him Saturday night and he considered himself the legitimate president of Ukraine and did not intend to leave the country.

His residence in the Mezhygirya Park, about 140 hectares (345 acres) of forested hills along the Dnipro River had become for many Ukrainians a symbol of a corrupt administration. The president refused to answer questions about the estate, saying he lived in a modest house on a small plot of land on the grounds.

Journalists' investigations traced the property and buildings around it to Yanukovych's allies.

After Yanukovych's departure from Kiev, the estate was taken over by the opposition's self-defense units, which opened it to visitors and deployed activists to maintain order and prevent any looting or property damage. Ukrainians, many bringing their children, rushed to tour the parks. They reacted with wonder and revulsion at the opulence, including Yanukovych's private golf courses, pig farm and a small zoo with ostriches and peacocks.

Some have called for turning the site into a hospital, sanatorium or even a "museum of corruption."
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You know, in times gone by, protesters would have torched that place. That they haven't suggests this is a different breed of protesters.
 
Now that Yanukovych has been removed from office, it is crucial that the opposition doesn't turn into a lynch mob - or even worse, turn into what they have now succeeded in removing. Kicking the sitting president out of his residence does not remove the cracks in their society.
 
Exactly, these are protesters with a purpose ...beyond not looking like a lynch mob, they also seem to be finding good evidence to use against the opposition in the forthcoming election
 
A tape of several phone conversations between prime minister Erdoğan and his son confirming the corruption and defraudation was released yesterday. Main opposition's leader featured the tape in his speech today, the national channels (all of them) who were airing the speech cut the broadcast as soon as the tape started. While Erdoğan and his companions declare the tape as fake, all sound engineers claim that there's no way the tape was faked or montaged.
 
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