Russia invades Ukraine

Dumb question, truly, but I’ll ask.

If NATO admitted Ukraine now, would that maybe end this tragedy or would it result in a bigger war with Russia?

As much as Ukraine has held its own (with aid), I can’t imagine Putin would take on NATO. Then again, nukes still exist.

I’m torn on this very unlikely theoretical idea. Too risky for NATO, sure. But it would be a bold, decisive move that might end the whole thing.
 
If NATO admits Ukraine now, Putin is actively in violation of Article V, which means NATO countries are directly at war with Russia or NATO is worthless because it doesn't abide by its own agreements. Either makes the world a less peaceful place imo.
 
If NATO admits Ukraine now, Putin is actively in violation of Article V, which means NATO countries are directly at war with Russia or NATO is worthless because it doesn't abide by its own agreements. Either makes the world a less peaceful place imo.
Yes, something with that level of intentionality would be strategic to broadening the adversary Russia would face and not for the purpose of NATO flaking on it.

It would be a huge game of chicken. But, I don’t think Russia could defeat NATO, even if the US stayed mostly out of it.

Pros:
Unlike an immediate declaration of war or individual nations siding with Ukraine on their own, it would be a negotiation tactic with an admission date for Ukraine say within 6 months.
Would send a clear message that attacking a country before it joins NATO doesn’t work.
Would end the conflict decisively at some point.

Cons:
Potential nuclear escalation.
Risk of current NATO members leaving the alliance.
NATO actually loses a conventional war against Russia (improbable, IMO, but not a negligible risk to consider).

And, of course, no one really wants WWIII.

Again, just a thought exercise and not something I’d expect to actually happen. My best guess is that it ends in a bilateral cease fire and Ukraine either loses a only token section of territory or retains its pre-war borders.

Edit: I understand this is a real, current crisis and am not trying to trivialize it or insult anyone affected directly or indirectly by it. Nor do I bear Russians any personal malice. I just think enough is enough with this conflict and the rest of the world hasn’t intervened enough.
 
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If NATO admitted Ukraine now, would that maybe end this tragedy or would it result in a bigger war with Russia?
Here’s my take:

Ukraine won’t be invited to NATO today or tomorrow. At best, Trump might send them some weapons or slap some additional sanctions on russia. But if the major NATO powers—those who actually hold the real military leverage—had the will to act and meant it, the war could be over far sooner than most think.

Here’s how I see it unfolding:
  • NATO invites Ukraine to join, and most importantly, sends a clear backchannel message to putin: we're serious, and we will defend Ukraine.
  • putin doesn’t believe it—at first. He continues bombing civilian targets.
  • But NATO follows through. They enforce a no-fly zone over Ukraine using jets, Patriot batteries, NASAMS, IRIS-T systems. Suddenly, russian planes can’t operate freely.
  • putin is furious—but NATO isn’t bluffing. They tell him: withdraw from internationally recognized Ukrainian borders or we’ll start precision strikes on your front lines.
  • Still, putin hesitates. He rants and tries to negotiate through backchannels, but doesn't pull back his troops.
  • NATO acts. They begin bombing russian troop concentrations and logistics hubs inside Ukraine. The war is disrupted. Even now, without air superiority, the Ukrainians have nearly stalled the front lines—relying purely on courage and morale. With real air cover, they’d not only hold the line, they could push forward.
  • NATO keeps the pressure on: if putin still refuses to retreat, they warn they’ll begin targeting supply lines inside russia.
  • At this point, putin realizes NATO isn’t posturing. This isn’t just talk. He knows he’s losing. He also knows nuclear escalation is a suicide mission—and his inner circle knows it too. So he starts to withdraw. He tells the russian people they lost to the “Big Bad NATO,” but claims he saved russia from nuclear war or some such propaganda.
  • NATO doesn’t stop there. They maintain their firm stance and eventually help Ukraine retake Crimea. The message this sends to the world—especially to places like China—is crucial: if you invade, you will be pushed back.
As for whether putin survives all this politically? That’s another question. But the key ingredient here is NATO's will. Its realization of the power it holds—and the guts to act, not just issue statements.

I believe this scenario is achievable—even without boots on the ground. With real air support and a steady flow of modern weapons from the West, Ukraine could do the rest.

putin and his circle are street-born thugs from the underbelly of St. Petersburg. Their mindset is to push until someone pushes back—hard. They only back down when they’re punched in the mouth. If NATO showed real resolve, real firepower, and made it clear that the red button means instant elimination, he’d believe it.

Oh, he’d definitely believe it. Because at that point, NATO would no longer be just “deeply concerned.” It would be a force that backs its words with real action—closing the skies, targeting russian military assets, and proving that when red lines are drawn, they actually mean something.

Link -If anyone remembers—in 2015, a russian military jet was shot down by Turkey. And what happened? Absolutely nothing. They got smacked in the teeth and didn’t dare mess with Turkey again. That’s how bullies operate: they push until someone pushes back harder.

Sure, maybe this is a bit optimistic. But to me, that’s how you deal with someone like putin: with strength, clarity, and consequences.
 
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I don't know why people have this illusion that Trump will do anything. He's a force of law when it comes to the weak, but that's it—his comments about the Ukrainian president and his attire while simultaneously approving of Musk in T-shirts and baseball caps in the Oval Office clearly demonstrated this. The US president is a master of double standards.

The truth is, Trump could have been the first president who truly had a chance to destroy Russia and make history. The path he chose instead has nothing to do with making America great.
 
Trump has announced the delivery of Patriot missile systems to Ukraine, which is the first big arms transfer of Trump 2.0 (if it happens, let us never forget TACO). I would expect that this is likely because he has finally gotten tired of Putin promising to work for a ceasefire and then escalating in Ukraine. Trump really wants that Nobel Peace Prize and he always thought negotiating peace in Ukraine was the way to get it.
 
The truth is, Trump could have been the first president who truly had a chance to destroy Russia and make history. The path he chose instead has nothing to do with making America great.

That thing, where we associate the greatnes of one nation with the destruction of another... The only difference between Putin and Trump is the weapon of choise. One uses bullets, the other money. And don't think for a moment that money is less lethal.
 
That thing, where we associate the greatnes of one nation with the destruction of another... The only difference between Putin and Trump is the weapon of choise. One uses bullets, the other money. And don't think for a moment that money is less lethal.
Sadly, this is the only language that Russia understand.
 
For all of Trump's vices, some can be put to good use in this particular situation, IMHO.

He is unpredictable and fickle, but he gives off the vibe of the man who holds grudges, so if he gets pissed at Russia, I don't think he'll back down that easily.

Also, for all the problems I have with his machismo (inasmuch as a septuagenarian is able to project it ... but then again, Putin is only 7 years younger lol), it is literally the only language Russia understands, historically and nowadays.

The possibility of him achieving something regards Ukraine leaves me genuinely nonplussed, but I wouldn't throw the possibility under the table.
 
I am not arguing that a "strong hand" approach is necessary sometimes. Of course it is. But to think that Trump is better than Putin is wrong, just wrong.
 
As opposed to the US which listens to reason? LOL
Do you know the one where an American, a Russian and a Greek enter a bar?
First of all. I don't think that Trump is better than Putin (but at least he is not a war criminal and mass murderer). Second - I've worked with Russians for last two decades and live quite close to Russia, heck - my building still have bullet holes after their last special operation in my country so I'm a little bit more inclined to be against them and I will support any country that can put them down.

USA has every tool on a planet to do that but Trump choose friendship with Putin and that's all.
 
But to think that Trump is better than Putin is wrong, just wrong.

Oh, really?

How many of Trump's opposers were imprisoned and/or killed or assassinated


How many prominent Americans have "fallen out of the window by accident" under Trump?

How many wars and invasions of other countries have the US started? How many Western cities have the US bombarded, raided, taken in an act of aggression under Trump? How many hospitals blown up, how many women raped and tortured by US soldiers, how many children tortured? How many dams blown up? Etc.

I understand that Trump is eeeevil, I don't like him myself, he's an overall terrible person, but these comparisons ... leave something to be desired.
 
I am not arguing that a "strong hand" approach is necessary sometimes. Of course it is. But to think that Trump is better than Putin is wrong, just wrong.
I'm not endorsing Trump, but he's certainly a better option than putin—at least so far.
 
We don't truly need to play this game. So let's just maybe move on from that part of the discussion.
 
Oh, really?

How many wars and invasions of other countries have the US started? How many Western cities have the US bombarded, raided, taken in an act of aggression under Trump? How many hospitals blown up, how many women raped and tortured by US soldiers, how many children tortured? How many dams blown up? Etc.

Literally countless.

EDIT: And just to be clear, I do not support Putin or Russia.
 
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Hope this is still okay because it’s news, but Trump is expected to make a “major statement” later today.


I’m skeptical, particularly given Trump says a lot of things just for headlines, but sometimes bluster countermands bluster. Tbh, I think finding a way for Putin to save face and exit gracefully would be an effective tactic to end the war at this stage. Although, doing so might involve convincing Ukraine to make some concessions.
 
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