Kevin Shirley Rant...

The Saint

Powerslave
Staff member
Here's what Kev the Cave has written on his latest blog entry:

Was in town yesterday to mix a song (amongst other sad things, some fiscally related as above!), and some of the stuff I get to mix is so badly recorded, it's shameful. It's always the music that comes first, and sometimes with a little alchemy in the mix, the songs help lift mediocre recordings, but it's such a pity people (and some record companies that I deal with) cheap out on that part of the process. I have been involved in mixing and remixing some really old recordings, like Zeppelin, Maiden, Journey etc; and there is always time spent taking care of the quality of the recording aspect. Nowadays, people think anyone with a ProTools setup on their laptop can record. Well, they can - but would you ask a mechanic to fix your teeth, or a hairdresser to do your plumbing! It's an insult to people in our craft, that those fucking label morons think that anything recorded is worthy! Apparently there is no art to it! But they'll still charge the same for the CD and run up their expense accounts like it doesn't matter! It's like when Instamatic cameras came along, and then digital cameras - everyone's a fucking photographer all of a sardine! Just point 'n click! I think not. And no one takes rock photographs like Ross!

Now, I'm bound to get all manner of abuse for knocking recordings, and bands etc. because it seems you can't criticize mediocrity without getting up someone's nose, but I think we should. There are a lot of people out there who don't particularly like my work, and they let me know - but it's also nice to know that being serious about it has influenced a number of people who want to do the same thing, and thats very gratifying! Because I am serious about it. I am so disappointed at the lack of quality records around - and there is so much talent and so much technology - that it is inexplicable that there are so few ground breaking musical moments.


I agree with him mostly.

Cheers
 
yeah, that Pro Tools recording "trend" really sucks
there's some albums out there that would have benefited of a REAL recording environment with a proper producer...
*cough* new Bruce album *cough*
 
I agree with Kevin and Freaky. I blame the lack of real studio recordings for the loss of intensity on "Tyranny Of Souls", even though I really like the record.
 
I blame shirley for his "recording live in the studio" technique which has made BNW and DOD sound like Demo recordings, esp on vocals
 
I like Bruce's new sound, Gor. I think it's a logical progression from his days in the 80s. Considering the damage that could have been done to his throat with his excessive drinking, smoking, and too many concerts packed together...plus, the notes that come out of the studio he can actually hit live.
 
[!--QuoteBegin-LooseCannon+Jun 12 2005, 10:06 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(LooseCannon @ Jun 12 2005, 10:06 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]I like Bruce's new sound, Gor.  I think it's a logical progression from his days in the 80s.  Considering the damage that could have been done to his throat with his excessive drinking, smoking, and too many concerts packed together...plus, the notes that come out of the studio he can actually hit live.
[snapback]108283[/snapback]​
[/quote]

I also like the live recording in the studio approach of the latest Maiden offerings. However, Bruce is one of the most professional singers in metal. He wasn't a saint during the 80s, but at least he took much more care of his voice than most singers.

BTW, I agree with Kevin's rant.
 
[!--QuoteBegin-The Saint+Jun 10 2005, 07:22 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(The Saint @ Jun 10 2005, 07:22 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]And no one takes rock photographs like Ross!
[snapback]108069[/snapback]​
[/quote]
This is what I found cool! [!--emo&^_^--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/happy.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'happy.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
 
[!--QuoteBegin-Perun+Jun 12 2005, 07:49 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Perun @ Jun 12 2005, 07:49 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]I agree with Kevin and Freaky. I blame the lack of real studio recordings for the loss of intensity on "Tyranny Of Souls", even though I really like the record.
[snapback]108268[/snapback]​
[/quote]

Could you please explain what you mean by 'the loss of intensity' on 'Tyranny of Souls'???I do not see any 'loss of intensity' there contrary to 'Dance of Death'.

I mean nobody in here not being deaf can really hold that Roy Z is the better producer than Mr. Shirley, can they?I do not mean to say that Roy Z would be better for Maiden, yet why not let him have a go at it?I bet there would be a lot more intensity then, wouldn't there?
 
[!--QuoteBegin-gor+Jun 12 2005, 08:09 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(gor @ Jun 12 2005, 08:09 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]I blame shirley for his "recording live in the studio" technique which has made BNW and DOD sound like Demo recordings, esp on vocals
[snapback]108270[/snapback]​
[/quote]

I am quite with you, yet only as for 'Dance of Death'.I hold that 'Brave New World' shows a far better production than its successor.One has to listen to 'Face in the Sand', the vocals are so badly recorded there, it almost destroys that wonderful song. [!--emo&:angry:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/mad.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'mad.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
 
[!--QuoteBegin-Cosmiceddie+Jun 14 2005, 10:47 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Cosmiceddie @ Jun 14 2005, 10:47 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]I am quite with you, yet only as for 'Dance of Death'.I hold that 'Brave New World' shows a far better production than its successor.One has to listen to 'Face in the Sand', the vocals are so badly recorded there, it almost destroys that wonderful song.  [!--emo&:angry:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/mad.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'mad.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
[snapback]108579[/snapback]​
[/quote]

I concur with that assessment. While most of DoD was well-produced, there were some sadly muddy moments. Personally, I think the best idea would be to do drums, bass, and chord-based rhythm parts live in the studio, then overdub single-note guitar parts (including solos, of course) and vocals. That should get the best mix of live energy and audio clarity.
 
Whence comes it then that 'Brave New World' sounds so much better than 'Dance of Death'?Apparently both records were produced the same way.Hence I'm repeating myself by maintaining that the problem must be the mixing.I still think that both the drums and the vocals are too low in the mix.However, I must confess that the guitar sounds on 'Dance of Death' are superior to the ones in 'Brave New World'.Also I noticed that some 'Dance of Death' songs show a better sound quality than others.Just compare the title track with 'Face in the Sand'.The way the vocals were recorded or mixed must have been quite different there.

To get back to the topic, I'd wish Maiden would record another album in the line of 'Killers'...just regarding the production, though.To me, 'Killers' has still the best production of all Maiden records.I mean how is it that an album recorded back in 1981 sounds this much better than an album made in 2003?Where's the problem???
 
[!--QuoteBegin-LooseCannon+Jun 15 2005, 10:01 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(LooseCannon @ Jun 15 2005, 10:01 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]The Caveman and the SinisterMinister producing Maiden's next album?  Stay tuned!
[snapback]108614[/snapback]​
[/quote]


i think its good also that the Caveman are recording the next Maiden album, i think he has done a great job on the other maiden albums
 
Kevin Shirley is a great producer. Unfortunately, some of his work with Maiden has been damaged by poor mastering.

Roy Z is another great producer. However, he tends to make most of the things he produces to sound similar.
 
[!--QuoteBegin-GhostofCain+Jun 15 2005, 10:15 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(GhostofCain @ Jun 15 2005, 10:15 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Kevin Shirley is a great producer. Unfortunately, some of his work with Maiden has been damaged by poor mastering.
[/quote]

by that and by his passive role that doesn't allow him to impose himself on Maiden, esp Steve.
 
[!--QuoteBegin-gor+Jun 16 2005, 01:45 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(gor @ Jun 16 2005, 01:45 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]by that and by his passive role that doesn't allow him to impose himself on Maiden, esp Steve.
[snapback]108815[/snapback]​
[/quote]

His role is nearly the same as Martin Birch's. The main difference between them is the approach to the recordings and that nowadays music is usually ruined by LOUD mastering.

And I've told you before (and probably will tell you again) that Bruce and Kevin have won some battles over Steve during the recording of the latest albums... [!--emo&;)--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/wink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'wink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
 
[!--QuoteBegin-GhostofCain+Jun 17 2005, 08:32 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(GhostofCain @ Jun 17 2005, 08:32 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]And I've told you before (and probably will tell you again) that Bruce and Kevin have won some battles over Steve during the recording of the latest albums...  [!--emo&;)--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/wink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'wink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
[snapback]108902[/snapback]​
[/quote]

Tell me more about what you mean by this statement, would you?
 
[!--QuoteBegin-Cosmiceddie+Jun 17 2005, 09:18 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Cosmiceddie @ Jun 17 2005, 09:18 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Tell me more about what you mean by this statement, would you?
[snapback]108905[/snapback]​
[/quote]

Basically that Kevin and Bruce argued with Steve about the arrangements of some songs and actually won the battle. It's not as if Kevin is just a guy who tells yes to everything Steve says...
 
[!--QuoteBegin-GhostofCain+Jun 17 2005, 09:25 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(GhostofCain @ Jun 17 2005, 09:25 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Basically that Kevin and Bruce argued with Steve about the arrangements of some songs and actually won the battle. It's not as if Kevin is just a guy who tells yes to everything Steve says...
[snapback]108906[/snapback]​
[/quote]

This may well be possible, yet what has the arrangement matter to do with the sound or the mix of the album.
 
[!--QuoteBegin-Cosmiceddie+Jun 17 2005, 09:34 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Cosmiceddie @ Jun 17 2005, 09:34 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]This may well be possible, yet what has the arrangement matter to do with the sound or the mix of the album.
[snapback]108909[/snapback]​
[/quote]

Kevin is not happy with the mastering of "Dance of death" and he wasn't responsible for that. IMHO, the album is well produced and sounds really great when it's not overcompressed (if you have the chance, check the DVDA).

BTW, my answer was to gor's comment.
 
Back
Top