DREAM THEATER SURVIVOR 2016: Results -> A Change Of Seasons wins!

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All the I&W/Awake praise everywhere on the net reminds me somewhat of all those people who have Number of the Beast as their favourite Maiden album. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but I just can't wrap my head around that one.

Also...
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NOOOO!!! 6:00 is gone!!

Pull Me Under
Another Day
Surrounded
Under a Glass Moon
 
All the I&W/Awake praise everywhere on the net reminds me somewhat of all those people who have Number of the Beast as their favourite Maiden album. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but I just can't wrap my head around that one.
I get that, but there's a bit of a difference there. Number of the Beast is like a starting point for Maiden, every album they did after was building on it and improving the sound. Unless you stopped liking Maiden after 1982, it'd be odd to have NOTB as your favorite just because they did so much more after. I know music is subjective and all that, not saying NOTB is factually weaker, but it's not Maiden at their peak. Images & Words and/or Awake could actually be considered DT's peak. I wouldn't agree with that, but the argument is there. I can see why people would lose interest in DT after Awake. They never really made albums like I&W/Awake again. Especially after getting Rudess, there was a totally different intention with DT's music.
 
@JudasMyGuide out of curiosity what is your favorite DT album ?

Heh, I wish I knew. For the longest time I was convinced it was Systematic Chaos, for various reasons I'll get to when we get to it and discuss it. I still love it, mind you, and I'm very sad to see how many people hate it, but after this time period when I was sure A Dramatic Turn of Events must be my #1, I think I finally settled on Six Degrees as my overall favourite album (Chaos being #2, ADToE #3 and Train of Thought #4). Let's hope it won't change again. :D I am going to write something about each future album we get to and I'll explain my reasoning there.

Honorable mention goes to 8um, which I don't feel like calling my "favourite" album per se, but I enjoy it very much and play it very often - I always get this very special feeling when I'm listening to it which I cannot properly describe or even understand. Yes, the songs are much simpler and more straightforward, sometimes bordering on the poppy side of the things, but I guess there's nothing wrong with that.

My favourite 90's/pre-2000/pre-Rudess album is probably Falling Into Infinity. I have a post regarding that album prepared already.

Also

I get that, but there's a bit of a difference there. Number of the Beast is like a starting point for Maiden, every album they did after was building on it and improving the sound. Unless you stopped liking Maiden after 1982, it'd be odd to have NOTB as your favorite just because they did so much more after. I know music is subjective and all that, not saying NOTB is factually weaker, but it's not Maiden at their peak. Images & Words and/or Awake could actually be considered DT's peak. I wouldn't agree with that, but the argument is there. I can see why people would lose interest in DT after Awake. They never really made albums like I&W/Awake again. Especially after getting Rudess, there was a totally different intention with DT's music.

I get what you mean. However that's pretty much what I dislike - although it doesn't have to be so, all those "I&W/Awake" people seem to me as if they really did lose their interest in the band after 1994 and are still pining for the time Moore was in the band and Labrie hasn't eaten that spoilt shellfish. Not helping is the fact how many people actually say that out loud. It's over 20 years, for crying out loud. This and all the various Jordan-bashing is where it reminds me of the Janick/reunion haters Maiden have, who would prefer them to play classics (RTTH, Trooper, NOTB) and be done with it. I know it's probably not so (and I would like to stress I'm definitely not accusing anybody), but since I usually like the band as a whole or not at all these "sacred cows" get on my nerves after a while. It doesn't help that I have serious problems with both Number and Awake.

On the other hand, I nowadays am more open to those who are upset regarding Portnoy leaving. Of course, when you read that under every arcticle and everywhere - "FOOKIN POSERS BRIG DA MIKE BAK EAT MY ASSNBALLS" - it's annoying and tiring... but later I've been more understanding regarding that sentiment. It's a combination of various factors, but while I like MM a lot and I think he is otherwise a wonderful addition to the band, 1.) his drum sound is rather bad. I know it might be intentional, but a bad intention it is, 2.) no more rotating setlists, 3.) Astonishing, which I believe would never happen with Portnoy still there, 4.) less connection with fans - less official bootlegs, less chats and blogs etc. 5.) by losing the last "down to earth dude" they got way too "high-classed" to even my likings, if you know what I mean, 6.) also, less metal.

But after three more albums in line-up many of these arguments will become sillier and sillier, because - let's admit it, they've been playing without Portnoy for nearly seven years now (not to mention he fucked it up himself - as someone here on this forum very poignantly said, "fuck him and his Constant Motion" :D ).
 
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On the other hand, I nowadays am more open to those who are upset regarding Portnoy leaving. Of course, when you read that under every arcticle and everywhere - "FOOKIN POSERS BRIG DA MIKE BAK EAT MY ASSNBALLS" - it's annoying and tiring... but later I've been more understanding regarding that sentiment. It's a combination of various factors, but while I like MM a lot and I think he is otherwise a wonderful addition to the band, 1.) his drum sound is rather bad. I know it might be intentional, but a bad intention it is, 2.) no more rotating setlists, 3.) Astonishing, which I believe would never happen with Portnoy still there, 4.) less connection with fans - less official bootlegs, less chats and blogs etc. 5.) by losing the last "down to earth dude" they got way too "high-classed" to even my likings, if you know what I mean, 6.) also, less metal.
^This exactly.

#bringbackportnoy
 
Moore is awesome and I hate Rudess. Moore's stuff might be cheesy but at least it sounds sincere while Rudess is a robot.

I don't hate Jordan, but I greatly preferred Moore and even Sherinian. Rudess is too technical and to me rarely plays with feeling; it's as if he writes parts solely to show off. I'm aware that some of that influence may be Petrucci as well, but their entire sound radically changed when Jordan joined. I could never see them making SFAM, for example, with Moore - while a great album, it's far too wanky.

I agree. As soon as they went for a "signature" sound (despite the fact none of them is a good producer), they stopped being really interesting. Though a good album, I consider SFAM to be the beginning of the end (and Octavarium, the first non memorable album).

I couldn't agree more regarding Octavarium. After the excellent Train of Thought, it was a massive letdown.
 
I don't hate Jordan, but I greatly preferred Moore and even Sherinian. Rudess is too technical and to me rarely plays with feeling; it's as if he writes parts solely to show off. I'm aware that some of that influence may be Petrucci as well, but their entire sound radically changed when Jordan joined. I could never see them making SFAM, for example, with Moore - while a great album, it's far too wanky.

I think Rudess' keyboard material on SFAM is quality stuff. The solos on Overture 1928 and Home are the first to come to mind as great and memorable as opposed to some of the newer ones that only come off as wankery.
 
I only really have a problem with Rudess from Systematic Chaos to ADTOE. With the band going increasingly heavy he may have been struggling to find his place in the band, but I think he has it now and I love his playing on the last two albums. His solo toward the end of disc 1 (idk the song name) is one of my favorite moments on Astonishing.


BTW I'd have to go back to check for sure, but there's a demo of Metropolis part 2 from when it was meant to be on FII, with Derek on keyboards. That solo on overture 1928 by Rudess is a note for note transcription of the one Derek plays in that demo if I'm remembering right.
 
BTW I'd have to go back to check for sure, but there's a demo of Metropolis part 2 from when it was meant to be on FII, with Derek on keyboards. That solo on overture 1928 by Rudess is a note for note transcription of the one Derek plays in that demo if I'm remembering right.

I'm gonna have to check that out; thanks for the info!
 

I think I remembered it wrong. Interesting demo either way. I might've been thinking of A Change of Seasons with Moore on keyboards compared to the released version.
 
Had a few scotches, so bear with me...

Having relistened to the first 2 & 1/2 LaBrie albums 5-6 times each over the last couple weeks, I must say: I think Dream Theater reached their artistic peak with Kevin Moore. Creatively, the band still has tons and tons to offer, but I think from an artistic perspective they said and did everything they wanted to say and do on those first couple albums. I know, what's the difference between artistic and creative...? I don't have a definitive answer for you but I believe it has something to do with voicing their souls on a record, putting their purest essence of feelings and ideas into their songwriting. Also, with five members contributing lyrically, we have five very distinct voices that all have to be conveyed via James LaBrie (who doesn't receive near enough credit for bringing the sound of this band together). For instance, on the first few records, we have lyrics coming from the following perspectives:

  • Petrucci - taking his own experiences as a starting point and launching into either a vaguely philosophical or vaguely storytelling mode to complete the song, occasionally with subtle (or not-so-subtle) religious/Christian overtones
  • Portnoy - writing completely about himself, often with incredible obviousness
  • Moore - writing from a very self-centered viewpoint (a la Portnoy), but then twisting all of the lyrics into poetics, symbolism, and emotional grandiosity
  • Myung - using a basic, and very personal, thought to launch into an inspection of humanity, spirituality, and the nature of the world
  • LaBrie - generally there to fill out vocal melodies/rhythms and inform music that is catchy to sing over (re: Caught in a Web/Lie)
Now, we'll wait and see how I feel about the post-Moore albums, because I haven't listened this in-depth...well, ever, but I&W and Awake simply have a depth of authenticity to them that I don't recall existing later in their career.

Also: A Change of Seasons may be the best song they ever recorded. The confluence of concept and sound is perfect and, although it sounds crazy to say about a 23-minute song, the level of restraint and subtlety is admirable for this band.
 
I love the intro of The Mirror. Playing the same riff on guitar for a minute and having drums shape different rhythms is a very interesting approach.
 
An old lady I've met today in the street has stopped me and asked me what the time was. So I looked at my mobile phone (I don't wear a watch lately) and I was completely flabbergasted! It was...

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:D
 
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Honestly I've been putting off updating because the results disgust me <_< Bunch of blasphemers, all of you.
 
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