USA Politics

Well you are correct. And next time you go out, I'll escort you in my Missouri.
 
The problem with prior sanctions were loopholes .. the closes some and is directed at imports as well as money. For example, any ship dealing with N. Korea cannot doc in the US for 180 days and some banking stuff. A key seems to be stop or at least reduce letting technology in there.

The carrot approach never worked with them, that is gone

and most importantly, China is at least somewhat participating

Total solution .. no .. but better than what was there before. Certainly beats them throwing a tantrum, then S Korea and the west giving them something to just shut up for a while
 
True true. They give them something behind the curtains just to STFU, definitely protecting income from investments and tourism. If I was SK I'd give them money just to pretend in front of the world that I don't have a retard neighbour. But it's all a part of the plan anyways, always has been. It's just that Trump is now POTUS, so this has escalated, due to the man not having any sort of political sensibility. NK has wealthy neighbours and they're directly blackmailing them. An indirect blackmail is a trade agreement made by a 'friendly' goverment. Say Russia helps a party to get in power somewhere then the rulers of the country sign heavily profitable agreements with them. Like I said NK isn't playing by the book, they have presentation of a thug. Whether they don't have an option or they're simply like that, doesn't matter much. The world trade/law channels are closed for them. There's no way else to play than street-style.

Anyways the amendments you mentioned will make NK spend a lot more money on operating smuggling. Again it seems logical to me - the Chinese game LC mentioned too - as NK is finalizing it's ICBM program, bitchslaps they get will have to be more and more severe, just for the sake of appearance. But never severe enough to set them back.
 
I really do not disagree with much of that ... the main point is it closed most remaining legal/quasi legal ways of getting stuff in there.

Though I would say primary reasons for escalation are shooting missiles over Japan and nuke testing. I am not sure who is president would have matter at reaching this point now.
 
Yeah, I dunno. I just don't think the Chinese are as up-front about this as they are currently pretending. Although I agree that them showing dissatisfaction with North Korea is a big step (due to the long game mentioned earlier, as well as China's desire to avoid losing face), China remains their largest trading partner. The Chinese illegal drug trade is also still intimately linked with North Korea as one of their primary sources of cash, and that seems unlikely to change, nor does it seem like China is really trying to change that.
 
Plus, when North Korea's current regime does come crashing down, it's going to be a race between the US and China to see who can swoop on the cheap labour and fast food market first.
 
China has extremely strict laws on smuggling. Often there will be someone at the conveyor belt asking you for your luggage tag before you pick it up. I've seen that only in high risk airports in certain situations (at certain times better said), and not even in Frankfurt about a week from Bataclan massacre while they were still hunting for the perpetrators. Point is China takes smuggling seriously and even admitting that they have 1% control over NK smuggling would be highly negative PR for them.

Brigs, don't keep your hopes up for a market rebuild of the country. If regime crashes down, there will be NK internal strife/civil war first. A lot of people are working for Kim dynasty there, millions, and other millions don't like them, or won't like them when they get a grasp of the whole truth. I'm not saying NK is kidnapping 13yo Japanese girls from beaches, cause that's bullshit, but there must be a ton of atrocities Kims did that aren't well known. It's always like that, totalitarian system crumbles, dirty laundry comes out. Even if NK society gets through that, SK and China would be taking millions of refugees who are, at this moment, in NK in immediate danger of hunger or anything else.

20 million "underdeveloped" people in Asia is not exactly a market. Sorry for that word, I don't have any better, you know what I mean. Even if they all were friendly to eachother, peaceful and willing to participate in democracy and market, it's not exactly a big thing, is it? I've been in cities in Asia that have more people than North Korea. Nope, rebuild will have to go on SK's budget, like it went on West Germany. SK will have to invest in reunification, and they're willing to do just like Germans did, when Kim falls.

IMHO, U.S. should publicly complete ignore them, put pressure behind the scenes on China to minimize NK profits done via that channel, and we'll have to wait a decade or two for the thing to crumble down just like Soviet Communism did. Ban your citizens from visiting NK and if they really steal a citizen or allied citizen, extract them ffs.
 
I know I'm not the only one to wonder if Trump is mentally ill. Part of me hopes he isn't, because this would be a very good cop-out for all populist extremists to avoid accountability.
 
Madness, or "divide and rule" politics. Both the handling of the protesting NFL players and the North Korea situation could be examples of this.

With North Korea, it seems like he tries to provoke them into behavior that makes even China react.

On the NFL thing - the attention the initial protester (Kapernick) got would've been over by now, but Trump pours petrol on the fire. Trump may end up alienating even more Americans here, but his fanbase will be even more behind him.
 
Dr. Eddies Wingman said:
On the NFL thing - the attention the initial protester (Kapernick) got would've been over by now
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It was over. Kapernick didn't get signed this year, probably because he was too political. Now the entire player base is going to start protesting to protect the right to protest. Trump loves it, because it gives him more to rail against.
 
LooseCannon said:
Kapernick didn't get signed this year, probably because he was too political.
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That's certainly the case, because while I'm very ignorant about the NFL, I remember Colin Kaepernick being a decent quarterback. He certainly wouldn't be a free agent if he didn't make a political stance.
 
He is not that good .. he had a few good years when surrounded by a really good line, a great running game and defense ... and he could run play actions and be really effective. When the talent around him declined he had a major dropoff and his lack of accuracy was really exposed .. then he was benched (before any of this kneeling stuff) ... he is probably better than some backups in the game, but he is not worth the distraction. If he were Tom Brady good, teams lining up would sign him

Which is pretty common in all sports .. the amount of distraction a team is willing to put up with is directly related to the amount of talent. We could list examples of this all day .. Michael Vick comes to mind .. major distraction, major controversy .. but really good and the Eagles signed him and took a lot of heat for it. The Cowboys last year with Greg Hardy .. same thing .. he turned out to not be as good as he was and he is out of work (domestic violence), Zeke Elliot this year ... and on and on and on.


That said ... on the protests

They have the right to protest for sure ... do they have that right in a workplace .. not as clear cut and some players were carrying that on this season before the Trump speech/tweets, so not really over.

In any case, I am pretty sick of hearing about it ... I watch sports because I enjoy them and they are an escape from crap like this.
 
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bearfan said:
That said ... on the protests

They have the right to protest for sure ... do they have that right in a workplace .. not as clear cut and some players were carrying that on this season before the Trump speech/tweets, so not really over.

In any case, I am pretty sick of hearing about it ... I watch sports because I enjoy them and they are an escape from crap like this.
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I agree that it is nice to have sports as an arena where politics can be put aside. But the initial protest (Kapernick) was triggered by what he felt was unfair treatment of black people - that shouldn't really be divisive, I'd guess most sports fans agree with him that people should be treated fairly.

The one who really made this a truly political issue was the President. And while I think the NFL clubs must be free to fire anyone over conduct they disagree with - fair or not - I think it is way over the line for a political leader, and especially the President, to call for firing of players. I repeat my statement that he is intentionally stoking the fire.
 
Calling on firing of players was over the line for sure ... but prior to that, it was still pretty hot button in the US ... Kapernick took a lot of heat for it ... especially since it pretty much came out of the blue from him. So far as I know that was the first statement he made on the matter. he would have been better off saying what he was going to do and why ahead of time.
 
All this protesting goes on and then it ends and nothing comes of it and life goes on. And things aren't nearly as bad as they claim. If they would stop being offended by stuff that really isn't that offensive, then all of it wouldn't seem to be so much of a problem. Plus, the media really likes to hype it all up and make it seem a lot worse than it really is which doesn't help either. If some really great changes were taking place as result, I could understand them doing all of this, but none of it is helping their cause or situation so maybe they should just stop all it and move on with their lives.
 
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