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The Thin Line Between Love and Hate

Discussion in 'Brave New World' started by Anonymous, Oct 2, 2003.

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How good is The Thin Line Between Love and Hate on a scale of 1-10?

  1. 10

    42.1%
  2. 9

    18.4%
  3. 8

    13.2%
  4. 7

    18.4%
  5. 6

    2.6%
  6. 5

    2.6%
  7. 4

    2.6%
  8. 3

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  9. 2

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  10. 1

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    I see there's a lot of song interpreting going on, which is so cool for a dumb danish fuck like myself [img src=\"style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\" style=\"vertical-align:middle\" emoid=\":p\" border=\"0\" alt=\"tongue.gif\" /] , so how about "The thin line...". Could anyone please give me an interpretation of it. [img src=\"style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/sad.gif\" style=\"vertical-align:middle\" emoid=\":(\" border=\"0\" alt=\"sad.gif\" /]
    It's part of my school project, and I'm just checking if you share my thoughts.
    I think, in basics, that it's about human nature, and how love & hate both are very important feelings to have, to get along with others in our society. ::
    Dumb danish fuck, remember...
     
  2. Maidenaustria

    Maidenaustria Ancient Mariner

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    I guess it's a description how easy a human could move from love to hate.

    "There is evil in some of us.."

    "Someone happy and one sad, just a thin line drawn between"

    Be(a)st regards,
    Maidenaustria
     
  3. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    The lyrics are slightly antithetic to Rousseau's myth of the "good savage" that states that every human being is basically good by nature, and that it's society that perverts them.

    The song states in fact that you can't blame society for all the evils of this world and that some people have an evil streak in them, no matter what. I suppose it's human nature to have both good and bad in us, then it's up to us to decide which part should take over on the other one.

    As another song goes:

    Am I evil?
    Yes I am!
    Am I evil?
    I am man!


    [!--emo&:rock:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/headbang.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'headbang.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
     
  4. Onhell

    Onhell Mexican Revolutionary

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    I agree with both posts, but I like to go deeper into the song (I'm a pain in the ass I know lol) I don't know when your project is due but here it goes: The verses seem to discuss the age old argument in psychology of Nature vs. Nurture. Nature theorist claim you are born good or evil. Nurture people claim a loving family will curve the most evil of desires or a disfunctianal, abusive family would currupt the best of people. Though now most shrinks agree that we are a little bit of both. Only in rare cases does a person from the projects with a crackwhore mother and acoholic father break the cycle and end up being good doctors or counselors and someone from a "good" family end up a homless drug addict. They also discuss the pressures of society such as peer pressure to do drugs or drink alcohol before the legal age. "When a person turns to wrong is it a want to be, belong?". There seems to be a pondering on the mystery of the self "what makes a man decide between the wrong or rightous road?" What does motivate us? only we know. There is a respect for choice and individuality as they claim that we all have the right to choose the path that we want. And hence we can't blame society for we are responsible for our own actions. "we all like to put the blame/ on society these things"
    The chorus is of a more religious nature, as Maverik posted on the commentary of this song, Harris seems to be depicting what happens when you lead a "good" life, your heart dies but your soul lives forever and that he will get there through making his own choices.
     
  5. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    'The Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    Now you can read other visitors' comments on 'The Thin Line Between Love And Hate' as well as post your own. Any contribution to the commentary will be much appreciated, may it be cultural references relevant to the song (links to related websites, interpretations that may have been overlooked in the Commentary, and the like) or personal essays related to the topic of the song. Just be aware that messages that are either off-topic or too wacky may be deleted.
     
  6. Lib

    Lib Ancient Mariner

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    Very good song !

    Maybe the best of the album !

    A very different felling than traditionnal Maiden song : a good end for the album.

    The 6 guitars* part in the middle is amazing ! [!--emo&:bow:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/bowdown.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'bowdown.gif\' /][!--endemo--]

    * 2 for the rythm, 1 for the main riff, 2 for the melody, and 1 for the solo : yeah ! [!--emo&:rock:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/headbang.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'headbang.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
     
  7. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    There are three magnificent epics on Brave New World, Ghost Of The Navigator, Dream Of Mirrors and this one.
    This one is a brilliant showcase of every Maiden trademark: Wonderful guitar solos, inspired and intelligent lyrics, an epic album-closer and, quoting from the Commentary, that "undefinable little something that makes a song special".

    Rating: 5
     
  8. IndianaJones

    IndianaJones Trooper

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    Simply an amazing song. Propably one of the greatest songs ever. It just has unbelieveble feeling! Great guitar melodies and good lyrics. Great guitar solos that (as i belive) are all Dave's. Just correct if im wrong. Great album closer, great song to listen when im going to sleep, great song to listen when waching the sky and heck; great song in every possible way. I just love it. [!--emo&:lol:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/lol[1].gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'lol[1].gif\' /][!--endemo--]
     
  9. dogigniter

    dogigniter Ancient Mariner

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    Truely a brilliant song. Really highlights Bruce's vocal capabilities, almost in the same way as 'Tears of the Dragon' in my opinion.

    Nothing much to add to Onhell's post, good analysis
     
  10. Uwe

    Uwe Trooper

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    Another good song on BNW, but with a different feel to it. But even though I like this song very much, I think it is a bit too long, but that's just a personal opinion. This one sounds a bit more relaxed than the other songs, which makes it the obvious choice as a closing track to a great album.
     
  11. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    I wasnt really keen on this song before, but aftrer listning to it I just realised how amazingly cool it is! It rocks!

    I love the harsh bass, emphasizing the hate, and the cool soft mellow guitar sound emphasizing the love hehe, its really clever!
     
  12. elhefe

    elhefe Trooper

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    a really cool song, not really in the way we expect maiden to be so that maybe makes it quite interesting and enjoyable,(...)I would say more good things bout it but it´s 2 am here and i gotta sleep [!--emo&:p--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'tongue.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
     
  13. Cosmiceddie

    Cosmiceddie Back From The Edge

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    [!--QuoteBegin-Black Ace+Aug 17 2004, 07:33 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Black Ace @ Aug 17 2004, 07:33 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Indeed, a song that makes my heart be full of feelings. And isn't that the purpouse of music? To transmit feelings? The chorus With "I will hope/ My soul will fly" is absolutely great, even with the religious content, and the solo in the middle is just fantastic. I think i voted 4 stars, but it could be 4.5
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    You have hit it!This song is something different, kind of weird for a band like Maiden, yet I do think they should write more songs like that!

    To be brief, Dave Murray outdid himself on both 'The thin Line between Love and Hate' and 'The Nomad'(of course I don't mean to forget Steve being the co-writer).

    In addition I must praise Bruce for one of his best vocal performances ever.
     
  14. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    Hey!! At the end of this song, you hear Nicko saying something and laughing!! I can't figure out what he says. Has anyone heard this before? Please lemme know what he is saying. I am sure it must be something hilarious
     
  15. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    [!--QuoteBegin-UnkownMaidenFan+Jul 16 2005, 05:19 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(UnkownMaidenFan @ Jul 16 2005, 05:19 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Hey!! At the end of this song, you hear Nicko saying something and laughing!! I can't figure out what he says. Has anyone heard this before? Please lemme know what he is saying. I am sure it must be something hilarious
    [snapback]112168[/snapback]​
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    According to the The Iron Maiden Commentary, "right at the end, Nicko can be heard saying: "Awww... I fucking missed it!", as he thought he'd messed the end of the song, although he hadn't."
     
  16. dogigniter

    dogigniter Ancient Mariner

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    Followed by 'Keep that on tape *laughter*'..

    I edited the song I had in Goldwave and cut that bit out and made it louder. Get the WAV file [a href=\'http://www.gorgonzolastoragefacility.buddha.org.uk/nicko_i_missed_it.wav\' target=\'_blank\']here[/a]
     
  17. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    There is one thing that puzzles me about this song. What exactly does the expression "The Thin Line Between Love And Hate" itself mean?
    Is it a reference to the fact that there really is such a thin line, or does it refer to the fact that this line is very thin?

    If the former is the case, then what is that thin line, what is its nature and in what relation do we stand to it?

    We are all seeking for balance in our life. If we tend too much to an extreme of any sort, it is likely that we will never be able to find full happiness. To keep it in this context, feeling only one of two extremes (love or hate) is very unlikely to bring us anywhere.

    Being a hateful person is a bad thing. If you hate everything and everyone, you tend to see everything in a negative way and you will feel uncomfortable with everything. Hatred veils our views of the world in a way that we are unable to see the good things in life, and unable to enjoy anything.

    On the other hand, if we simply "love" everything, this is very likely to make us unhappy as well. If we see everything in a pink light, we will consciously or unconsciously ignore everything that is bad. This way, the problems in the world will go unsolved and grow bigger, and might eventually destroy us all.

    The song points out that we must find a balance between both, that we need to find this "Thin Line", the "Grey space between black and white". There are not two paths, as we might be inclined to think, but three. There is nothing wrong with a bit of hate towards the bad things in this world, but we need enough love to counterbalance it. Likewise, too much love will likely make us lose touch with reality, and we will need some negative feelings to properly fight all the bad in the world. Love is not synonymous with happiness. Often enough, love can make us very unhappy. If we love someone, or something, we are very vulnerable, and if this loved someone or something dies or gets destroyed, this can have terrible consequences to ourselves.

    We are very tempted to go into one extreme, however, as it is much easier than to find the balance, which is a quest we are undergoing all our life, and more often than not, it seems that we are unable to win that struggle.


    On the other hand, this line between love and hate is very thin, indicating that love and hate lie very close together- thus it is very easy to lose the balanced, grey path. Likewise, love can often turn to hate and vice versa. If a loved someone disappoints you in a hurtful manner, it can happen that your deep, positive emotions can turn into deep negative emotions. This can go so far that we are ready to kill someone who we have once loved.

    It gets a bit more complicated the other way around. If we really hate someone, we would never, ever admit that we love them. But it is often the case that once this hated person dies, we feel something missing in ourselves. We "loved to hate" them, and our feelings were very strong. We just never admit, not even to ourselves, that exactly this hatred could actually have been a twisted sort of love.

    On the other hand, this might also be the case with love. The more you love someone, the more you hate some things they do, because they don't comform with the image you have of them, or what you might want them to do.

    Human emotions are a very complicated subject, and I think none of us are even close to comprehend their entire nature.
     
  18. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    [!--QuoteBegin-Perun+Jul 24 2005, 10:06 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Perun @ Jul 24 2005, 10:06 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]The more you love someone, the more you hate some things they do, because they don't comform with the image you have of them, or what you might want them to do.
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    True, with the exception of the premise. Sometimes, when you lose someone you love deeply, you discover how you miss even those little things that you hated before.
    EDIT: How soppy can you get? Disgusting.
     
  19. Onhell

    Onhell Mexican Revolutionary

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    Perun, "The thin line between love and hate" is a saying. It it originates when boys discover that girls don't have cooties after all and girls want to know what is that snake in boy's pants. The start having feelings (whether sexual or emotional) towards the opposite sex, and the unattainablity of that person can turn to frustration or hate. Or on the other hand if they do know the person but don't know how to express the love they feel for that person they demonstrate, and express hate but in reality they like the person.

    It is the basis for every Romantic Comedy out there (One Fine Day with George Clooney and Michelle Pfiefer is a perfect example.) The "I hate you," "I hate you too" turning into " I really love you" "I love you too."
     
  20. Raven

    Raven Ancient Mariner

    'the Thin Line Between Love And Hate'

    Whenever I first heard this song, I wasn't disposed towards it either way (I suppose I was in that 'grey place' [img src=\"style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\" style=\"vertical-align:middle\" emoid=\":p\" border=\"0\" alt=\"tongue.gif\" /]). After listening to it a couple of times right to the end, however, I quickly came to realise what a great song it is. The nice heavy intro has a really brooding feel, and it perfectly leads into the typical rompy Maiden-style verse riff that we are all familiar with. Bruce's vocals shine on this, but not particularly in the verses. That chorus is amazing, and the lyrics are thoughtful and well-written. First solo is wonderfully manic, although I feel that the guitarist (I think it's Dave, I could be wrong) is trying to squeeze too many notes in at once. But from the breakdown onwards, with the soft acoustic section, things just get brilliant. For some reason I always end up listening to this right
    before I go to sleep, and it's deliciously relaxing. Final solo/melody, about 30 seconds from the end, is heartwrenchingly melancholic. Musically, this song is a gorgeous piece of progressive songwriting by Maiden, and a perfect way to round off their (in my opinion) best album of the 90's. This song gets 4.5 stars from me, musically (the first solo being the sole sticking point for me)

    Now, lyrically, as I said, the song is deep. I've decided to look at the lyrics separately and give my opinion on what I think Steve and Dave are trying to convey here.
    Basically, this song is about choice. Freedom of choice is one of the most important gifts given to us by sentience, as we are able to set our moral boundaries and decide for ourselves what is 'wrong and right'. Peer pressure comes into it a great deal, particularly in the first verse:
    When a person turns to wrong, is it a want to be, belong?
    Part of things at any cost, at what price a life is lost

    This is obviously dealing with the idea of crime due to some sense of inferiority in the individual themselves-they aren't doing evil for any reason other than to live up the standards set for them by others-not chosen by themselves (the choice motif returns again)

    Now, Steve and Dave don't pretend to know the answe ('But what makes a man decide, take the wrong or righteous road), but they offer some possibilites.

    We all like to put the blame on society these days
    But what kind of good or bad a new generation brings

    Sometimes take just more than that to survive be good at heart
    There is evil in some of us no matter what will never change


    This is the Nature v. Nurture argument, highlighted by Onhell earlier. Conditions such as ADHD (Attention-deficit Hyperactivity Disorder) are becoming increasingly common among 'problem children', the kind that play truant, take drugs and alcohol at an early age, and listen to Satanic bands like Iron Maiden :: . But is ADHD really a genuine condition in most cases, or is it just the parents trying to convince themselves that there is something medically wrong with their child? Perhaps they are just 'bad at heart', and the blame can be put on no-one, not even the parents (or society). I believe the 'Thin Line' referred to in the song's title and the chorus is a moral boundary, a sort of mental line. Quite often, we can tell when we are doing something wrong, and frequently our ethics will kick into play and we will amend the situation. But sometimes, especially in today's society, the lines get smudged. Consider this: You're driving your car in the centre of town. You stop at traffic lights and an unemployed immigrant begins to wash your car. Do you give ignore him when he asks for money, since you didn't ask for the wash, or do you give him a fiver because he has no choice in what he does? And if you give him the money, will that help him at all?
    Another situation where the boundaries were blurred was the Second World War. The Allied countries convinced their troops of the need to defeat Nazism. However, they didn't communicate the idea that the soldiers on the other side were ordinary people too. What do you do in such a situation? The 'good' thing would be not to fire on an enemy that might have a family just like yours, and be little different from you...or is it? Do you make sacrifices for the so-called 'Greater Good'? In this way, what is individually evil may turn out for the best, globally.
    Or some such crap :: . Yup, that's me bullshitting my way through the murky swamp of misinterperetation again. Oh yes, the chorus. Well, as many people have said, it appears to be religious, but we have to remember that many of Maiden's compositions talk of the afterlife and judgment by a higher power. Perhaps the narrator, knowing what is good and evil, can stick to the 'love' path, and so will gain immortality after he dies?

    Well, that's me done for this dissertation [img src=\"style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\" style=\"vertical-align:middle\" emoid=\":p\" border=\"0\" alt=\"tongue.gif\" /]. On a final note; to me, the lyrics present the following social commentaries:
    1. Good and Evil, although we would like to think differently, are with us from an early age, and can't be removed from a single generation, let alone the entire human race
    2. Doing so would be wrong, as it would remove the freedom of choice of the individuals-choice, whether it is a good or bad choice, is important for life.
    3. That said, we must be careful in our choices, and try to do what is best. Even when the boundaries are blurred, and 'fair is foul and foul is fair', trusting to yourself and making your own choices is the best way to go.
    4. Which is quite similar to the common sense preached by the Bible (yes, the Bible, Perun/Mav/SMX, not the stuck-up fundamentalists who are abundant nowadays), in that helping others and listening to your conscience (what some might call the Holy Spirit...and others Jimminy Cricket) will garuntee you eternal life.
    5. But most importantly, we cannot push our choices and opinions onto others. 'Just a thin line drawn between being a genius or insane or 'One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter, to illustrate the point-there are no clear-cut boundaries today, and such prejudices (like all Heavy Metal bands being devil worshippers) are wrong.

    In fact, the themes discussed in this song somewhat remind me of the themes in 'Age of Innocence', especially the fact that Bruce is singing in a social commentary, from the point of view of an outsider viewing the world today from a semi-neutral standpoint (I say semi-neutral, for the songwriting will always be biased, but quite often several sides of the argument are shown by Stev and co.), similarly to the way Eddie is shown viewing the world from the outside on the cover of 'Out of the Silent Planet'

    P.S. Great-I'm 3/200 of the way there to linking every single Maiden song with every other song... ::
     

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