1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Flight of Icarus and Neo Nazis

Discussion in 'Piece Of Mind' started by IronDuke, Dec 4, 2004.

  1. IronDuke

    IronDuke Ancient Mariner

    The general consensus on this song has always been that it is about the ancient Greek myth of Dedalus. I’m inclined to agree, but upon listening to the song this morning I came up with another interpretation. It may be a bit of a stretch, and I doubt there’s much truth to it, but it’s still interesting.

    The new interpretation I came up with is that it’s about Neo-Nazis. (yeah, lame….I know.) Hear me out.

    [!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]As the sun breaks, above the ground,[/quote]
    The sun represents the rise of a new generation, likely Generation Y (people born between 1979 and 1990). The sunrise is a much-used literary device that symbolizes rebirth, or the start of something new.

    [!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]An old man stands on the hill,[/quote]
    The old man, of course, represents Hitler, or at least his legacy. The Neo-Nazi movement looks to his example for inspiration.

    [!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]As the ground warms, to the first rays of light
    A birdsong shatters the still.[/quote]
    The ground warming represents the impressionable young generation growing up, becoming frustrated with their society. Like Al-Qaeda today, Hitler appealed to impressionable young people who felt they had nothing to lose.
    The bird song could have few interpretations. It could be symbolic of the German Eagle, a symbol the Nazis exploited. The Neo-Nazi movement makes the eagle sing once more.
    Alternatively, from an American perspective, it could be symbolic of the American eagle, which is a symbol of strength, freedom, hope, etc. (yeah, I know a lot of folks who disagree with that, but that’s what is is supposed to symbolize.) The Neo-Nazis are literally making the America cry….it goes against the vision the US was supposed to follow.

    [!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]His eyes are ablaze,
    See the madman in his gaze.[/quote]
    It was said that Hitler had a captivating personality. Albert Speer once wrote that his eyes were Hitler’s best weapon. Simply by staring at someone he could bend them to his will.
    That he was a madman is unquestionable. Look at some photos of him giving speeches…he was batshit insane.

    [!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Fly, on your way, like an eagle,
    Fly as high as the sun,
    On your way, like an eagle,
    Fly and touch the sun.[/quote]
    If you buy my view that the Eagle represents the Nazi Eagle, then it’s easy to see that here that the eagle is trying to “touch the sun”, that is to say it’s trying to touch a new generation to fill them with hate and fear.

    [!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Now the crowd breaks and a young boy appears
    Looks the old man in the eye[/quote]
    Again, we have a young person appearing before the old guy. The Neo-Nazi movement has appeal to disgruntled white youths, and they look to Hitler as a solution to their problems.

    [!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]As he spreads his wings and shouts at the crowd
    In the name of God my father I fly.[/quote]
    Hitler has been elevated to almost god-like status in the Neo-Nazi movement. Even in Nazi Germany, everything was done in his name. The young man is pledging his loyalty to the movement, in the name of Hitler.

    [!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]His eyes seem so glazed
    As he flies on the wings of a dream,[/quote]
    Glazed eyes are a symptom of intoxication (from alcohol, drugs, etc) Neo-Nazi rhetoric is a drug which clouds the vision of its followers. They thrive (fly) on a dream of ‘cleansing’ the world of ‘impure’ blood.

    [!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Now he knows his father betrayed
    Now his wings turn to ashes to ashes his grave.[/quote]
    Hitler always claimed that Germany had been betrayed in 1918, but it was he himself who betrayed his country. He caused Germany to be ruined, much like the lives of young people are ruined by the Neo-Nazis.



    Like I said before, I don’t really give much credence to this interpretation, but it’s still fun to make the case. The problem (or perhaps the beauty) with a song like this is that it relies so heavily on imagery and symbolism, leaving it open to multiple analyses.

    I’d appreciate any feedback on this.

    Duke.
     
  2. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    And I thought some of MY interpretations were a bit wacky... [!--emo&:blink:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
     
  3. LooseCannon

    LooseCannon Yorktown-class aircraft carrier Staff Member

  4. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    [!--QuoteBegin-Maverick+Dec 4 2004, 06:34 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Maverick @ Dec 4 2004, 06:34 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]And I thought some of MY interpretations were a bit wacky...   [!--emo&:blink:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
    [snapback]92824[/snapback]​
    [/quote]
    I second that...

    Are you bored LC?
    Anyway, it seems you had fun writing that, but could we hope you'll stop smoking funny weeds before connecting to Maidenfans.com?
     
  5. SinisterMinisterX

    SinisterMinisterX Illuminatus Staff Member

    [!--QuoteBegin-Le Hibou - The Owl+Dec 4 2004, 11:14 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Le Hibou - The Owl @ Dec 4 2004, 11:14 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Are you bored LC?
    Anyway, it seems you had fun writing that...
    [snapback]92826[/snapback]​
    [/quote]
    Technically, the Duke wrote that. [!--emo&:p--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'tongue.gif\' /][!--endemo--]

    Wacky? Yes.
    Probably wrong? Yes.
    Entirely wrong? Maybe not... the idea of this song being about 2 generations has been brought up before, I think.
     
  6. Black Ace

    Black Ace Trooper

    Well, Ironduke has a creative and rather rested mind, to cfome up with such an explanation [!--emo&:p--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'tongue.gif\' /][!--endemo--]. Well, he has a point. It makes some sense to me. Just a reminder, The Nazis created (actually it was a woman who was in love with Hitler who did it, but still) what is considered the most effective propaganda movie of the last cenutry. Also, related to Hitler's personality and charisma, I recall watching a documentary in which an elderly german who witnessed one of Hitlers speeches said that he was so impressed with him that he was ready to swear a life and death allegiance to him. The second day, he saw the speech in a newspaper, he read it, but he said he didn't feel anything of the kind he felt in front of Hitler. This is all presented as somethign to say that IronDuke could not be entirely wrong
     
  7. Iron Farmer

    Iron Farmer Trooper

    Black Ace >>> The "matter" (but there isn't really a matter) is not here, Friend. All that Iron Duke said about Nazis and Hitler is true. But can such an explanation be apply on the song ? (hu... [!--emo&:huh:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/huh.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'huh.gif\' /][!--endemo--] not sure of my last sentence. Sorry guys, I'm not a good english writer [!--emo&:(--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/sad.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'sad.gif\' /][!--endemo--])

    Anyway, Iron Duke, your interpretation is good and makes sence. But as I said before, not sure it sticks to the song... but maybe ? But it was very interesting.

    To finish, and there is no direct link with what Iron Duke said, I often wonder why God the Lord appears in the song. God in Antic Greece ? [!--emo&:blink:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]


    (Really really sorry for mistakes friends, don't hesitate to correct me, it will be an help for me [!--emo&:D--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/biggrin.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'biggrin.gif\' /][!--endemo--])
     
  8. IronDuke

    IronDuke Ancient Mariner

    [!--QuoteBegin-Iron Farmer+Dec 4 2004, 04:32 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Iron Farmer @ Dec 4 2004, 04:32 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Black Ace >>> The "matter" (but there isn't really a matter) is not here, Friend. All that Iron Duke said about Nazis and Hitler is true. But can such an explanation be apply on the song ? (hu... [!--emo&:huh:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/huh.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'huh.gif\' /][!--endemo--] not sure of my last sentence. Sorry guys, I'm not a good english writer [!--emo&:(--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/sad.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'sad.gif\' /][!--endemo--])

    Anyway, Iron Duke, your interpretation is good and makes sence. But as I said before, not sure it sticks to the song... but maybe ? But it was very interesting.

    To finish, and there is no direct link with what Iron Duke said, I often wonder why God the Lord appears in the song. God in Antic Greece ? [!--emo&:blink:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
    (Really really sorry for mistakes friends, don't hesitate to correct me, it will be an help for me [!--emo&:D--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/biggrin.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'biggrin.gif\' /][!--endemo--])
    [snapback]92840[/snapback]​
    [/quote]


    That was pretty good for someone whose first language is obviously not English. I understood it!


    About there being a reference to God in Ancient Greece, that's a very valid point. I think the song isn't about Icarus and Dedalus themselves, but rather symbolic of them. Rather like how Renaissance artists would combine their Christianity and their passion for the Ancient World.....I dunno.

    For those who didn't pick up on what I was trying to say above: I don't agree with the Neo-Nazi interpretation, I just wanted to point out how loaded songs like this are with abstracts (imagery, symbolism, etc)

    Compare songs like Flight of Icarus or Wasted Years to songs like Tailgunner and Alexander the Great.

    The first two are open to many interpretations, while the second two are pretty concrete.
     
  9. Iron Farmer

    Iron Farmer Trooper

    [!--QuoteBegin--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]For those who didn't pick up on what I was trying to say above: I don't agree with the Neo-Nazi interpretation, I just wanted to point out how loaded songs like this are with abstracts (imagery, symbolism, etc)[/quote]
    Oh, ok. If it was "only" that, you reached your objective. I think your interpretation is very good, all you said is directly linked to the lyrics. Good job ! [!--emo&:D--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/biggrin.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'biggrin.gif\' /][!--endemo--]

    For God... Dunno... [!--emo&:huh:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/huh.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'huh.gif\' /][!--endemo--]... But... I already said it, no ? [!--emo&^_^--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/happy.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'happy.gif\' /][!--endemo--] Anyway, there are some liberties taken from the original story, like the crowd. So, maybe you are right.
    But for me, and I don't no why, because after all it is a prove that the band is creative (or maybe it was just to fill the blanks in the lyrics, hey [!--emo&:lol:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/lol[1].gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'lol[1].gif\' /][!--endemo--]), it's a little disappointement that the song doesn't really sticks to the "original".

    [!--QuoteBegin-IronDuke+Dec 5 2004, 02:46 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(IronDuke @ Dec 5 2004, 02:46 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]That was pretty good for someone whose first language is obviously not English. I understood it![/quote]
    Thanks a lot [!--emo&:)--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/smile.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'smile.gif\' /][!--endemo--] My english teachers don't recognize me anymore since I listen Heavy Metal [!--emo&:lol:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/lol[1].gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'lol[1].gif\' /][!--endemo--]
     
  10. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    [!--QuoteBegin-SinisterMinisterX+Dec 4 2004, 08:16 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(SinisterMinisterX @ Dec 4 2004, 08:16 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]Technically, the Duke wrote that. [!--emo&:p--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/tongue.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'tongue.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
    [/quote]

    Right... It seems I am totally out of my mind here...
    As you've noticed, I haven't post a lot since some times... and maybe it is for the best, don't you think ?
     
  11. Still Life

    Still Life Trooper

    Hehe, I think it IS about neo-nazis! Or something to that affect. Because it probably isnt about the original Icarus and Dedalus, at least I hope not. Maiden has more sense than to put things like crowds and stuff into that story. I think if it actually was about the original dudes, it would stick closer to the story. The neo nazi theory makes alot of sense to me. And it actually isnt supporting the nazis in any way if you read Iron Dukes post a little more carefully. In the end it totally shows how fucked-in-the-ass the neo-nazis are. I almost got sucked into their world about a year ago. I shaved my head and shit, but luckily I saw how lame and stupid it was before becoming totally brainwashed. The song makes alot of sense to me with that interpretation. Like how the youth is in the end let down, that is totally true. So I think it is a marvelous way to look at the song, and quite possible true!


    P.S-I am not racist in any way, shape or form, but a while back I just needed to belong to something, and I was pissed off, and hateful. So what they had goin sounded good, but trust me, it aint.
     
  12. Shadow

    Shadow Deluxe Edition Staff Member

    “I wanted to write a song which was about the way a lot of people are dominated by their parents. Icarus’ father was a pretty weird guy who made him fly. A lot of us go through life in a dream state. I’m for expanding the capacities of the human mind. So many of the menial things can be handled by computers- we don’t really need to physically evolve anymore.” - Bruce Dickinson. Also posted on the first page of the Flight of Icarus poll topic.

    Hope that clears it up a bit.
     
  13. Onhell

    Onhell Mexican Revolutionary

    [!--QuoteBegin-Black Ace+Dec 4 2004, 07:08 PM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Black Ace @ Dec 4 2004, 07:08 PM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--]. Just a reminder, The Nazis created (actually it was a woman who was in love with Hitler who did it, but still) what is considered the most effective propaganda movie of the last cenutry.
    [snapback]92835[/snapback]​
    [/quote]
    I think you are reffering to "Triumph of the Will" which is a very good documentary. reminds me of many American parades actually [!--emo&:D--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/biggrin.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'biggrin.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
     
  14. IronDuke

    IronDuke Ancient Mariner

    [!--QuoteBegin-Still Life+Dec 6 2004, 01:51 AM--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Still Life @ Dec 6 2004, 01:51 AM)[/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--QuoteEBegin--] P.S-I am not racist in any way, shape or form, but a while back I just needed to belong to something, and I was pissed off, and hateful. So what they had goin sounded good, but trust me, it aint.
    [snapback]92934[/snapback]​
    [/quote]


    That's exactly how Hitler was able to seduce a generation of Germans into following his sick ideas. Glad to see you're one of the good guys, mate.
     
  15. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    All I can say is interesting.

    For an added twist, in the video, Adrian Smith is wearing a t-shirt with a Confederate Flag on it. Neo-Nazi's always have Confederate Flags at their rallies. Although that is the flag of the Confederate Navy, it is generally considered to be "The Confederate Flag" and recognised as a symbol of hate (I don't think so).
     
  16. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Fantastic, Duke. Maybe Steve and the boys did intend this song to have a double meaning. I wonder what they'd think if they read this.
     
  17. Raven

    Raven Ancient Mariner

    Once again, I think we're just adding meanings which aren't there to songs we like because we're REALLY bored. Technically, though, your interperetation isn't that far off from what Bruce meant it to be about. At its heart, it's a song about freedom of youth, delusion, facism and betrayal in life. And the song isn't really based on the Greek myth, 7th Death, it's more a metaphor. After all, are the names of Icarus and Daedalus mentioned anywhere in the actual body of the song? The title was probably written after the song was finished.
     
  18. Well, it gave me a good laugh.

    Neo-Nazis?

    But then, I played 'Two Minutes To Midnight' to my friend and he thought it was all about a clock. [!--emo&:blink:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
     
  19. IronDuke

    IronDuke Ancient Mariner

    I didn't think this well-thought out and clearly articulated piece of fine literary scholarship would still be around after this long. Somebody needs to post some more whackiness.
     
  20. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    [!--quoteo(post=127000:date=Jan 14 2006, 07:15 PM:name=Pineapple Hunter)--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Pineapple Hunter @ Jan 14 2006, 07:15 PM) [snapback]127000[/snapback][/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--quotec--]But then, I played 'Two Minutes To Midnight' to my friend and he thought it was all about a clock. ::
    [/quote]
    Well it is, somehow. The Doomsday Clock. [img src=\"style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/happy.gif\" style=\"vertical-align:middle\" emoid=\"^_^\" border=\"0\" alt=\"happy.gif\" /]
     

Share This Page