The_7th_Son
Ancient Mariner
I've never really looked into the topic of Charlotte. Was it one of the band member's girlfriends or friends?
Charlotte the Harlot
- Thread starter The_7th_Son
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A
Anonymous
Guest
'charlotte The Harlot'
As far as I know, Charlotte is fictional. But this topic allows me to add onto the thread; was Hooks In You an extension of the series or not? Cos Charlotte the Harlot and From Here to Eternity obviously were, though Hooks In You seems a bit ambiguous.
As far as I know, Charlotte is fictional. But this topic allows me to add onto the thread; was Hooks In You an extension of the series or not? Cos Charlotte the Harlot and From Here to Eternity obviously were, though Hooks In You seems a bit ambiguous.
Onhell
Infinite Dreamer
'charlotte The Harlot'
Do you guys ever read the commentaries? Charlotte the Harlot, 22 Acacia Avenue and From Here to Eternity are the Charlotte saga (or trilogy). Also, If you notice Maiden makes a lot of refrences to the Bilble's Book of Revelations and Charlotte is just one of them.
Do you guys ever read the commentaries? Charlotte the Harlot, 22 Acacia Avenue and From Here to Eternity are the Charlotte saga (or trilogy). Also, If you notice Maiden makes a lot of refrences to the Bilble's Book of Revelations and Charlotte is just one of them.
'charlotte The Harlot'
It also said in "Run to the Hills" the biography of Maiden that Charlotte is based on someone Dave Murray knew, but he ain't telling.
It also said in "Run to the Hills" the biography of Maiden that Charlotte is based on someone Dave Murray knew, but he ain't telling.
'charlotte The Harlot'
What the hell? Destroys it? The song isn't to lament her, it's to show how so many women have been forced to sell their bodies to survive. Dave's probably written it about someone he knew who was so poor she had to sell sex to live.
Okay, prostitution is in some parts of the world an acceptable enterprise, and I think it could be viable if government regulated. Having said that, most of it ISN'T! There's a poem about women who whore, and I can't remember what it is called, I will ask my English Prof next time I see her, but it is good. These women are tortured, most of 'em, and hate themselves. There's no HONOUR in being in a Maiden song. It's one of society's shames, not something to idolize.
Don't look at Charlotte as a lucky girl, feel bad for her because she didn't have everything we all do.
What the hell? Destroys it? The song isn't to lament her, it's to show how so many women have been forced to sell their bodies to survive. Dave's probably written it about someone he knew who was so poor she had to sell sex to live.
Okay, prostitution is in some parts of the world an acceptable enterprise, and I think it could be viable if government regulated. Having said that, most of it ISN'T! There's a poem about women who whore, and I can't remember what it is called, I will ask my English Prof next time I see her, but it is good. These women are tortured, most of 'em, and hate themselves. There's no HONOUR in being in a Maiden song. It's one of society's shames, not something to idolize.
Don't look at Charlotte as a lucky girl, feel bad for her because she didn't have everything we all do.
'charlotte The Harlot'
Gotta agree with Cannon. Prostituion is bad for all involved. The women may enter the business willingly, but only as a last resort. It degrades them, and marks them for the rest of their lives. Those who solicite prostitutes run the risk of contracting an STD, ruining their family, or worse.
It is one of mankind's greatest tragedies. I'm by no stretch a bastion of virtue myself, but I think anyone who looks at the statistics for 'harlots' in most Western countries will see some disturbing trends:
-their rates of STDs are astronomical (an occupational hazzard?)
-they are murdered at much higher rates
- perhaps most troubling, their suicide rates are nearly 3x that of people with 'acceptable' jobs.
Anyone who says that prostitution is cool, an honour, or anything like it can contact me for a nice hot cup of STFU.
Gotta agree with Cannon. Prostituion is bad for all involved. The women may enter the business willingly, but only as a last resort. It degrades them, and marks them for the rest of their lives. Those who solicite prostitutes run the risk of contracting an STD, ruining their family, or worse.
It is one of mankind's greatest tragedies. I'm by no stretch a bastion of virtue myself, but I think anyone who looks at the statistics for 'harlots' in most Western countries will see some disturbing trends:
-their rates of STDs are astronomical (an occupational hazzard?)
-they are murdered at much higher rates
- perhaps most troubling, their suicide rates are nearly 3x that of people with 'acceptable' jobs.
Anyone who says that prostitution is cool, an honour, or anything like it can contact me for a nice hot cup of STFU.
'charlotte The Harlot'
To continue IronDuke's litany of the problems prostitutes suffer:
Many (if not most) have severe alcohol and drug problems.
I've been in alcohol/drug recovery for over a decade, and I'd say at least a third of the women I've met through those channels have hooked at one time or another. And every one of them regretted it deeply.
To continue IronDuke's litany of the problems prostitutes suffer:
Many (if not most) have severe alcohol and drug problems.
I've been in alcohol/drug recovery for over a decade, and I'd say at least a third of the women I've met through those channels have hooked at one time or another. And every one of them regretted it deeply.
A
Anonymous
Guest
'charlotte The Harlot'
well i wood think they probably wood regret it i mean who wood want to sell there body as a sex toy for probably a mear i dunno from 10$ to 70$
i think it's just wrong but i mean they might have needed the money for something important... prostitution is a thing no women should have to go through or even think of going through...
(at least thats what i think) it's sad to see all those women as sex toys [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/sad.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'sad.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
well i wood think they probably wood regret it i mean who wood want to sell there body as a sex toy for probably a mear i dunno from 10$ to 70$
i think it's just wrong but i mean they might have needed the money for something important... prostitution is a thing no women should have to go through or even think of going through...
(at least thats what i think) it's sad to see all those women as sex toys [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/sad.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'sad.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
'charlotte The Harlot'
What's sad is that people actually use this service. The objectification of women is a SERIOUS problem in pop culture. One of the reasons I hate pop culture is that it has this huge problem with sexing women up. Popular role models like Britney Spears, Christina Agulera, Beyonce Knowles, etc, claim that they do not use sex to sell. What the hell? Covers with skantily clad women, music videos that showcase dry humping and these supposed idols wearing less than a cubic foot of cloth?
And not all these pop artists are forced to do this. Christina Agulera has a beautiful voice, and didn't need to do this "sexing up".
And it doesn't stop with the women. Hip-hop, rap, and alternative rock has an increasing trend to objectify women as "hos" and "bitches" and it scares the bejesus out of me. Kids who grow up inundated by this blatent degradation of women have a very violent attitude towards girls. Girls themselves feel the need to meet this new standard and when they aren't received like they picture their pop diva idols they understandably have their self esteem crushed. These social inequalities are part of what leads to the demand for prostitution.
What's sad is that people actually use this service. The objectification of women is a SERIOUS problem in pop culture. One of the reasons I hate pop culture is that it has this huge problem with sexing women up. Popular role models like Britney Spears, Christina Agulera, Beyonce Knowles, etc, claim that they do not use sex to sell. What the hell? Covers with skantily clad women, music videos that showcase dry humping and these supposed idols wearing less than a cubic foot of cloth?
And not all these pop artists are forced to do this. Christina Agulera has a beautiful voice, and didn't need to do this "sexing up".
And it doesn't stop with the women. Hip-hop, rap, and alternative rock has an increasing trend to objectify women as "hos" and "bitches" and it scares the bejesus out of me. Kids who grow up inundated by this blatent degradation of women have a very violent attitude towards girls. Girls themselves feel the need to meet this new standard and when they aren't received like they picture their pop diva idols they understandably have their self esteem crushed. These social inequalities are part of what leads to the demand for prostitution.
A
Anonymous
Guest
'charlotte The Harlot'
^Totally agree. But it's not totally pop culture that does it - though admittedly it's much more magnified there. We all know of the Miss Metal incident. Take the rough with the smooth..
^Totally agree. But it's not totally pop culture that does it - though admittedly it's much more magnified there. We all know of the Miss Metal incident. Take the rough with the smooth..
A
Anonymous
Guest
'charlotte The Harlot'
don't laugh at me or anything what is the miss metal incident [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blush.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blush.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
i want to know.... and we still have to know that is they're choice to be in that kind of business.. whether they like the attention or if they need the money it was they're choice all along... even if she was driven there by pain and suffering....
And back to the subject about the songs they are in it's not bad say that being in that kind of business is a wrong thing but to tell people they want them (like ludacris has a song called area codes and it's " i got hoes, i got hoes, in different area codes" why would a human love such a thing (it's just sickens me) [!--emo&:eww:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/ed_barf[1].gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'ed_barf[1].gif\' /][!--endemo--]
don't laugh at me or anything what is the miss metal incident [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/blush.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'blush.gif\' /][!--endemo--]i want to know.... and we still have to know that is they're choice to be in that kind of business.. whether they like the attention or if they need the money it was they're choice all along... even if she was driven there by pain and suffering....
And back to the subject about the songs they are in it's not bad say that being in that kind of business is a wrong thing but to tell people they want them (like ludacris has a song called area codes and it's " i got hoes, i got hoes, in different area codes" why would a human love such a thing (it's just sickens me) [!--emo&:eww:--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/ed_barf[1].gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'ed_barf[1].gif\' /][!--endemo--]
'charlotte The Harlot'
The Miss Metal incident occured when Miss Metal of some year danced for Bruce and he ripped her top off. She sued and it was settled out of court, if memory serves.
And you don't seem to understand a lot about prostitution, do you, Death Dealer? In fact, you seem mostly oblivious. These days the greatest centre of prostitution is in the Far East. Bangkok, Thailand has been transformed into a carnal pit since the arrival of US soldiers there to fight the Vietnam War. The sex trade there is massive. Girls are kidnapped from their home at age 12 and forced to have sex, perform sex acts, and in some cases are even sold as sex slaves to rich businessmen.
The result is a massive increase in the AIDS epidemic, teen (and even pre-teen) pregnancy, and the destruction of family life. Women in these areas are no longer humans: they are property.
Yes, prostitution is not as severe in developed nations. THIS DOES NOT MAKE IT GOOD. Women forced to sell themselves don't make a choice aside from that we all make: do or die. These are women who can't survive on their own. There's no money for them to do so, I know you live in Canada (like myself) and so you might have these illusions of welfare making it okay, and it doesn't. Social assistance even here isn't even close to enough to cover the day-to-day expenses of a single mother. Imagine what it's like in more capitialist nations, such as our great southern neighbour?
The comparison can be made to the man fighting a war: kill or be killed. In this case it's make some money any way you can, or die. It's a hell hole from which they cannot escape. A woman with a reputation as a working girl cannot get out. They sink into depression, which most of the time involves alcohol and drug abuse. This of course leads to the increased demand for money, which leads to more prostitution. It's a cycle.
Not to mention that it's an inherently dangerous business. Johns, afraid of being found out by jealous wives, off their prostitutes. A woman who tries to leave the business is just as likely to get killed by their pimp as they are to escape. These women end up in jail and in rehab. Those who do escape lose years, decades, of their lives. It's not a choice. Don't be fooled by all the shit on Jerry Springer "My daughter's a whore" or whatever episode you might see. That's nonsense. Prostitution is a social problem that exists below the cracks in our society. It's like a pool of sewage. You never go in willingly, and once you fall in, it's almost impossible to get clean again.
The Miss Metal incident occured when Miss Metal of some year danced for Bruce and he ripped her top off. She sued and it was settled out of court, if memory serves.
And you don't seem to understand a lot about prostitution, do you, Death Dealer? In fact, you seem mostly oblivious. These days the greatest centre of prostitution is in the Far East. Bangkok, Thailand has been transformed into a carnal pit since the arrival of US soldiers there to fight the Vietnam War. The sex trade there is massive. Girls are kidnapped from their home at age 12 and forced to have sex, perform sex acts, and in some cases are even sold as sex slaves to rich businessmen.
The result is a massive increase in the AIDS epidemic, teen (and even pre-teen) pregnancy, and the destruction of family life. Women in these areas are no longer humans: they are property.
Yes, prostitution is not as severe in developed nations. THIS DOES NOT MAKE IT GOOD. Women forced to sell themselves don't make a choice aside from that we all make: do or die. These are women who can't survive on their own. There's no money for them to do so, I know you live in Canada (like myself) and so you might have these illusions of welfare making it okay, and it doesn't. Social assistance even here isn't even close to enough to cover the day-to-day expenses of a single mother. Imagine what it's like in more capitialist nations, such as our great southern neighbour?
The comparison can be made to the man fighting a war: kill or be killed. In this case it's make some money any way you can, or die. It's a hell hole from which they cannot escape. A woman with a reputation as a working girl cannot get out. They sink into depression, which most of the time involves alcohol and drug abuse. This of course leads to the increased demand for money, which leads to more prostitution. It's a cycle.
Not to mention that it's an inherently dangerous business. Johns, afraid of being found out by jealous wives, off their prostitutes. A woman who tries to leave the business is just as likely to get killed by their pimp as they are to escape. These women end up in jail and in rehab. Those who do escape lose years, decades, of their lives. It's not a choice. Don't be fooled by all the shit on Jerry Springer "My daughter's a whore" or whatever episode you might see. That's nonsense. Prostitution is a social problem that exists below the cracks in our society. It's like a pool of sewage. You never go in willingly, and once you fall in, it's almost impossible to get clean again.
'charlotte The Harlot'
There most definitely does (or did at one time) exist a person who inspired this song. I've seen quotes from Steve at least alluding to this person, and I'm sure other band members have said something as well. However, the band has never said anything further about the 'real Charlotte' - in fact, the Steve quote I remember said something like "She is real, and that's all I'm ever going to say so don't ask me any more."
Having said that, it is possible for a real person to inspire a song, and yet the song can be different from the person. For example, my band plays a song called "Downhill" which is inspired by a real alcoholic, but the song developed in such a way as to be about a fictional character. Maybe "Charlotte the Harlot" is similar. We'll never know...
There most definitely does (or did at one time) exist a person who inspired this song. I've seen quotes from Steve at least alluding to this person, and I'm sure other band members have said something as well. However, the band has never said anything further about the 'real Charlotte' - in fact, the Steve quote I remember said something like "She is real, and that's all I'm ever going to say so don't ask me any more."
Having said that, it is possible for a real person to inspire a song, and yet the song can be different from the person. For example, my band plays a song called "Downhill" which is inspired by a real alcoholic, but the song developed in such a way as to be about a fictional character. Maybe "Charlotte the Harlot" is similar. We'll never know...
Atvarussmak
Trooper
'charlotte The Harlot'
Of course shes a hooker. The old english word "Harlot" means Prostitute.
Of course shes a hooker. The old english word "Harlot" means Prostitute.
'charlotte The Harlot'
It might not be as obvious in this song, but go listen to 22 Acacia Avenue. That should lay all doubts to rest.
It might not be as obvious in this song, but go listen to 22 Acacia Avenue. That should lay all doubts to rest.
A
Anonymous
Guest
'charlotte The Harlot'
Now you can read other visitors' comments on '[a href=\'http://www.maidenfans.com/imc/index.php?url=album01_ironmaiden/commentary01_ironmaiden〈=eng&link=albums#track8\' target=\'_blank\']Charlotte The Harlot[/a]' as well as post your own. Any contribution to the commentary will be much appreciated, may it be cultural references relevant to the song (links to related websites, interpretations that may have been overlooked in the Commentary, and the like) or personal essays related to the topic of the song. Just be aware that messages that are either off-topic or too wacky may be deleted.
Now you can read other visitors' comments on '[a href=\'http://www.maidenfans.com/imc/index.php?url=album01_ironmaiden/commentary01_ironmaiden〈=eng&link=albums#track8\' target=\'_blank\']Charlotte The Harlot[/a]' as well as post your own. Any contribution to the commentary will be much appreciated, may it be cultural references relevant to the song (links to related websites, interpretations that may have been overlooked in the Commentary, and the like) or personal essays related to the topic of the song. Just be aware that messages that are either off-topic or too wacky may be deleted.
Maidenfreak
Ancient Mariner
'charlotte The Harlot'
awesome chorus! Of course, the topic is a bit cheesy, but we all enjoy a bit of cheese here and there, don't we? And the great song makes up for the lyrics easily. A classic, I hope they'll dig that one out for the next tour. Would be fun, don't you think? [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/wink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'wink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]
4 stars
awesome chorus! Of course, the topic is a bit cheesy, but we all enjoy a bit of cheese here and there, don't we? And the great song makes up for the lyrics easily. A classic, I hope they'll dig that one out for the next tour. Would be fun, don't you think? [!--emo&
--][img src=\'style_emoticons/[#EMO_DIR#]/wink.gif\' border=\'0\' style=\'vertical-align:middle\' alt=\'wink.gif\' /][!--endemo--]4 stars