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MrKnickerbocker said:
Those two situations can literally not be compared.

If drum heads were vocal notes, Mangini hits all of them. He just doesn't hit them the way you like. Blaze couldn't hit 70% of Bruce's notes.
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Mangini (and in my opinion, Rudess too) is to Dream Theater what Ripper Owens was to Judas Priest. Getting a better player technically does not necessarily make the music better (the same goes for Nightwish with Hietala). On the contrary, Blaze was definitely not as good as Bruce on many levels: vocally, on stage and -most of the time- lyric wise.
 
Black Bart said:
Mangini (and in my opinion, Rudess too) is to Dream Theater what Ripper Owens was to Judas Priest. Getting a better player technically does not necessarily make the music better (the same goes for Nightwish with Hietala). On the contrary, Blaze was definitely not as good as Bruce on many levels: vocally, on stage and -most of the time- lyric wise.
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Are you saying that Ripper is better than Halford and Marco is worse than Nightwish's original bassist? I don't listen to Priest, but I'll throw down the ring and fight over how much better Nightwish's music is because of Marco.
 
I think he is. But apart from the singers (where it's just way too big a minefield), all changes in NW have been for the better. Both Nevalainen -> Hahto and Vänskä -> Hietala.
 
MrKnickerbocker said:
Are you saying that Ripper is better than Halford and Marco is worse than Nightwish's original bassist? I don't listen to Priest, but I'll throw down the ring and fight over how much better Nightwish's music is because of Marco.
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Well, Ripper was basically as proficient as Halford technically and younger. The Jugulator and Demolition songs are what they are because Tipton and Downing wanted them to sound like that.

On a more subjective level, yes: to my mind, although Marco Hietala plays the bass better than the person he replaced, the last interesting Nightwish recording is Wishmaster. Since then, their music has been "roadrunnered". Same thing with DT. To put it bluntly :)
 
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CriedWhenBrucieLeft said:
I think Maiden would fall apart if Eddie called it a day.
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To my surprise, nobody (I hope I'm not wrong) has mentionned Rod. I know that him quitting the business would not alter Maiden's music, but I've always wondered if Steve would continue without one of his more ancient partner and a person whose contribution to he band's success is so important.
 
harrisdevot said:
Don't you think that only dedicated Maiden fans see him this way ?
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Not really. There's always a percentage of the crowd, especially at festivals, who are sightseers and don't know a huge amount about the band. Maiden-with-some-other-singer would still be a kind of draw, but not as big a one, especially when Maiden are getting old and less representative of young, modern music. There's a risk of really getting into cabaret act territory.

harrisdevot said:
To my surprise, nobody (I hope I'm not wrong) has mentionned Rod. I know that him quitting the business would not alter Maiden's music, but I've always wondered if Steve would continue without one of his more ancient partner and a person whose contribution to he band's success is so important.
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Rod has very much established Phantom Music Management to follow his ethos. As far as I can see a lot of day-to-day work is done by the MD, Dave Shack (another Yorkshireman!) anyway. I've no doubt Phantom would continue in this vein if Rod retired fully.
 
At this stage, the band is right up there with family, cash flow, food, air, continued heart beat.... I listen to at least three/ four maiden songs every single day. AT LEAST that many. I read this thread and seek Maiden news every day. ...
One member retiring won't stop me. It would hurt emotionally. But the fanatasism would remain. Of course if I had to jettison one member it is Jan. And as much as I love the guy, and want him to stay, it's not close. Any other member leaving would keep me up at night in tears for a stretch. But any 3 man combo of the guys id say is still maiden. A watered down version, but still Maiden.
Here's one. Which is more Maiden?;

1: Steve,Dave, Janick and three quality newbies...
2: Bruce, Adrian, Nicko and three of the above ?
 
On sonics alone, as lyrics are interpreted from a myriad of perspectives;

Dave - heart
Steve - spirit
Adrian - sex
Bruce - fun
Nicko - thought
Janick - mod

I think Dave & Steve are irreplaceable.
 
bornless1 said:
At this stage, the band is right up there with family, cash flow, food, air, continued heart beat.... I listen to at least three/ four maiden songs every single day. AT LEAST that many. I read this thread and seek Maiden news every day. ...
One member retiring won't stop me. It would hurt emotionally. But the fanatasism would remain. Of course if I had to jettison one member it is Jan. And as much as I love the guy, and want him to stay, it's not close. Any other member leaving would keep me up at night in tears for a stretch. But any 3 man combo of the guys id say is still maiden. A watered down version, but still Maiden.
Here's one. Which is more Maiden?;

1: Steve (1),Dave (2), Janick (3) and three quality newbies...
2: Bruce, Adrian, Nicko and three of the above ?
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Bruce, Adrian, Nicko and three of the above? That's Bruce, Adrian, Nicko, Steve, Dave, Janick.
 
The most important members soundwise are probably Steve and Nicko. And then Dave. The three other members could be replaced and Maiden could still go on make great music and still have the Maiden-sound. Commercially it wouldn't go well without Bruce though.
 
Poto said:
The most important members soundwise are probably Steve and Nicko. And then Dave. The three other members could be replaced and Maiden could still go on make great music and still have the Maiden-sound. Commercially it wouldn't go well without Bruce though.
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...I love Nicko and I think he contributes a lot to Maiden's sound, but he (and sadly probably Janick) are the least important "soundwise" to the band at this point.
 
Two of the most unique aspects of Nicko's drumming are his single foot technicque and the excessive use of ride cymbal. Not a lot of people do that. Nicko can cover Hendrix, Zeppelin or other acts, but you hear him instantly.
 
This is how I'd rank them in order of importance (musically, if we're talking commercially Bruce is #1):

1: Steve
2: Bruce
3: Nicko
4: Adrian
5: Janick
6: Dave
 
Dave at 6 looks odd. I know he doesn't write many songs but imagine a Maiden concert without (the sound of) Dave? Did not happen since the seventies.
 
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