USA Politics
- Thread starter Genghis Khan
- Start date
I actually don't know if President Trump would make it to 2020 before pulling a Palin and resigning. Clinton will likely be so unpopular in 2020 that she has to pull an LBJ and just disappear. Might work out for Tim Kaine, might not.
Johnson was the most recent, if memory serves.
Absolutely. Paul Ryan in particular is very popular and a much better politician now than in 2012. He would've wiped the floor with Trump and could've likely won the election. When a contested convention was still in the air the assumption was that they'd call on Paul Ryan to be the nominee. The Republicans really screwed up this year. There are so many candidates who could very well destroy Hillary. The fact that Trump is even close in polling numbers right now speaks to that.
But it's also worth noting that the insane number of candidates in the primaries didn't help. Ted Cruz or Marco Rubio could've won but they split the vote to let Trump win.
On the dem side, a lot of Bernie fans were hopeful for a Hillary indictment because they thought that would automatically give Bernie the nomination. Not true. Had an indictment actually happened, the DNC would've called on Joe Biden to save the day. No way would they rally around Bernie and Joe Biden would've probably won the election.
But it's also worth noting that the insane number of candidates in the primaries didn't help. Ted Cruz or Marco Rubio could've won but they split the vote to let Trump win.
On the dem side, a lot of Bernie fans were hopeful for a Hillary indictment because they thought that would automatically give Bernie the nomination. Not true. Had an indictment actually happened, the DNC would've called on Joe Biden to save the day. No way would they rally around Bernie and Joe Biden would've probably won the election.
I actually don't think Paul Ryan could have won the nomination in this year. If it was just Ryan vs Trump, yes, I think he gets that. But then again, if it was just Cruz vs Trump, or just Rubio vs Trump, I don't think Trump wins. The problem is the GOP ran against itself and ignored Trump.
Hillary is turning out to be a very weak candidate, and while I'm not sure that Cruz could beat her, Ryan or Rubio could.
Biden would win this thing in a cakewalk if he could get nominated. And he couldn't.
Mosh - I don't think Biden would be called in to save the day. I'd lean more towards someone like a Cory Booker or Julian Castro type.
Hillary is turning out to be a very weak candidate, and while I'm not sure that Cruz could beat her, Ryan or Rubio could.
Biden would win this thing in a cakewalk if he could get nominated. And he couldn't.
Mosh - I don't think Biden would be called in to save the day. I'd lean more towards someone like a Cory Booker or Julian Castro type.
bearfan
Ancient Mariner
I think so ... easily. the only thing Hillary and Trump have going for them is that they are each running against about the only person they can beat. This is easily the worse pairing of candidates in my lifetime. Probablyin the history of the US. Usually at least one of the parties nominates someone good even if you disagree with their politics, you can appreciate they are a good candidate
Warren G. Harding vs James Cox in 1920 was a pretty bad one. So was Rutherford B. Hayes vs. Samuel Tilden in 1876.
Yes, that's why I mentioned the number of candidates. If the question is who wins in a general election, I think Paul Ryan could defeat Hillary. If you placed him in the primaries, he faces the same problem as Rubio and Cruz, though I think he would still do better. You're right though, nobody took Trump seriously.
At least we agree that the party wouldn't rally around Bernie. I can't see them going for a relative unknown this late in the game when Trump has already made traction. Obama is relatively popular and the VP has become a more influential position since Dick Cheney.
Cruz, depends on the sort of campaign he runs. If he tried to run as Pastor of The United States, it wouldn't happen. On the other hand, he is a very smart guy and would probably know how to present himself to a general election audience. Similar to how Hillary drifted a bit left in the primaries and is now going back toward the center for the general.
The big thing about Hillary Clinton is that she is goddamn smart. I think Paul Ryan would have a challenge overcoming the Democrats electoral college advantage. I think he could do it, but I would bet against him.
One thing that the DNC is showing is that Bernie isn't popular because he was Bernie. He was popular because there's a hyper-liberal (for the US) group of people growing up and becoming politically aware. He was a figurehead.
Biden is pretty popular on his own, and he has tonnes of sympathy from when Beau died. Man, that broke my heart.
One thing that the DNC is showing is that Bernie isn't popular because he was Bernie. He was popular because there's a hyper-liberal (for the US) group of people growing up and becoming politically aware. He was a figurehead.
bearfan
Ancient Mariner
Hillary is smart as is Ryan. But, I think Ryan would kill her. Hillary has the same disapproval rating as Trump The race is tied ... against Trump.
She i's a pretty horrible candidate that just keeps shooting herself in the foot. She should be well ahead of Trump, she is not mainly because about 2/3rd of the electorate finds her untrustworthy. That is of her own doing
She i's a pretty horrible candidate that just keeps shooting herself in the foot. She should be well ahead of Trump, she is not mainly because about 2/3rd of the electorate finds her untrustworthy. That is of her own doing
Let's wait to see what happens after the DNC. Right now is the best time for Trump.
Happens.
I reckon Hillary will come out looking better after the DNC. It also helps that she has the two most popular living presidents campaigning for her. Trump can't even get support from either Bush.
I think Bernie's run wasn't a serious bid for president as much as it was an attempt at getting his ideas to a wider audience. He was successful and if the DNC wants to stay relevant they are eventually going to have to address his base. The bernie or busters are obnoxious and IMO aren't true progressives.
I think Bernie's run wasn't a serious bid for president as much as it was an attempt at getting his ideas to a wider audience. He was successful and if the DNC wants to stay relevant they are eventually going to have to address his base. The bernie or busters are obnoxious and IMO aren't true progressives.
bearfan
Ancient Mariner
Sure, she will get some kind of bump .. .but she should not really need one. She should be up by 10+ I also would not count out her shooting herself in the foot a few more times before this is over. Do not underestimate the untrustworthy/liar factor, it is hard to sell yourself to people if they do not believe a word you say. Add to that, she has been in the public political eye for so long that she would have a tough time re-selling herself.
Drew Carey said it best just yesterday
As for why Carey supports Johnson, he said, "I don't need a national daddy, or mommy." Like Johnson, Carey would not say which of the two major candidates he believes would be worse for the country. Asked who the "lesser of two evils" is between Clinton and Trump, he replied, simply, "Gary Johnson." And he has no concerns about the Libertarian candidate potentially stealing votes away from Hillary Clinton and inadvertently delivering the election to Donald Trump, as some polls have shown.
"I don't give a fuck," Carey says, bluntly. "If your person doesn't get enough votes, you lose. I don't want to hear it. There are more than two choices and you are allowed to vote for whoever you want. This is America. If you can't get the votes to win, tough shit."
I wholeheartedly agree. She does have a bevy of far more popular surrogates surrounding her, though. If anything can do it, that can. The Obamas, Bill, Elizabeth Warren, etc can do that. Whether or not it will work it will depend on how many unforced errors Hillary makes - and it will depend a lot on what Trump does too. If Trump does something like insult her for being a woman at a debate, that will really hurt him, for example.
Maybe it's because I come from a Parliamentary system, but I think this is bullshit. When you are deciding on who to vote for, you can also decide on who to vote against. And my reason to vote against someone is just as valid as Carey's choice to vote for someone. He's right, you have to get the votes, but dismissing the concept that voting for a helpless candidate is assisting a far more vulgar candidate...that's silly and it's not very clever, either. It's just as valid.
Albie
Keeping an open eye on the Weeping Angels.
I had no idea who Drew Carey was, until now, but I like that comment from him. Especially this bit:
"I don't need a national daddy, or mommy."